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The Bev/Lou/Gordon lineup...

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by RudyTBag, Mar 20, 2017.

  1. jogo

    jogo Member

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    I think our defensive success is more dependent on 3 pt% defense than defense at the rim. We're good at 3pt% def and poor at defense at the rim. And we've got the third best record in the league. I'll take that.

    Winning in the playoffs will involve guarding the 3 well. We do that and shoot the three above average (37% or so) and we win a lot of playoff games. Most of our bigs have quickness to defend out on the perimeter. Harrell, Capela, even Nene are doing well at this.

    Gordon is an underrated defender. Rhyno is not as bad as most people say (though he is not quick enough to guard 3 pointers). Capela is about average as a 22 year old who is learning the game. And Ariza's D is critically underrated. I've seen him guard Anthony Davis and do pretty well.
     
  2. Exiled

    Exiled Member

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    Harden/Rockets have a successful season b/c Beverley is not handling the ball,
    imagine how much of an upgrade if he went to the bench more often and played like 2 minutes in a blow out win so he can freely commits fouls and energies the crowed with his intagables D
     
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  3. HewbieTrippin

    HewbieTrippin Member

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    I could be wrong, but I highly doubt that Bev is superior to Gordon in those regards. He's improved at ball handling and creating but he's average at best on a good day. He just doesn't have the moves to put it together.

    Gordon, on the other hand, from what I've seen this season is our second best creator off the catch and off the dribble. He actually has moves that can create shots for himself or others, something I haven't seen Bev do since he's been a Rocket. However, I think Gordon's play has definitely dropped since Lou came onto our team so he's not doing nearly as much creating as before. They're still figuring out how to play with each other, but I almost prefer Gordon to have the ball more than these other two. Lou is pretty streaky so you defer to him when he's hot but I don't see him making plays for others, but he can for himself.
     
  4. snowconeman22

    snowconeman22 Member

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    I agree that Gordon is better at creating his own shot ; I just think bev has been the better assist man this season . Bev often probes the paint and then dishes to someone else . Gordon is a bit of a black hole IMO . But Gordon is definitely better at scoring .
     
  5. YOLO

    YOLO Member

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    but that's really mainly because Bev is put in the position to do so. MDA isn't putting the ball in Gordon's hands to create for others and get assists. he only does so if the play breaks down that way. His first priority is to score not to dribble around. Just a matter of roles here

    But Beverley has improved in the area of ball handling and being able to create to a certain degree compared to what he was in previous years
     
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  6. snowconeman22

    snowconeman22 Member

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    I'm not disputing that . I guess it just depends on what you want out of the second unit . Sometimes it's nice to have a guy that focuses on getting shots for others . Most teams like to play that way . Hence the point guard position lol .

    Lou and Gordon are definitely focused on scoring right now . I don't think Gordon has the capacity to create for others as well as bev . Maybe Lou does , but he's new here and you wouldn't trust the entire second unit to him just yet .

    How much of Gordon's scoring has been the result of an opening created by a Beverley pass ? I dunno . Gordon certainly has the 1 on 1 moves , but Isoball isn't always the greatest choice .

    I agree I don't want bev playing 30 min . That's on dantoni . For some reason he's decided he wants Lou to take minutes from Dekker and Anderson rather than from Ariza , bev, James , and Gordon .
     
  7. YOLO

    YOLO Member

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    I like the balance MDA has. Just putting guys in positions where they will utilize their strengths and getting as much production as possible as a unit. Guys understand their roles which is extremely important.
     
  8. Deuce

    Deuce Context & Nuance

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    Yup, @finsraider nails it.

     
  9. theredbackpack

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    i think in an ideal situation, lou would handle the ball for the second unit. bev is pretty much lights out on the perimeter, so to have three guards on the perimeter with lou freaking williams handling the ball could be even more deadly than it already is. felt like we lost some of our momentum last night when bev had the ball in his hands.
     
  10. HewbieTrippin

    HewbieTrippin Member

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    You might be right. I mean bev would be more prone to looking to pass because he doesn't have as many offensive options for himself. I just don't know that he can consistently get by people to create open shots for others. I know he can swing the ball and stuff but I just don't believe he'll ever be someone who can do much more than that.

    I'll look up more stuff on Gordon and see though. I just remember earlier in the season when he had the green light as the main guy off the bench, he was making shots for himself and getting into the paint, something I haven't seen many Rockets outside of harden be able to do. I really do think sharing the ball with Lou is affecting his rhythm. Hope they can figure it out.
     
  11. hakeem94

    hakeem94 Member

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    I just love that we have them all, i am in love with this team...
     
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  12. Snow Villiers

    Snow Villiers Member

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    Gordon
    Harden
    Ryno
    Harrell
    Nene
    :eek:
     
  13. RudyTBag

    RudyTBag Contributing Member
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    Lou handling the ball as little as he does is a travesty. Gordon too.

    Plus/Minus does not tell the whole story. Our most efficient scorers need more, and higher quality opportunities.
     
  14. Bo6

    Bo6 Member

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    i'd like to see gordon and lou get some minutes separate from each other.
     
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  15. Sen89

    Sen89 Member

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    I agree that we need to let Lou play on the ball more, because that's how he gets in rhythm (like a Harden-lite). He's not a pure shooter, but he needs to be able to create and get to the line.

    The problem is that our rotation is 9-deep, featuring 4 guards (6'5" Harden, 6'3" Gordon, 6'2" Williams, 6'1" Beverley), 4 bigs (6'9" Anderson, two of 6'11" Capela, 6'11" Nene, 6'8" Harrell and 6'9" Dekker) and only 1 wing (6'8" Ariza).

    So we don't have any backup wings, with Dekker being too undeveloped as shooter/ball-handler to play outside in our offense and KJ/Brewer (lol) gone.

    In the 13 games since the Lou Williams trade, here are our guards' minutes:

    Harden: 36.1
    Gordon: 31.0
    Beverley: 30.9
    Williams: 23.7

    That's 121.7 minutes among them, meaning that for 26 minutes a game, we have three guards on the floor. Over half the game we play three guards -- with only one of them being over 6'3" (Harden), and only one of them known for being a strong defender (Beverley). That's a size problem, and a defensive problem waiting to happen.

    It also asks way too much out of Ariza. He's not only guarding star wings night-in-and-night out, but he often has to guard star PFs as well, and he's often being forced to play around 40 minutes a night. It's no wonder why his J has been off. The guy is burnt out.
     
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  16. Deuce

    Deuce Context & Nuance

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    Good points. But nothing is going to change until this summer. Dekker is getting marginalized because of his poor shooting. MDA likes a tight rotation and it is clear that Gordon/Williams/Nene are the 3 bench guys for the 8 man rotation. It appears MDA would rather overwork Ariza than give Dekker more minutes.

     
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  17. HTX Ninja

    HTX Ninja Member

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    D'Antoni should be using a 10 man rotation with someone backing up Ariza at the Wing spot such as Troy Williams.
     
  18. RudyTBag

    RudyTBag Contributing Member
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    I'm so tired of watching Bev run pick and rolls with Lou and Gordon on the floor.

    This lineup needs coaching.
     
  19. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    The defense is bad with this group.
     
  20. RudyTBag

    RudyTBag Contributing Member
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    Watching Bev play "PG" is so painful. No idea why he is the guy that brings the ball up, aside from team seniority. He needs to hand it off and run to the corner.
     

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