Every season is different. I think the Rockets were in a position to beat GS had they been healthy last year. However that Rockets team last year out played their individual talent. They played very hard and motivated for the entire season, they were all on the same page and other than injuries, everything came together for them. The team last year doesn't get enough credit from the players to the coaches to the GM. They got the absolute most out of that group. However, the Rockets front office knew that the group couldn't repeat that same intensity and that the league would have had an entire post season to adjust and break down what the Rockets did. There was bound to be a dip with the entire group coming back. Couple that with Paul being older and Ariza's slip last year and the Rockets were just not going to be a 65 win team. It wasn't going to happen. The league adjusts quickly and the Rockets were not simply out talenting everyone last year like the Warriors were. So here we are, and I agree with you that the Rockets are rolling the dice on increasing the raw talent level and attempting to do so by mortgaging some of the future (draft picks) in an effort to keep as much talent on the roster as possible and add someone like Butler. It is worth a shot but at the end of the day I think they lose Gordon and likely Tucker, with some draft picks going to a third or fourth team to get a replacement for Tucker and possibly another guard.
I also want to point out, that if the Wolves got 4 Firsts, people can cite "Thibs won't be around and Taylor could be dead" before the 2023 and 2025 picks are utilized....well that is not true. Those picks are liquid assets to the Wolves who could turn around and trade them TO ANOTHE TEAM at any time for more recent assets. They have value, to everyone.
Minny out: butler, dieng Minny in: Fournier, knight, Chriss, 2023 and 2025 1st Orlando out: Fournier Orlando in: dieng, 2019 and 2021 1st Houston out: knight, Chriss, 4 future 1sts Houston in: butler Top 4 protection in 2019 Top 5 protection in 2021 Top 6 protection in 2023 Top 7 protection in 2025
well we have to do something...this current squad isn’t gonna do anything of significance Butler could be our best shot at acquiring a 3rd star...CP3 only has so many years left, we can’t waste them
The picks are liquid, and that makes them very valuable. However, remember they would not just be taking on 4 draft picks, they would be taking on two years of Knight and his contract. So there are salary considerations in making a deal with those picks. So hypothetically if the Wolves tried to move some of those picks, the players that they take on would require fitting in under the salary rules. Hell, just Knight's contract is worth at least one first round pick and likely two. That is likely why the Rockets are working on 3-4 team deals so that the Wolves would hypothetically get the players that they want NOW and they can compete with them right away.
This.... and couple it with a coach and front office that are getting a lot of pressure from ownership. There is a lot of money invested in Paul and Harden and the owner expects results.
Yeah, no question. If the Wolves don't want 4 picks, the Rockets need to divert some picks to another team to get the Wolves a player that can be useful to them now. I don't doubt Morey has look high and low for this. But it is going to be tough. One example, you could see if Atlanta wanted to move Bazemore for a 1st (to send to the Wolves). Now, the Hawks "might" consider that, but they might not want to do that until later. So "timing" is an issue.
Timing is an issue, and it is also quite possible that the Wolves want Gordon and Tucker and a draft pick......... and in that scenario you could see the Rockets divert some of the first round draft picks they save to a third team along with Knight, to acquire someone to replace Tucker. There are a lot of things in play. What I find concerning is that my understanding is that the Wolves have not exactly been transparent in what they want.
Keep in mind, all those protections must fully execute in the said years. They can’t convey the following year should the protection allow us to keep the pick. Either the protection says Minny doesn’t receive anything should the pick land within the stated protection, or it’s a swap, or they receive a 2nd rounder from that year, or something.
That appears to be the case. "If the Wolves are going to play this kind of hardball, they owe it to their paying customers and to players on the team more loyal than Butler to be transparent about these trade talks. Because there is justified suspicion that they are coming to the table with unreasonable expectations."
Tom doesn't want to trade Butler, that's what Tom really wants (or doesn't want). They want Ben Simmons(ha). They want Josh Richardson + more. But really, they may want to recoup what they sent out: Markkanen, Dunn & LaVine. Now forget what you may think of the players individually, they probably see 5th pick, 7th pick, 13th pick -- we want 3 premium picks/players! Anything later than 2019, not acceptable!
Spoiler Dan Barreiro: We've got an owner who wants to trade him & feels like they have to trade him. You have a coach who I'm still not convinced is doing the due diligence to come up with the best deal. Thibs security blanket with this owner has been getting Jimmy Butler. The sell wasn't you'll just get Butler, we'll keep him. Deep down, Thibs realizes once he trades Butler, his days may well be numbered. That's how dysfunctional this is. Butler has lost me. He's terrorizing the organization. He's here one day, plays great & then he's sore. No one believes that. No one can say that with a straight face. If it is soreness or not in shape, who's fault was that? He didn't show up at training camp until the end. As a fan, even though Butler helps you win, how do you emotionally invest when you know Butler wants out, he's playing this game where he's decided it's part of his strategy the Wolves don't forget (that I still want out), how do you celebrate a good victory? It's classic Timberwolves. It's 30 years of dysfunction & this is the latest version.
They could use couple of those pick to unload their bad contracts(wiggins/dieng) without using theirs
Yes, exactly and Tom thinks that Butler is worth even more than what he gave up. It is why I think it will take the owner stepping in for anything to happen. Also, games like the one the Wolves played last night only hurt the chances of Butler being dealt because it keeps up Thib's belief that he can convince Butler to stay.
