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America – The Grim Truth

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by madmonkey37, Jun 5, 2010.

  1. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    Meaning I read the entire tract and have rarely experienced such a complete exercise in taking disparate facts and adding personal bias, along with deliberate exaggeration presented as "facts," glynch. This would have been far more credible had he done a better job of hiding his bias and his obvious attempt at a hit job on the States. Oddly enough, I agree with a lot of the facts hidden in the emotion driven angst churned out by the fellow, but he insures that the majority of readers won't take it seriously, assuming they read the whole thing. A pity. He could have made a reasonable case re the United States not being "great" in everything one could possibly imagine, which some would have us believe. I've traveled extensively, literally around the world, and have talked to many people from several of the countries mentioned, frequently as a guest relaxing in their flat, and more than once heard the astonishment when they were told how little time off Americans get, as an example. The more heard about the realities of being an American, versus the romantic notions often taken for granted about our country overseas, the less envy they feel. Get outside of the developed world, and America is an Eden, just out of reach, and deservedly so. Our lower classes are rich in comparison, our government free and open, our standard of living very, very high, our medical care simply a dream. Perspective is everything.

    I've been out of town for a week and made that post on my iPhone, which is a pain, or I would have responded more fully at the time.
     
    1 person likes this.
  2. Red Chocolate

    Red Chocolate Contributing Member

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    *rofl*. Science is the most easily manipulated field of study, especially cognitive science and neuroscience, people seriously just make **** up. Kids act up in class because they're BORED, not because they're insane.

    In 20 years, having a kid will probably be a psychological disease. Stress from working a crappy job will be a disease. More meds, more $! For your health, folks!

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shift_work_sleep_disorder

    What a joke, and [nearly] everyone believes it, somehow..
     
  3. right1

    right1 Member

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    Lance Freeman is an Assistant Professor in the Urban Planning program at Columbia University in New York City where he teaches courses on housing policy and research methods. He has also taught in the School of Urban Affairs and Public Policy at the University of Delaware. Prior to this, Dr. Freeman worked as a researcher at Mathematica Policy Research, a leading social policy research firm in Washington D.C. Dr. Freeman holds a Masters degree and a Ph.D. in City and Regional Planning from the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill.
     
  4. glynch

    glynch Contributing Member

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    I don't doubt that they are repeating the effective urban myth about many Vietnam Vets being spit on. Research I have read says it was a muth to say this happened more than once or twice, if at all.

    Given my age I have probably talked to many more Viet Nam Vets than you. They were by friends and roommates when I was younger and are people who I still interact with socially.
     
  5. right1

    right1 Member

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  6. Bandwagoner

    Bandwagoner Contributing Member

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    I guess you didn't travel much to Korea. although different occupations have a much larger influence on how much time you get off. I bet our teachers do pretty well in that area.
     
  7. B-Bob

    B-Bob "94-year-old self-described dreamer"

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    Are you seriously comparing us to DPRK to make our vacation stats look better? And then taking a dig at teachers?
     
  8. Bandwagoner

    Bandwagoner Contributing Member

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    Wait so taking vacation is a good and bad thing when it works for you?

    I am taking a dig when I point out they get vacation but it is a bad thing that americans don't get much. You guys are mint. Awesome.
     
  9. B-Bob

    B-Bob "94-year-old self-described dreamer"

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    What? Nevermind, we're not communicating at all. Still have no idea what you meant.
     
  10. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Contributing Member

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    Our country could be better, but the grass is always greener.

    A lot of the problems here can be boiled down to culture. We're wedded to the ideal that money brings prestige and that's reflected upon the things we buy and whom we surround ourselves. We don't have to buy a new or luxurious car, but we do because we have standards we're accustomed to. How and what we eat are different as well. Finding a job that doesn't push 60 hours a week is easy. If it doesn't pay as well as you're accustomed to, I wouldn't call you a slave for choosing the latter, but I would consider you entitled if you demanded the salary of the latter without working for it.

    Instead of blaming the systems in place for causing our nations problems, we have to be mindful that how those systems came about in order to deliver what we and past Americans wanted...faster, better, and cheaper.

    It's that inertia that maintains the system, which has done a remarkable job, but has now become in danger because we're wedded to it out of blind faith and our past laurels that were accomplished more out of hard work and sacrifice rather than blind faith and cut corners..

    This style of living is by no means sustainable and from 2008, we are seeing a new emerging world order. There's many aspects to that article I can agree to, but what's underestimated is our cultural drive to fix and improve things and also our willingness to reinvent ourselves. The writer missed an opportunity by ignoring that, and served more to alienate and patronize Americans than to help sound an alarm to rally and unify. He makes himself sound like a pompous elitist douche who's heaping pity on those rube rednecks who wouldn't know any better if the truth hit them with a truck.

    If that's the case, your comments are noted, and don't let the door hit your ass on your way out.
     
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  11. Shroopy2

    Shroopy2 Contributing Member

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    I believe the science. I believe there are valid conditions treatable with drugs. I believe there are chemicals in the brain that can can treated.

    What I DON'T like is the consumer/supplier/regulator relationship. First, we put too much RELIANCE and TRUST into these people and don't think critically for ourselves. Microwave quick fix mentality. We already have plenty snake oil salesman and quack medicine. With lax regulation to make that almighty dollar and to hold power, they'll go BEYOND the people that REALLY NEED the drugs. They'll sell to that secondary market of fringe users.

    And out of the belief that we can solve EVERYTHING, we'll live off the drugs to keep us from being sad and sick. Total synthetic existence. People too afraid to tough out real life. You know whats eternal, ever existing and doesnt have feelings? A rock. We're breaking down our compounds and chemical makeup to where we're just living rocks. Its legit science really, but that doesnt mean they'll carry it out legitimately. We're saying the same thing, just with a different starting point.

    Basically if thats the type of place America becomes, if I'm still alive I'd definitely move out.
     
    #91 Shroopy2, Jun 7, 2010
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2010
  12. tomjc

    tomjc Member

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    ...QED.
     
  13. rhadamanthus

    rhadamanthus Contributing Member

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    I iwsh I could rep you for this. The author is spot-on in a lot of his critique, but he never analyzes the potential for solution, or the cultural positives that can (hopefully) balance out the negatives.
     
  14. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Contributing Member
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    Norway and Lux have very small populations and that helps them immensely. Do you know how small Lux is? Do you realize how sparsely populated Norway is?

    PPP is a measure of productivity and the U.S. is over 40% higher than Germany. As for Cherry - picked stats, these 3 are considered the main measures.

    Not exports. That's a cherry picked and meaningless stack. Let me expose to you how little you know.

    1. The U.S. props up German exports more than Germany props up the u.s. Why? Because the U.S. has a tremendously bigger market due to it's larger population and greater per capita purchasing power!

    2. The U.S. export numbers are very deceiving. U.S. companies do not manufacture goods in the U.S. for export, they build them mostly in the region where they are sold. German companies on the other hand, actually build most of their goods in German and then export them.

    Just goes to show how you really don't know what's up - maybe you belong in Germany after all :grin:
     
  15. rhadamanthus

    rhadamanthus Contributing Member

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    Especially true since the vast majority of our "exports" are weapons.
     
  16. pippendagimp

    pippendagimp Member

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    Your drivel is not even worth making pointed replies to, since you will just ignore these pointed replies anyways - as is your nature and custom. First you claim that German productivity "lags far behind the US." Then when you're called out on this lie you claim that in fact PPP is a better measure of German productivity than the actual German productivity numbers are!

    "German export #'s don't count because Americans are buying more German exports than vice versa" - WTF! :grin:

    No, instead of drudging thru this disgustingly pointless charade and further I would rather simply ask you what you are even doing here. Wasn't your posting supposed to be limited to the GARM? I mean what you did in this forum is clearly not the work of a stable person. And without a doubt you are likely still running the same "experiments" on websites elsewhere, if not still here. A hyena cannot change his spots.

    Tell us NewYorker, did ya get a stiffy everytime you successfully fooled us with a different username in your D&D Master Laboratory?
     
  17. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Contributing Member

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    Well the German economy is reliant upon foreign consumption because their own people don't buy enough wrt what they produce.

    Not really fair to compare our aggregate exports either because we've been focusing on services for the last 25 years.

    Some economists have simplified the current global problem as the inability for the rest of the world to buy stuff while the rich majors that can, won't.

    Americans are encouraged to be pigs. If they didn't, everyone would be hurting. Perverse system, aint it?
     
  18. DrewP

    DrewP Contributing Member

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    this is anecdotal and an endorsement!

    Maybe it's because medication is by far the best treatment!
     
  19. Icehouse

    Icehouse Contributing Member

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    If it sucks so bad then why are so many foreigners still trying to get here?

    I haven't traveled overseas a lot, but the quality of life here sure does seem better than the limited places I have been (Greece and China).
     
  20. Billy Bob

    Billy Bob Member

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    That's because those places are definitely crappier than here. What are the stats for immigrations from other developed countries? I'm asking because I really don't know.
     

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