It's detrimental when your PG and your coach gets injured. He averaged like 19 and 7 during Nash's absence so yes there is some evidence that Nash helps. Nash helped him take 'The Leap' that much is given but he was no slouch before Nash. He averaged 20 and 9 last year playing only 55 games. If he was a case of "man he was and will be nothing without Nash" then sure. But he WAS something and WILL be something better with Nash. Did he give Nash all that money? Can't fault a guy just because he has a great PG. If you want to talk about a guy that was and will be nothing without his PG, go look in Jersey.
More importantly, take a look at the difference between his rookie season and this season, especially this playoffs. It is like day and night. I can't believe how huge an improvement he has made since then. You can feel he finally gets it during the playoffs, and he will only get better from here. Did Yao make any improvement? Sure he did. Only mildly. Some of his game even retrogressed, like his midrange jumper, passing, etc. (I blamed it on JVG by the way) I will just stop right here. It gets more frustrating.
If I were them, I'd hire a coach that knows what the hell he's doing. But I've beaten this horse to death.....
I'm just talking about the whole Yao vs. Amare dynamic. That despite the fact that Amare is playing like a beast, we shouldn't feel bad for drafting Yao. But I guess I don't need to tell you that.
The guy hit all kinds of jumpers tonight and has the entire season, Yao didn't this past season, but ok. The attention the Nash AND Amare focused offense got everyone open looks, and by everyone I mean everyone, even Amare and Nash. Nash was the MVP of that team and the NBA, but Amare was not who he was this season only because of Nash. Amare worked his ass off this past offseason and loves to hear people tell him how much his game has improved because of the work he put into it, not simply because of Nash. 1st round - Phoenix proved they are for real. 2nd round - Nash proved he deserved the MVP. 3rd round - Amare proved he can become the MVP. It don't really matter though, we're talking about the two best young post players in the league hopefully the Rockets still end up having the best one.
And like I was saying, even if we didn't get the best one, if Yao and T-mac gain some chemistry and bring home a title or two, then it's all good.
Boy, what a tired ass argument! So let me ask you this: did Nash make Dirk? Did Dirk's game "collapse" without Nash around? Do you understand that MOST of Nash's assists are because of his passes to the open man for a jumper? Do you know that if Nash was responsible for everyone of Amare's shot attempts made then he would have averaged near 20 assists a game in this series? Go watch the game again, and you will see that Nash is not even involved in half the passes Amare gets. What a tired azz arguement Oh, and BTW, you don't need a post-up game when you can facialize every player in the league. It is much more effecient and higher % shot to just dunk it. Oh, and BTW, Wade wouldn't be worth **** if Shaq didn't make him either, right? Oh, and I don't know if it was you or someone else who said Dirk and KG are better offensive players than Amare, but that had to be a joke, right? KG and Dirk?!! Yah, sure! As I said before, I would ONLY take Duncan over Amare as a big man on the Rockets, because he is the absolute complete package as far as big men go. That is even after I manage in the age difference. I believe I can win more rings with an older Duncan than I would with Amare. In this case, it is quality over quantity
Shaq once said to this extent about Zo. "I've been following that guy since I was drafted 1 and he was drafted 2. It's only natural my contract has to be bigger than his. If he's BMW, I'm Mercedes Benz." Amare's been playing good at center, but he's undersized and not in his natural position. Yao's deficiencies will improve through experience. Amare would have to work out like Karla to maintain that freakish athleticism. I'm putting my money on Yao.
Yo, idiato, here are some of the things I have said about Amare BEFORE they ever played the Spurs, I don't jump anyone's "jock" because of a good game or a good series, I am talking potential here: Or how abou this post on 5-14-2005? So again, just some recent comments I made about Amare, all before the Spurs series. Amare was an all-star caliber player during the season, but now he has raised his status to a bonafide superstar. But again, there is just no one in the league like Duncan.
I think that's a fair statement, although I think with Amare being young he has lots of years ahead of him before age slows him down. His prime is going to be longer than most players in the league. On the other hand, Amare is undoubtedly playing out of position, and while D'Antoni thinks that this gives him an advantage over other teams, it has been proven that it doesn't against the traditional teams with dominant inside players. Amare needs to move back to PF and they need to acquire a cheap, but effective, defensive Center to man up against the likes of Yao, Shaq, and others. I would be surprised if Amare starts at the 5 next season, they will probably let J. Johnson go and try to get a semi-decent defensive Center.
Put it this way... Yao is a better center ... Amare is a better PF .... .... bottom line, and i hate to admit it, Amare is q better player than yao at the moment in both their young career.... and amare done it without even playing 100% defense... hope yao watch this spurs/suns series to inspire his performance rather than playing video games...
I called Amare before the draft, and actually wanted him before we ended up with the #1 pick. But as good as Amare is, his strengths are magnified with Nash/the running style of the Suns. Here's my case: Open Court Amare excels in the open court, because of his speed and athleticism, Steve Nash is the ultimate open court pg at this point. Everyone knows this. Half Court Amare's athleticism helps him get himself into good spots in the half court offense, but it takes the right pg, once again Nash, to find him when he gets there. When he gets it where he wants it, it is hard to stop him. However, what about when Nash/full court style is out? Well the question here is, will it ever leave? If Nash was say, 3 years younger, I could see this whole system working out even to a championship, but he's not. It's like taking Stockton away from Malone (I hate that comparison) but even though Malone sucks(okay so he was average) he sucks even more w/o Stockton. With Amare, his half-court offense would still be good w/o Nash, but it wouldn't be on par with this year, probably more like last years. That isn't to say that you could switch Yao and Amare and have equal success. Actually, both players would likely suffer in their switched roles. Amare may be more comfortable offensively in Houston than Yao in Phoenix (thinking of Yao in a running offense makes me shudder), but the loss of Yao's 7'6" defense would change things. We should think back to how our D was before Yao, it is really easy to take him for granted because he can still do much more. Amare's Jumper has gotten better, and makes him into more of a real player. However, what franchise big man doesn't have a true repetoire of offensive moves? Jermaine O'Neal, Tim Duncan, Kevin Garnet, Dirk Nowitzki, etc. all have an inside-out attack. If Amare becomes a focus of the defense, I don't see him ever being better than these guys, unless he uses his athleticism to a Hakeem-esque skill level. Amare is a franchise big-man at this point, and with the natural learning curve and inevitable decline of Nash, I see him doing better initially, dropping with Nash, and tapering off at a level below even his current success.
with all of this being said yao's ceiling is still higher than amare's. it's just that yao is nowhere close to his and thats where all the frusteration stems. yao is still the better "franchise" player (someone youd rather build an expansion team around). yao, despite all of his garbage games, impacts the game based on his size alone. when amare isnt scoring hes nothing. the kemp comparisons are fair but i look at him as an antonio mcdyess pre blown knee. except mcdyess was an ace on defense. how quickly we forget game 2 against the mavericks where yao fouled out the whole dallas front line in the first half.
were you watching the game today? he was just getting the ball and schooling duncan repeatedly. either just draining jumpers on him or driving past him. he had a huge throwdown right on duncan and then had that ridiculous drive, spin, avoid bowen, reverse dunk move that's as good as anything hakeem ever did. he was amazing. and there's little reason to think he can't keep doing it. of course having nash helps just like any player benefits from other good players but amare is great on his own. how many dunks and layups did yao get against dallas that were passes from tmac? do we take away his pnr layups from now on or just realize a good pnr takes two unique talents and amare's athleticism makes it work as much as nash's passing just like yao's hugeness and mobility for his size make it work just as much as tmac's speed and athleticism. hakeem was #2 in his generation. jordan, then hakeem, no one in between. unless you meant all time from wilt and russell up through now.
Did you guys even watch the game tonight? Amare made outside jumper after jumper. He also scored on iso plays at the top of the key blowing past Duncan for the score. If I had to put money on next year's MVP, it's Amare. Amare reminds me of a young Shaq minus the sheer power. Of course he'll never develop into a Shaq but he's for real and every team in the West will have to go through Duncan and Stoudamire for years to come.
I dont know if anyone mentioned this yet I skimmed through these but I think the number one thing when comparing phoniex (or phoniex players) to any other team is that you have to consider the fact that they play an entirely different game then the majority of teams in the league. They play at such a high pace that when considering the tempo the players numbers can be misleading. Amare's number one advantage over most players is his athletism, and that mostly being his speed and the fact he plays out of position. Because of this mismatch, he dominates so well. Also (and i know this point was mentioned) he never is double teamed. Yao on the other hand plays under a coach that has his teamed geared more towards a slower tempo so of course Yao's numbers will never look as good as Amare's. Essentially when comparing the two its like comparing peas to carrots (can't believe i used that analogy) Amare is the perfect player for pho. temp and style of play, Yao is perfect for the Rockets style of play. So in the end when questioning the two it will boil down to who has won more rings... and I see the Rockets future teams winning more then future pho teams b/c defense whens championships. Just on a side note... if houston played pho in the semi's Houston would of won the series probably in five just like S.A. tonight b/c no big could contain Yao, not Amare or Hunter... no one... Amare honestly probably would of fouled out in most of the games trying to contain Yao (just like he did in the regular season)
Right now Amare is without a doubt a much better player than Yao. At the very least he can stay on the court for the whole game without tiring at the end, while Yao's output drops dramatically in the 4th. And he's more consistent. Hopefully this summer Yao can work on stamina, avoiding dumb fouls, passing out of the post, and a consistent outside shot. In that order. And Nash makes you better, but he can't make you THAT much better. Put Hunter in Amare's place, and he ain't gonna be no Amare. And besides, we all know Tmac is really running the point in a half court set anyways. Yao just has butterfingers sometimes.
Common guys. Lets not be homers here. Be objective. Amare is head and shoulders above yao right now. Its like shaq and rik smits II. Amare has improved in leaps and bounds while yao has shown just a minimal improvement in his game. Amare is a future mvp, his performance in the playoffs solidified his superstar status while yao at best is an all star. Stop the comparison. Theres no point in comparing the two.
I guess we'll just see next year.... Steve Nash will be a year older, and probably slowing down... Now that Amare has earned more respect around the league, the double teams will now be coming every game next season. I want to see how Amare does when he starts getting the quick double team like Yao does every game. Also , don't forget outside of T-Mac and Yao-we had the OLDEST team in the league, the Suns have a great, athletic young team (besides Nash-an MVP, and J. Jackson) that has really masked some weaknesses Amare has in his game. Yao's weaknesses become glaring when you have old , slow power forwards protecting you then having to guard some guy on the perimeter. (unheard of for a guy his size--how many times does Shaq have to do that ?) Also, they had pretty much the same FG percentage in the regular season, but Amare GETS a LOT of touches. Its great Amare can get 40 pts but he needed 32 fga to get it... How many touches did Yao get when he got his 1st 40 pt game ? Yao has the best field goal percentage of anyone in these playoffs at 65.5 % -imagine if he got the ball more than 9-12 times a game. Hopefully, Yao will have a better supporting cast (especially a decent PF) next year so he can really do his thing on the court. I think both will be great players, I just feel that Amare has had a LOT more advantages that Yao doesn't have -- yet the expectations for Yao are much higher. That's why I thought the Yao bashing was really bad this year- the great expectations that come with being in his 3rd year (and having T-Mac) coupled with getting a much older, and mediocre supporting cast. (Heck-there are people on the Suns bench that will probably be starters for us)
