Yao had a monster game and yet still would go as far as to discredit him at the expense of Big Ben, the league leading shot blocker, rebounder and defensive player of the year for the past 2 seasons. Yao had a good game tonight and the best you could come up is oh because Yao is tall and Big Ben is short? Bradley is taller than Yao and it's his 11th season. How come he's still unable have a good game playing against Big Ben or a lesser opponent than Big Ben like a 2nd year foreign player who is still learning to play the American's way? Please someone tells me. Did Tree Rolling, Mark Eaton, Manute, Muresan ever have a 20/20 production in their careers? I wonder what would you say next if Yao had a good game against Shaq? Wait Tree Rollings and Mark Eaton would hold Yao scoreless you said. So how the hell is Yao gonna score against Shaq or did he?
By the way, JBC was also the first pick in the draft when he came out. If Yao starts averaging 25 and 15 then he would be dominant no doubts about it. I just don't think he would do it. Also when I said Eaton and Tree Rollins would hold him scoreless that was a little tongue in cheek. But he would have a hell of a time trying to score on them. I still stand by that. And if you look at my original post, JBC put up decent numbers but he was never a guy that in a big game would just find a way to carry his team to wins. 20/20 was a good game and I take nothing away from him, but it's hardley new or unique. It was a good game. The thing you guys don't understand is everyone in the NBA has talent. The thing that elevates a star to that superstar status is internal. It's a refusal to give up. A refusal to lose. Do you know how many times Dream was so tired he had to hold himself up by the nets during free throw/time outs? Yet still, when it was time to play, he would be out there trying to make every basket, grab every rebound, block every shot. His fingers was so disfigured from being hacked on the hand that he had to tape them together just to make them sturdy. Yet he never complained. He never stopped. And every other team knew as long as he had breath, the Rockets were a threat to win. You can say the same about Magic, Bird, Isaiah, Shaq, Kobe. You either have it or you don't. You don't develop that.
Shaq may not have held him scoreless but he did destroy him. Every likes to remember the block in the first quarter but no one remembers Shaq repeatedly backing him in and dunking on him in the 4th. But then Christmas is coming soon so we will see what happens.
Did you watch the game? I believe Elden Campbell and Okur were matched up against Yao for the majority of the game, not Ben Wallace. I do remember Ben on Yao and vice versa a few times, but it was only for a short part of the game.
Doesn't matter if Yao was on Ben or vice versa. Yao got 20 rebounds and Ben didn't get 1 of those. That's what he is supposed to be great at - getting rebounds no matter whose they are. He didn't. In fact Yao got 9 rebounds less than their team i think!
Juugie, I think Yao would actually be better if he played in the era of guys like Tree Rollins and Mark Eaton. Yao is quicker than a lot of the guys in this era and would definitely be quicker than guys of that era. And to say he'd be held scoreless is absurd. In today's NBA, guys get away with way more fouls and the zone defense has made life much tougher for low post players. In any case, Yao has a long way to go but I'll take the following at this point: Mpg FG% FT% Reb Ast TO Stl Blk Points Yao 34.8 49.3 77.2 9.6 1.9 2.8 0.4 2.7 17.1 Shaq 34.6 54.2 51.9 11.3 2.6 2.9 0.4 2.7 20.1
Stamina? That's the latest bash on Yao? Yao's play has become increasingly stronger this season. His 1st 4 games he was averaging 34 minutes/game. His last 4 are now 41 min/gm. You can't really ask for more than that. But more than just the #s, I haven't seen him sucking wind like he was before. He's playing more minutes and looking better doing it. If he can continue at that level without wearing down, I'd expect many more 20/20 games.
You have a point there. There was no zone back then guys like Tree Rollin, Mark Eaton would have a tough tough time him guarding one on one. To say he would be held scoreless is utterly ridiculous. By the way as of today Yao is officially a double double guy 17.3pts 10.20 rebs and ranks 5th in the league in double-doubles. The only players who have more DDs than him are KG, TD, Dampier and SAR. Not too shabby for a second year player. He virtually improve on every single catagories from last year. And to say he has no determination not working hard to improve on his game is just moronic. It's ok to criticize Yao on the things that he needs to improve so he can be a better player but to consistently discredit degrade him after a good game then put him down like he has no change to become something special for the Rockets is simply pure hating.
Sorry to come late into this argument... I watched JBC with the Warriors and he often unfairly took the brunt of criticism. He was drafted by GSW largely to go up against Kareem (who was the dominant center in the Pacific and NBA). The Warriors had a soft high-post center at the time (Parish) and who was abused by Kareem every game. As a result the Warriors wanted a low-post center... and JBC was the best low-post C in that college draft. JBC pretty much fullfilled the objective of going up against Kareem... he often had his best games against Kareem. Unfortunately he had a fairly low-energy demeaner and fans often thought he was dogging it. Hence the nick name "Joe Barely Cares. That was exagerated one day when one-time coach George Karl got so pissed about a lackadasical effort by JBC that he ripped the door of JBC's locker. That pretty much cemented JBC's rep (despite being a C that consitently put up 20/10 numbers and blocked a pretty decent number of shots). I shy away from player comparisons, especially between eras, but I reckon you could say numbers-wise they can be compared and certainly JBC was a skilled player. Very little else seems similar though (unless JVG one day explodes and rips off a locker door ;-).
Of course. I guess we can also ignore the fact that 19 of Shaq's points were against Cato or that Yao was having problems standing @ the end of the game because he was tired. So you just proved Yao's stamina sucked last year. Congrats.
This thread is really confusing. Yao is great because he just got 20/20 against Ben Wallace the best defender in basketball even if Campbell and Okur matched up with him. Then Yao is great because Rollins and Eaton didn't average Yao's stats but that kind of misses the point which was they would give Yao more trouble defensively, not that they were better players. Then Yao is quicker than a lot of centers in this area (a remarkable feat since he's usually 6-7 inches taller and 50-60 pounds bigger than the power forward he's matching up with any given night, I can't believe he's not averaging 30/15 since he's bigger and quicker). Then it's about Shaq defending Yao, even though Shaq is an extremely lazy defender and wouldn't go after Yao the way a defensive minded Eaton or Rollins would. We've even had a few different Trees being discussed here, Tree Rollings and Tree Collins. I'm so confused...
Juugie, I'm from China and always a Yao-supporter and I respect your opinion. Bird, Jordan, Hakeem were all fierce competitors. Your could virtually see fire burnning in their chest every night. Yao doesn't show us the same thing but we saw flashes last season when he dunked over Rattlif and big Ben. Last night, Murphy went nuts when Yao chest(actually with his belly) bumped MoT after a great play. I shared his feeling. That's the Yao we want to see. However, I'm not saying Yao doesn't have the desire to win. He HAS it but he's trying to hide it. This is largely due to the Chinese culture he carrys -- be modest, peaceful, defer to your team leader (Steve). For some reasons, maybe locker room tension(whose team is this?), maybe his parents' input... yao is reluctant to show the ture self at court. As some people pointed out before, Yao is cocky as hell. If you could read Chinese, you can tell it from his comments at his BBS after every game. If you had chance to watch the Asian Championship game, in which he chased the poor Korean guard shouting, waving arms.. after blocking his 3pt attempt... you'd feel the scary monster inside his 7'6 frame. I believe Yao has the tools dominate the whole NBA (he can dominate 70% of NBA centers right now.) How to release his pride, cockiness, anger and competitiveness out of his modest Chinese shell is the by far the more crucial thing for his development and the Rockets future success.
I have not responded to your non-sense but it has become clear to me that unless Yao dominates another 7"5 310 player, there will ALWAYS be "buts" in your argument. The fact for the rest of league, Yao is bigger than most centers as well as more skilled than the vast majority. That is not his fault. So please give credit where credit is due.
Actually it has more to do witht he changing of the times. The only players I see that's willing to/has put themselves through that today are Shaq and AI. So I don't think Yao will be that much softer than TD, KG and etc. Sure he needs to be more aggressive, but I thought the same about TD. TD improved in that aspect, Yao should and can also.
this Juugie will not be happy unless Yao leaves the Rockets. just say it , be honest. he wants Yao gone and the Rockets back to the playoff blackhole it has been in for the last 5 years. then
Everything has been said...all I have to add is that if each of us looks deep into our hearts, we will find a little love for JBC.
