I am actually very impressed by the fact that he shot around 40% in each of the first 3 quarters. Yes, the numbers also support what you say and that's why I posted them.
For this season Jabari had 95% of his 3s assisted Green had 55% of his 3 assisted. Like how do you ignore such a basic part of a shooting analysis?
Green is going to have to shoot off the dribble and he is expected to do that. I don't buy into your bail out theory and I can't find any statistical thing that supports it. I think it is just you are noticing it when it happens to green but not to others. Here are the stats for that: 0-4 seconds left Green take .9 3 fga per game, FVV takes 1 3pt fga per game. Quite similar. And Green shoots 27.1% on those, which is not a number that would drag his 3pt % significantly down. FVV shoots 21.1% on those, which is quite horrid, yet he shoots 38.7% overall from 3. In terms of fga, Green is 3rd after Sengun and FVV in the last 0-4 sec, despite Sengun taking less shots than green overall.
Because it is not a question of who is better. I am measuring how Green (and Jabari) is performing within the roles they assume. Jabari won't create his 3s and Green will have to create his 3s. That's a fact of life.
You can't have it both ways. You can't say Green is expected to take the more difficult off the dribble threes and then compare him to another player who takes 95% of his threes from assists and say because of those variations in percentages one player has technical issues. You understand that? 1 3 pt attempt out of 7 attempts is statistically significantly. And why are you comparing to Feed? Fred is obviously the better shooter. You are making different claims. You are saying Green"s issue is technical form and basing it off 3pt fg% differences of two players who shoot threes in complexity different ways in terms of shot difficulty.
Think about it as I am evaluating Jabari while evaluating Green too. I am not comparing them. Actually the only reason I included Jabari is because the website had two slots for players so I just added Jabari. I see inconsistency in green across the season, quarters, shooting distance. The only thing that has a explainable pattern is the drop off in the fourth quarter. For the rest there is no reasonable explanation other than 'not shooting well' that I see. You bring up bail outs and the difficulty of off the dribble shots, and I tell you he doesn't take more shots at the end of the clock than the other two main usage guys. And he has to learn to shoot off the dribble. For a 33% shooter who takes 7.4 3pt fga and shoots 27.1% on .9 attempts, it means that he is shooting 34% on the rest of 3 pointers, which is 1% higher than his overall average. And this is if he did not take any shots at all in the last 0-4 which is not realistic. It doesn't have a substantial effect on his numbers. That is the math.
Players who go ultra fast tend to struggle with 3PT consistency/efficiency, especially early in their careers. Jalen is actual more graceful about slowing down for jumpers, but unlike the guys below he takes way too many for his archetype. Ja Morant. De'Aron Fox. Russell Westbrook. John Wall. Ish Smith. Derrick Rose. I don't have any statistical evidence of correlation but it's always struck me that this seems fairly common. Jalen takes something like the 15th most 3PA in the NBA. I think that's just a bad idea and the main contributor to him making only 34% or whatever. He just hasn't been good enough at jumpers to justify taking that many long range shots and making it such a high proportion of his shot diet. That he would be close to league average by reducing his attempts from 7.5 to like 4.5 attempts is actually a testament to his ability to decelerate rapidly and go up and down pretty steadily. None of the guys listed above would dream of making 34% on 7.5 attempts in their first few seasons. I wish Udoka would just tell him to chill, but at the same time he's starting with 1 great shooter, 1 non-shooter and 2 mediocre shooters so someone has to carry that load. If we had, say, Mikal Bridges instead of Dillon Brooks I bet we see Jalen's 3PA go down, while his 3PT% and assists go up. Just a theory. Wonder if anyone else had noticed this potential link between ultra fast players and long range jumpers. Seems to take a lot of patience and repetition for their jumpers to stabilize.
Consistency for Jabari in shooting has more to do with 95% of his attempts are assisted vs 55% for Green. It has do with that not what you said here.
Green is a better natural shooter than Ja, Fox and Westbrook. His form is the most effortless of the group.
Yeah for sure. They're all better passers than him of course, but he probably has the highest defensive ceiling and floor of the group which is arguably more important.
If Jabari can overcome his mental block and stay confident in tight situations, he can be a consistent 40% 3pt shooter.
You keep saying that to deflect criticism of your boy. It doesn't matter how many of Jabari's shots are assisted. It has nothing to do with Jalen. If Jalen isn't good at creating his own 3pt shots and make them, then he should stop doing that so much. Good shot selection is part of being a good shooter. You might feel that you are arguing against the whole world and so you don't notice who actually are supporting Jalen Green. I am one of the posters who have been pushing back the mob hating of Jalen and have been vehemently against trading him when he was struggling.
I am Jalen hopeful as well. And I expect a major improvement over the summer because I think he is coachable and willing to learn. Last two summers were crap with KPJ, making videos of himself for publicity etc. This year he will have a program, a good supporting coaching staff and a contract he has to win.
Stop moving goal posts. I want Green to drop his three point attempts from 7 a game to 4-5. That isn't the point of contention. You said something else. You are making comparison on saying one is bad because of technical form based on a person who did an analysis based on percentages without taking into account what type of shots they take. Please actually understand my premise. I known you aren't a hater. I'm just speaking specifically about this.
I don't consider either of you two "haters" in regards to Green. As a Sengun fan you seem to be one of the more positive Sengun fans when it comes to Green. I acknowledge that.
There are are dudes with far worse forms than Green who have better 3 pt fg% in their career. So I don't think his form is an issue. It's one motion and effortless with a slightly unconventional cross body motion when bringing the ball up for a shot. To me conditioning(playing hard on both ends for the first time and playing all 82 games) and shot selection are the biggest culprits to his low 3 pt%. I agree with most here that he shouldn't take 7 attempts per game from three. That's too much.
3 point % after 0 dribbles Jabari : 38.2% on 4.2 attempts per game Jalen : 32.7% on 3.2 attempts per game Jalens 3 point shooting is actually overall better off the dribble than it is on catch and shoot 3 point % After 1 dribble : 34.0% on 0.7 attempts per game After 2 dribbles : 36.0% on 0.6 attempts per game After 3-6 dribbles : 30.2% on 1.3 attempts per game After 7+ dribbles : 35.7% on 1.6 attempts per game
It is factual that Jabari has better shooting form. I don't think it is even arguable. I was theorizing that the form gave him more consistent result. I didn't even say that Jalen was bad. I said his game was more instinctual rather than technical like Jabari's and that contributed to his inconsistency. Your counter point was that Jalen created more of his shots. I don't think consistency has anything to do with whether a shot is assisted or not. If it's his game, then he should be doing it consistently. I agree that shot creation may lower a guy's FG percentage. But Jalen's problem isn't just having a lower percentage. It's that his percentage swings wildly up and down. My point was that both guys have their weaknesses. Jalen and Jabari are kind of the opposite. Jabari needs to loosen up. Jalen needs to be more methodical in his shooting. I think he has been trying to be more disciplined under Udoka. Let's see if it is sustained next season.
