ClutchFans Game Thread: Nuggets @ Rockets 11/24/2007

Sigh, I was making a point and that was why compare players even if that wasn't the main point of your conversation.

 

There is no doubt that Adelman is ruining Yao. He was on the way to being a dominant player but now Adelman is taking it away from him. Adelman said that his vision of Yao is as Vlade Divac. What kind of complete garbage is that? It makes me want to come down to Houston right now and rip his head off.

Yao was fine with being a complementary player in 2004-2005 and look where that got us. We lost in the first round. Yao needs to be demanding his touches in the post. I know he did that after the Dallas game when he complained that the team was unable to feed him in the post.

I want to see Yao succeed and I want to see the Rockets win. If Adelman keeps up his garbage I will see neither. Therefore I am infuriated.

 

We compared TMAC and KOBE when kobe was brought in the topic by another guy. Obviously, TMAC is not as good as Kobe in some aspects. We were talking about if TMAC can score as many as he wants to. For that question, I said no and the other guy said yes and brought Kobe in the topic. Then I said TMAC didn't do this and didn't do that, how could he score as many as he wants (as Kobe does, I may suggest). The whole point is if he cannot score as many as he wants, he should do the assists when his shots are falling off ( and as I may suggest, he doesn't want to attack the rim either). Nobody was talking about who should shoot more or shoot less or anything about stats. Certainly, the other guys thinks differently and insists TMAC should be a pure scorer and that's the best to team. A legitimate question and a legitimate debate. What did you do in the mess you made?

 

Well, I wish I could talk you into it, but this is America and you have the right and freedom to think like that. I hope in the end you will appreciate the way Yao develops when we win the title(s). Yao will play a longer career in RA's system. Isn't that good to a Yao fan like you? Which one is better: a short monster career or a long productive excellent career of Yao?

 

We will NOT win a round in the playoffs if Yao is a complementary player to McGrady like in 2004-2005 and not a co-first option like in 2006-2007. You can write that down now. We have seen this combination before in 2004-2005 with a better McGrady and it didn't work then. Back then we even played stifling defense under JVG and somehow got Ryan Bowen to contain Dirk for 3 games.

We might win a championship with a dominant Yao, a great McGrady on the perimeter, and a solid supporting cast. With a great McGrady, a middling Yao content to be a complementary player, and a solid supporting cast... we are not making it out of the first round. I am seeing 2004-2005 again. This time Yao himself is not to blame, Adelman is to blame.

If Yao has a short monster career he has a good chance of winning a championship with McGrady. If November/December last year was his peak and 22/10 is what is to be expected through his "prime".... he won't win jack squat and will go down as an underachiever. I had a taste of what he can do and I don't want to lose it, especially since it means we won't win.

 

You have a good point. Let's wait a while and see how this RA system works out. We got a new coach and you got to give the guy a chance to prove himself. It's not like either we win all the way this season or we will never win a title. In some games, you should play down low more, but in some other games, yao may contribute better by playing more high posts. It is a privilege to have a big man who can do both. By the way, what's your idea of beating Utah in the playoff? We can't always expect TMAC to have 47 pts with a excellent fg% against Utah. We may play Utah again in the coming season. What's your idea?

 

We shall see how it works out. At the end of the day I have to remember that I am a fan and have no vested interest in these games (I don't have money down on the Rox winning the 'ship or anything like that).

How to beat Utah? They will forever be a bad matchup for us because of Boozer and Okur; if Okur drags Yao out to the three point line that means we have no defense against the cutters into the lane that Utah always sends, especially physical guys like Harpring. But Yao has lots of problems guarding Boozer so that is not good either. Add that to the fact that AK-47 is back mostly to his old self this season and Ronnie Brewer has emerged as a legitimate option at SG, and the Jazz are even better than before.

My solution on defense is to switch Yao and Hayes around, and employ a zone in spurts. Of course this is much easier said than done and requires a lot of coaching so the defense properly communicates. The Jazz are not a very good perimeter shooting team so zone especially in spurts gives them fits.

On offense... one of Yao or McGrady, probably both, must establish themselves as dominant options, this did not happen for either last year. The Jazz will single cover both and smother the role players and this is why the role players sucked so much against Utah. Yao just has to beat Okur. There's no way around that. He did put up 35/16/4 against him in April so it is definitely possible. McGrady has to fight through the hacks and bumps and keep driving. None of Utah's defenders should be able to guard him. If they can do that things will open up for the role players.

 

Ive never doubted the talent the rockets have except for Rafer. One of the main reasons we lost 6 in a row was lack of heart and desire. What i don't understand is why did it take 6 losing games for t-mac, players and coaches to have a meeting amongst themselves? They should've talked after losing 3 in a row!! Our chances of advancing mainly depends on the heart of our players, especially our stars!!

 

It's very simple really. Last few games, we were playing Van Gundy offense (tmac+yao) without Van Gundy defense. Today, they stepped up on defense and used more motion on offense. Still needs improvement but a great win regardless.

 

This game glaringly demonstrated that Steve and Luis should be starting over Rafer and Chuck.

Steve and Luis is both get under 20 minutes a game, and in those small alotments impact games more than Chuck or Rafer. We have to have additional scoring options besides Yao and TMac.

Luis's battling is what I love the most. The guy goes to war. Chuck is too polite.

Steve's scoring and rebounding is so superior to Rafer, it makes me laugh to to think what a poonani Rick Adelman is.

 

we are not gonna win a championship if yao is the bona fide no. 1 option, it has to be a combination of yao and tmac. yao has been ineffective alot of ways and it is not due to RA, other teams have fronted him alot, which has been noted that it has been a problem for yao, or teams have played alot of small ball. yao is alot of times been a mismatch when he's playing defense against 4 or 5's that can dribble and shoot from outside such as carlos boozer, even worse, he was getting done in by brandon bass in the dallas game. for most of the league this is not a problem, but when playing the west's elite - amare, duncan, boozer, bass (lol), this is a problem for yao. i do not have a problem with RA playing yao at the elbow since it give yao a slight breather agaisnt pushing other 250 pound centers from the low block for position. its no secret why yao is a little more fresh this year, he doesnt constantly have to be down there on every possession which is alot more tiring than running the floor if any of you guys have ever played organized ball. i dont understand the crap where people dont think he can play from the elbow also, when he first came in the league he couldnt play down low, well with a little practice, he seems to be fine down low. the problem with yao, and this applies to being on the blocks and at the elbow is that he always wants to put the ball on the floor which is how he normally racks up this TO's. of all the great bigs past and present, you have to be able to have an outside game (shaq not included - exception) hakeem was popping J's all over the court and duncan suffered the most when he lost confidence in his bank shot the year when the mavs made it to the finals. for all the good things that we give credit JVG for yao's post game, it is also an equal detriment that other parts of yao's game was not developed at the same time. at the end, it should be a combination of yao and tmac as being our no.1 option but it should never be put in stone that yao is, the answer is, it depends.

 

just to clarify...van gundy's offensive numbers last year were superior to the teams' offensive numbers this year. in whatever offense you run, the players must play efficient,y

 

can't agree with you more.

 

True, but we haven't played all the crap teams yet to inflate those numbers.

See where we are at the end of the year.

DD

 

Any torrent site or link to this game?

Thanks

 

If you listen to Adelman they stuck with it because they thought it was working better. It makes sense. Anytime you try to implement a new offense it takes time. It sounds like Adelman wasn't ready to lose so many games while trying to develop the team so he went back to what he thought would get them through the slump. Add that with the fact that Tmac was out and they had to go to Yao more in the low post. They just naturally went back to what they knew more. When Tmac came back they continued the old offense even more. The little they tried to move away from that proved unsuccessful or even worst. So naturally that started running what seemed to work better and where effective in the middle of games but seemed to get blownout towards the end.

 

No. Sorry. Yao has been a soft ass since he came into the league. last year's playoff performance said enough.

Adelman is a great coach. His win ratio is higher than JVG. You are not someone who's qualified to critique him.

Do you realize many times it's softie Yao who chooses not to attack rather than Ad's plan?

And scream as you can on a BBS, no one in the real world would care a fig about what you say. Post a million "Give the ball to Yao, let him take all the shots no matter the Rockets lose or win" threads on this BBS, it's not going to have any effect. Understand? Why are you still here sprouting sh*t 24/7?

 

Some are never happy around here. The Rockets just broke a 6 game losing streak with a 30 pt. blow out, Yao and T-mac are all stars at their positions, the the team played as a unit and played damn well. The bench is deep and Steve showed he still has plenty left in the tank and is happy to be home. Yao and T-mac just need a little help and someone to take some of the pressure off them. New year, new coach, we have Steve, Bonzi, Scola, James, Brooks, Head off the bench (at this point anyways). But some are still going on about the same stale topics like Yao and T-mac are soft. Old Just Plain Old!! With a 6 game losing streak snapped, Steve showing he is the one that will help put us over the hump, I'm pumped! It's Time for Adelman and these Rockets to turn this ship around and show that YES! The Rockets will be there when it really counts the most!! Go Rockets!!! It's Time!!!

 

Like what you said here. Hope Rick Adelman gets over his arrogant poonani stage now.

That being said, Im very happy with this win. Shows that we do HAVE the talent to blow teams out and ride to a stress free victory. I hope RA has learned his lesson and will not go back to playing the rotation that got us to 6-7. Steve, Luis and Bonzi all need to start in my opinion. When Bonzi gets back, and if RA ever tries this starting lineup, we will all see that we can contend for the championship THIS year!