Would you trade our personnel minus Harden for Raptors personnel minus Kawhi and Lin?

I'm not convinced about this but it's a fair argument, i mean, i think we can agree it's at least a close call. For me it's pretty much like:

Harden = Kawhi
CP3 = Lowry
Gordon = Siakam
Capela < Gasol
PJ > Green

Rivers = VanVleet
Ibaka > Nene
Powell > Green...probably = House

I mean, i can agree with Lowry being a bit better than the last version of Chris, at the same time one can argue Harden is a bit better than Kawhi, that Clint in some match ups is better than Marc...Siakam is probably better than Eric, but by how much? Overall as today i don't think there's that big of a difference in terms of talent, if not that the Raptors have way more of it in the frontcourt, which makes them less predictable and more capable of scoring in multiple ways.

 

I’d trade it all for Siakim probably.

This is as much about type of player as it is about overall quality. At some point - seemingly after Parsons walked - DM decided to go guard heavy and/or with threes and forwards that really couldn’t do much.

Which has been infuriating.

 

CP3 > Lowry
Tucker > Siakam
Gordon > DannyGreen
Capela = Ibaka/Gasol
VanVleet > Rivers
House = Anunoby
Nene > Lin

Again, nobody would have done this trade as recently as a few games ago when it looked like the Bucks would crush the raptors.

 

Don't agree that Gordon=Siakam. And then on top of it all, whether you think some of these players are comparable (like Harden-Kawhi) the fact that their entire roster is good on defense and are simply bigger than our roster is killer.

 

Yes, would have, and you are underrated Siakam. Siakam is a 17-20 point scorer on high efficiency with passing skills and defense. I love Tucker, but he's not a better player than Siakam has become.

 

I don't think it's been by choice. He has wanted forwards, it's just hard to get them. He wanted Durant, Paul George, Jimmy Butler. He wants Green at the deadline this year. Guards are easier to get.

 

Tucker is a better defender and 3pt shooter. Morey basically considers him untouchable.

 

I mean it’s been a number of years now. And other teams have gotten them. Getting the right good players is his job.

 

Blame Daryl Morey. He built the roster. 12 ****ing years. But Masai can do it in one offseason? "The roster sucks! The roster sucks! Harden has no help! Harden has no help!" Who's fault is that?

Blame James Harden. Did you not hear Austin Rivers? James Harden IS the system! Of course they're gonna falter when he goes out. When one guy does everything and everyone else just stands around, the hell do you expect? Kawhi is not the Raptors system. Kawhi (or Lowry) does not dribble dribble dribble for 20 seconds. Raptors don't dribble out 20 seconds of the clock before getting into their sets or before trying to make their move or dribble out 20 seconds of the clock trying to get a preferred matchup.

Austin:

Our playing style, everything is through him. That's what our offense is designed to do. The way we play is for him to do the things he does. That's a very hard thing to do in the playoffs. [...] If you look at our roster vs. theirs with KD out, it's not even close. Their bench is nowhere near the talent we had. Their best players can score without dribbling the ball.

We didn't make the proper adjustments.

You have guys like Chris Paul & Eric Gordon and other guys here waiting trying to we feel like help even more but our system is designed around [him]. Everyone is trying to figure out how do we change this, who do we talk to? It was frustrating.​

Blame stubborn mule D'Antoni. Doesn't coach, doesn't call timeouts, doesn't make adjustments, doesn't use his bench, doesn't rest players. Even though he's the head coach, it's Jeff Bzdelik's, Roy Rogers', John Cho's & Irv Roland's fault he didn't adjust.

 

Well yeah, they have all good defenders, but it's not like we have poor ones aside for Gerald, the only big difference i can see is between Harden and Kawhi which we shouldn't consider for the op question. I mean, Chris, Eric, PJ and Clint are all pretty good defenders.

They're overall bigger, longer and more athletic, i'm mean, that's a fact, but in terms of talent i'm not sure they're better/much better.

I mean, do we think the Rockets would be better with this starting 5 and beat the Warriors:

Gasol
Siakam
Green
Harden
Lowry

...? Tbh i'm not sure, i certainly wouldn't bet on it.

 

And he's 9 years younger than Tucker.

 

CP3 isn't better than Lowry, thats a wash at BEST.
NO WAY Capela equals Gasol and Ibaka. That's just laughable.

 

It wouldn't win with harden going ghost, not moving, turning it over 6 times. That's the problem. People want a team that is so good that it covers up for that and his bad defense. That is very hard when you're best player is doing that.

How about expecting an all star team harden just moved?

 

Voted no for one reason , free agent . Would make trade if Kahwi agreed to atleast 2 yrs

 

Everyone was saying lowry was a playoff choker before this year. Sure helps to have Kawhi
make teammates better.

Ibaka was considered pretty washed a couple years ago. Gasol is playing better but still only averaging 9 ppg. Kawhi is making them look better.

I can imagine the b1tching about how these dudes can't create if they were here

 

these rosters don’t even compare tbh...Toronto is much better

 

@Mathloom well tbf i can also see the Rockets beat the Durantless Warriors with home court, especially with Klay going down for one important game.

What i won't argue is on the bench cause we just don't have a Ibaka kind of player (JaMaychal ), and while Rivers has been really good, Gerald and House choked big time.

But overall i don't know, now everyone obviously jumps on the Raptors being suddenly amazing while everyone was saying for all the season that Harden was better than Kawhi, Paul was still a top 20 player while Lowry was a chocker, Gasol washed etc...so yeah, i'd like to stay in a middle ground here. While i think there's absolutely some truth on the Raptors being very good (to me their superior lenght and athleticism is what really stands out), i also think they're not on another level, the Warriors being far from their best is having a big impact here, no Durant for all the series, Looney and Klay missed games, Iguodala probably not very healty...Boogie came back, but like i expected he's not exactly having a great impact, Klay and Durant's impact are just on another level for their team. With the Warriors more healty i'm not sure we're having this argument right now. I wish Cousins played all the series against us instead of Durant and Klay, Looney.

 

You guys taking Lowry over CP3? Yikes. Tap the brakes on that one.

I really think too many people on this forum are giving up on Chris Paul.

You do have to love the Raptors front line. Siakam, Gasol, Ibaka. Guys that can shoot and be effective on both ends of the court. And long.