TheFreak, Discredit Shandon...please. Why not just tell me what you think, and why you think Shandon left. Make a point, rather than looking to tear down someone elses. That is lame. That's your problem. This is a sport. Big boys making big bucks. The guy left Utah for a starter position. The guy looks like he wants out now for more touches and a different system. Maybe he is just negotiating. He is just as diplomatic in his words as the Utah owner was in his. I don't care to believe any of that. I don't need to believe any of that. I am trying to make conversation and expand threads, not win arguments. TheFreak, everything in this world is not a logical courtroom argument. Much more of it is expressing personality. Show me some. I am saying want a far majority of the board believes, and using that in context to make some conversation. Don't you understand that at all. I am not looking to discredit Shandon's whatsoever by saying it is apparent to me that he complained for more minutes, either in his mind or vocally to his coach. who cares. If I am doing anything I'm saying, complaining or not, I believe the guy thinks too much of himself on the offensive end. What do you think TheFreak. The point is having a belief and expressing it to have conversation. And you with the Perry Mason...drill...show me...give me videotape...hard evidence. sheesh
HP- You expressed your... dissatisfaction with his game months ago. It was impressive, actually, you still stuck to your guns when everybody piled on you. But now, this really seems personal. I really don't see where you're getting this "whiner" thing. I would like to see you get some evidence on that; all I see is a Zerlein radio report and another unofficial report from a BBSer with an inside source. To my knowledge, Shandon hasn't told the media after the game "I don't know what to do, I don't know why I'm here" like #33 did. I have seen nothing of him taking this dirty laundry to the press, like Olajuwan did earlier this year. Considering a large percentage of your argument rotates on the "fact" that he's a whiner, I think you need to back that up.
Nolen, Where did I say he was a whiner? My argument is not based on reports, other than generally agreed upon statements, and what he has said. Sure ... he doesn't call himself a complainer. Shandon wants a system that will get him more touches and he wants a starter role, and he definitely will argue with his PG during a game about it and he thinks too much of his offensive game. Don't stick this "I think he is a whiner" label on that, comparing him to Pippen. Sure I gave other threads, recalled the one week of everyone worrying about Shandon, recalled statements from his ex boss. What? TheFreak asked for some history...just to tell me...that's no proof. I don't have an archive of Shandon telling Feigan he needs to tire his opponent down by making him work on the offensive end. That's a diplomatic statement for Shandon, but that is not his call...it is Rudy's and the Point Guard. Proof of what do you need? That heypee is making things up. Look Nolen, if I hear a player wanting more minutes, touches, starters roles, different system...he is second guessing the coach and his point guard. I call that complaining. That does not mean I think he is Pippen. T_Man tried to equate that both Pippen and Shandon to a systemic problem with Rudy. I was comparing the two simply to say that if he thinks they are feeling out of place, well it seems Shandon and Pippen didn't like their place in Utah and Chicago, either. They left without negotiating, didn't they? This is what I get for carrying on 10 different conversations at once. I'm sorry I can't accurately report what context I'm addressing at all times. But nowhere did I say he is a whiner or a Pippen. I think he complains. I take several comments from him to say he wants a different system and to be more involved. Do you really not believe that? Have you not heard him say it. It is not that big of a deal like Pippen...but it is still complaining. And I tolerate complaining from stars more than role players. Why is this personal. Sounds like Shandon is simply untouchable to you.
HP- Went back and read your posts more carefully- I thought you were equating Shandon with #33. My mistake. When you were telling TheFreak to back his points up, I found it ironic because I see little to back up the idea that Shandon complains. Like you say, it's not a big deal type of complaining that #33 used. Agreed. All I know of his complaining is the radio report, an insider report here on the BBS, and I also remember him talking about his role being better if the league goes zone next year. The way you spoke of him, seemed like SA is a whining malcontent to you, and since he doesn't have the game to back up his complaints, might as well pack his bags. Perhaps I read too much into it. He isn't untouchable. If we lose him this summer, it won't break my heart. In fact, it might even help clarify our situation at the 2 and 3. To his credit, he could have gone to the then-champion Spurs, or re-signed with Utah for a lot more money than he's getting now. And last year, that horrible, frustrating, losing year, he still played his ass off night in, night out, even with his small contract. If we do end up having zones next year, I hope we keep him. Not great handles, but he moves without the ball well, defends well, finds the seam, good body control when he goes to the hole, and he has that nice mid-floater. But if he's unhappy, no need for him to stay. That's true. There are others who would be happy to benefit from the future greatness of our backcourt.
Yeah it would increase his importance to the Rockets if he were going to stay with Houston. ------------------ Arkansas' Biggest Rocket Fan!
Thanks for giving me another read, Nolen. And I wanted to also say that I completely agree with you when you say Shandon has excellent body control. The guy is very smooth. Now it is summer time. Time to negotiate. What do we do if Shandon wants more than middle class, and is he even worth that? Think about it, Shandon got screwed by #33, the Dream groin injury, and the Barkley quad. He wanted to go to Houston or Indiana. He wanted to get a few more runs at the title. He really likes the playoffs and playing for a contender. But, we aren't one, now. Shandon never got what he wanted. I don't expect him to negotiate in good faith with us concerning helping us build a winner. I think he wants to contend, now, as he did in his last move. If that is correct, then how do we negotiate with him. Why feel compelled to reward him for playing arguably at an underpaid rate for 2 years, when he likely wants to go to a contender?
