A healthy Tmac is MUCH better than a healthy Ron Artest. No question about it. Artest is only better as a defender and he is stronger. There are only a handful of guys who can do things with a basketball that Tmac can... guys like Kobe, Lebron, Dwade, Pierce, maybe Roy, Joe Johnson, and Melo. Nobody else is even close as a wing player as far as skill set and versatility goes.
You can add Durant to that list as well. he might be the closest thing to Tmac, because of his height and length.
You keep beating this same horse to death when there isn't a single person on this board who doesn't agree. YES, THE ROCKETS ARE A BETTER TEAM THIS YEAR WITHOUT TRACY MCGRADY. That is obvious. Unanimous. Noone here disagrees, he was absolutely terrible this season and the team is better off with him gone. You then somehow use the results of this year's injured McGrady to feed this bizarre claim that what is true of the present has always been true, and that Artest has always been better than McGrady/McGrady has always been a bad fit, when all evidence points to the contrary. WTF. It's almost as if you think that the mere repetition of this illogical chain of events that you've somehow derived can hammer home your revisionist script of the circumstances and will them into validity.
Uh, huh? Where did I ever say Ron was better than Tmac? I simply said Ron fit in better with a team oriented around Yao, and that maybe if you included Defense there might be a case for Ron. And for the record, I was happy we got Tmac, but have NEVER been happy with a guy who dominates the ball, I prefer a more team oriented approach. I did buy into the logic that you were saying though, that TMac didn't have enough talent around him...that made a lot of sense. And it may be true, but I am not sure that it would make that much difference unless he changes the way he plays the game. I have come to the conclusion (and you clearly have not) that Tmac dominating the ball is not going to win anything...EVER....even if he comes back 100% healthy, he won't win, because he is an inefficient scorer, and his teams are easy to prepare for, because all they have to do is let him get comfortable for 3 and 1/2 quarters making all the decisions, and then BOOM...take the ball out of his hands late, and down goes Frazier, becuase the team has lost it's crutch. Now, if Tmac hits his shots, they win, but...again....he is an INEFFICIENT SCORER.....so he is not capable of hitting them often enough to win, consistently. So, you go ahead, wallow in the past and how much he did for the franchise.....oh, what was it he did again ???? Exactly. DD Please stop saying that I am saying these things. Thanks.
the idiocy on this board has reached mind numbing proportions. forget the obvious fact that he's been hurt this year and there's a distinct difference between his play this year as in previous years, and thus the team's results (how is this not obvious?!??!), but the richest part in this whole exercise is that the team experienced basically THE EXACT SAME RATE OF SUCCESS in years past with a much lesser supporting cast. the selective short term memory here is just too much. it's like "damn we sure sucked in years past with tracy but wow look at us rolling now that he's gone!!111one" when we have almost the same winning percentage as similar stretches in years past, ie the end of 05, end of last year... the absurdity is to the extreme that i can't even think of an analogy that can capture it to its fullest.
Enough. What is absurd is that all you do is passively call people idiots who don't believe what you are shelling out. The bottom line is that you believe Tmac has been good as a Rocket over the course of his career and has led a rag tag bunch of players to as far as humanly possible. Am I warm? Me? I think Tmac has been pretty good as a Rocket, but due to his shortcomings in style of play has underperformed overall. Why do you keep saying everyone is looking back and changing their minds? Do you honestly think people were happy with all these first round choke jobs? Do you not recall people being pissed off at Tracy for dominating the ball BEFORE this year, or is this some new concept that you somehow woke up to recently? Come on man.....this is not new, you just don't agree with that...but calling people on the board idiots, or infering that there is some lunacy because they don't agree with you is silly. There is no idiocy, just a difference of opinion. Sheesh. DD PS. I am going to go no further, because you and I don't see eye to eye, and I honestly respect you as a poster and fan, but we disagree a LOT.
It's hard to keep up with what you have said about any of them as your position has changed like the weather. How does he fit in better with Yao? Based on what? Ron is doing the exact same damn thing that you claim Tracy to always do, except much worse - jacking up contested jumpers and stopping the ball going ISO one on one. The only difference is that he's doing it in the present, we happen to be winning, and you seemingly change your tune every hour. As for Tracy not fitting with Yao, I don't know how you concluded this. Noone has fed Yao better than Tracy over the years. You prefer a team oriented approach yet concede he didn't have talent around him but also say he held back his teams with his unwillingness to play team ball. Huh? You've been all over the place. Relevance? Everyone here agrees he's done and should just retire. I don't care to defend him but I do care to defend good logic and point out absurd inconsistencies when I see them. The guy is a loser for his act this year, but I fail to see how that changes the actual events that transpired in the last four years, unless we're writing our own narrative to fit a preordained conclusion.
DD, you say you prefer a team that doesn't have a player who dominates the ball. well before adelman got here, who would you want to handle the ball? last yr when adelman was here, rafer alston played a big role as ever. scola averaged double figures. landry, a rookie, averaged 9 pts a game. we averaged 97ppg (this year we're averaging 99 pts a game). and last year had more injuries than this year. with talent, tracy has proven he will play whatever role is needed. with tracy's injury this year, and with his frustration, he really went about it the wrong way that really messed up the chemistry/rotation of the team. but that's THIS YEAR. the tracy of previous years on this current team would elevate, there's no doubt about it. there's a reason morey and alexander put up with tracy b/c they knew if there's just a slim chance he could get healthy this year, he'll help us.
When? I don't recall any serious conversation of Tracy dominating the ball before this year, when he has flat out sucked and became an easy target. The only thing remotely pertaining to ball hogging and Tracy has been a "damn, maybe if the likes of Luther Head and David Wesley didn't suck so bad, Tracy wouldn't have to carry so much of the offense."
Blatant reactionary revisionism isn't a difference of opinion. Difference of opinion is: who is better, AB or Lowry? Could Landry start for other teams? Should Yao be in the high post? Should JVG wear a tupee? Arguing that Tracy McGady somehow held this team back in years past is what it is - sheer lunacy; revisionism at its height to justify the agenda of the current day.
i remember people saying we need to bring in more help so tracy doesn't have to do as much b/c he's being "asked to do too much." i remember people clamoring for the organization to get a 3rd scoring option. tracy's ballhogging or whatever was never much of a conversation until late last yr when he was out with injuries and there was talk he would be traded and that was a good topic starter. the years before, it was tracy did too much for the team. we gotta give him "help"
If you honestly think Ron is doing the exact same thing as Tracy then we are never going to agree. I do see Ron doing some of it, but Ron doesn't get to initiate the offense every possession like Tmac. Ron plays much more within the team concept far more often than Tracy...Ron does not make all the decision as Tracy did, or not nearly the same percentage, it is not really even close to the same.....honestly. Frankly I am surprised that you think Ron and Tracy play alike, it says a lot about how you view the game differently than I. Again, that is not looking at the big picture, it is NOT about FEEDING Yao, it is about the team beings successful based upon the opportunities Yao creates by drawing so much attention, it is a much different thing than just being able to pass the ball to Yao for a bucket.....it is about TEAM success versus 2 individuals... Again, you and I are not even close to the same views on the basketball games. I am looking at it much differently than you. No, read again, I conceded that I thought what you said made sense that he didn't have enough talent, and thus figured he needed more help, when in reality, I believe he was part of the problem. Logic? Yes, that would be great if we were actually watching the game the same way, with the same view on how successful teams and games are won. The bottom line is you believe in the Superstar approach, and I believe in the team approach.....it is a totally different way of looking at it..... And in all honesty, either one can work....there have been many instances of both working, but for YOURS to work, we have to have a Superstar....and to me, neither Yao, nor TMac, nor Artest for that matter are it. So you have to play as a team and win together... We just see a different ball game Cabbage....we watch the same game, and see a totally different view. No worries though, you think you see it right, I do too...at the end of the day, it is all a matter of opinion. DD
cosign. people can be disapointed with tmac but a year ago nobody had these complaints wen we rolling wit him at the helm
No one is arguing he held the team back, just that his style is not conducive to winning in the playoffs..... We have 11 years of data for that, now don't we? It is one of the reasons I hated JVG...and wanted him gone...... Let me ask you people a question, do you honestly think Tmac elevated the play of his teamates? DD
