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What to Do When Your Team is Loaded in the Wrong Places

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Jeff, Nov 13, 2004.

  1. Jeff

    Jeff Clutch Crew

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    With T-Mac out for two games, it would be easy to give the Rockets a break for struggling, especially against the T-Wolves and Lakers. It would also be equally as easy to blast them for a lack of depth that makes it nearly impossible to sustain a loss like McGrady. In truth, it is probably a little of both. Even if you have bench depth, it would be really tough to make up for a guy like McGrady who does so much more than just score. His mere presence is a difference maker on the floor.

    But, one thing these two games did underscore for me was the fact that the Rockets are overloaded not just at positions on the floor but with players who play a similar style to one another. That wouldn't be a problem if those players' styles were always complimentary to the team or if they filled needed holes but that just isn't the case.

    Case 1: Juwan Howard and Mo Taylor

    This is something we've known since the trade with Orlando. These are two strikingly similar players. Howard is a better rebounder and slightly better defender. Taylor is a much better shooter and a slightly better passer. Either one would be ideal as a second power forward and part time center if you had a legit starter who could rebound and play defense more than anything else.

    What makes this particularly tough is that Taylor is the only guy on the team who can really get his own shot after McGrady and Yao. Unfortunately, he's playing in the wrong spot on the floor for that to be effective. You want players who can break down the defense and not just get shots for themselves but also set up teammates to take the load off of T-Mac and Yao. That isn't the job of a big forward.

    What to do:

    If it were up to me, I'd want to keep Taylor because of his offensive skill level. It is tough to find a guy who can score like he can and he's beginning to extend his range making his ability to stretch the defense a plus. But, that would mean he would have to be paired with someone nearly the polar opposite as him - a bruising rebounder and defender who can take pressure off of Yao assuming we could not find a legit starter to allow Mo to come off the bench. This is one position where a trade could be possible. Taylor would be the more desirable by teams because he is playing so well offensively and he only has 2 years left on his oversized deal. Packaging he and someone like Boki (see below) could net one decent player and a role-playing backup, but trades are difficult and I wouldn't hold my breath.

    Case 2: Boki Nachbar, Ryan Bowen and Scott Padgett

    Three guys with games only slightly different from one another playing two positions is tough, especially when one of those positions - the power forward in our case - already has two OTHER very similar players manning it. Each of these three has his own skills - Boki is better in the open court and better at defending guards and small forwards; Bowen is the best defender and hustle player; Padgett is the best shooter and rebounder.

    In reality, you want one, MAYBE two guys like this on your team and, if you have two, one of them should be the 12th man on the bench.

    What to do:

    IMO, Padgett is the best overall player in this group. I love Boki's skills, but he just doesn't seem to have the ability to transfer them into game situations. Bowen is an ideal 11th or 12th guy - an energy player who can come in, hit the boards, dive for loose balls and mix it up - particularly with his salary. It is doubtful that anyone will get moved during the season unless Boki is part of another deal, but with Nachbar not getting re-signed, it could be taken care off in the offseason.

    Case 3: Tyron Lue and Charlie Ward

    They have different games - Ward the better defender and more experienced floor general; Lue the better shooter and quicker player - but the similarity between the two is that they are both back ups having to play starter's minutes. It is a position we all knew could be an issue and much of it will be solved when Sura returns from his injury, but these are two guys who do not need to be playing pivotal minutes at the point guard position. When Sura and T-Mac are both healthy, we'll only need one and Ward seems the obvious choice given his expreience and poise.

    What to do:

    Hold on until Sura gets back and hope he stays healthy.

    ----

    The big question becomes: What are the Rockets missing because of the similarities in these players?

    When you look at them on the floor with McGrady injured, there are just a lot of holes out there. They are woefully slow in key areas, they have very few reliable perimeter shooters, they have no one beyond T-Mac who can create his own shot and they don't have any enforcer type player that can get in, mix it up defensively and rebound. If you notice, Cuttino Mobley and Kelvin Cato happened to fit a couple of those areas perfectly, but we had to give them up to get McGrady.

    The ideal solution would be a healthy Sura at the point, McGrady at the two, a longer, more athletic three, a tough, defensive-minded four and Yao at center. You'd then want at least one really good shooter and one solid post scorer on the bench to go with Jackson, Ward and Mutumbo. If you hang onto Taylor, he can be your post scorer and you just need a quality perimeter shooter.

    I do NOT think these will be addressed during the season. There are too many issues relating to the new collective bargaining agreement to make quality trades easy. The Rockets do have a couple of decent bargaining chips in Taylor and Nachbar (especially with his expiring contract), but I'm just not sure that they can use those successfully during the season.

    I expect them to take this group fairly deep into the season before trying to make deals - maybe even standing pat until the offseason. But, I do expect them to look to patch those holes once the new CBA is in place through free agency and even the draft.

    It is unfortunate that we are in this situation, but the inability to woo a guy like Brent Barry in the offseason and the need to give up Cato's defense and rebounding and Cat's scoring punch to get T-Mac left us thin.
     
  2. YallMean

    YallMean Member

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    I dont think our current role players are good enough. Also I think we should load up 3 pointers on the floor while Yao is playing
     
  3. New Jack

    New Jack Member

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    I disagree with the notion that we’re lacking a bruiser at the 4. It has not been the bruiser power forwards that have been beating the Rockets. It’s been the tall lanky athletic 4’s that have been killing the Rockets (Bosh, Wallace, Odom, Garnett, etc.). They’re facing up against Taylor and Howard and either nailing their open jumpers or blowing right by them. We MUST get more athleticism in the front court. Someone tall and athletic enough to keep up with these type of 4's.

    When Van Gundy has to bring in Padgette because Taylor and Howard can’t keep up with Odom, you know we’re in trouble.
     
  4. Da Wink

    Da Wink Member

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    guys like Korver would be very ideal for us especially in hitting open corner shots..
     
  5. Nautic

    Nautic Member

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    Wow, another insight piece from Jeff. The diagnosis is right on, unforatunately however, we can't at this moment afford the drugs you prescribe. The root cause for this problem is that the past few years, we have traded away most of our first round picks. We are not a club good at cultivating talents as some other teams do (eg Utah).
     
  6. bob718

    bob718 Contributing Member

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    :confused: :confused:
     
  7. Fegwu

    Fegwu Contributing Member

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    I hope you know he is in Philly's long term plan. It will be hard prying him away from Philly.

    What I think we need most is another guard that can shoot or simply score. I assume not much can change now but I expect the weaknesses to be addressed in the off-season. Like Jeff mentioned, we have many redundances on our team now. It will be nice if we could package Boki and Juwan for one solid player or two more fitting "specialists".

    Sura coming back will definitely help us. It might take him until January to pick it up but if he stays healthy then he will go a long way in arresting these glaring limitations and holes.

    Health, health, health. We can get by with the team we have now and leave a good mark in the playoffs but we have to stay healthy from here on out. If Sura or Tmac ailment linger, we could be in some trouble.
     
  8. xiki

    xiki Contributing Member

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    I remain convinced that Howard is the key - as he is the single most tradable - for quality - player the Rox would move.

    I do not understand Jeff's fascination with that dog, Cato. Mutombo, at 58, is still better than Cato ever was as a Rock.

    Sura, being healthy and quickly fitting in, is the best real chance for this season (and thank goodness the back up plan includes holding a #1 in June's draft JUST IN CASE).

    In the interim, please NO POINTS. JJax and TMac should initiate the O and the two clowns can sit around. The same two 1s who combined for something like 3 - 16 points tonite.
     
  9. Man

    Man Contributing Member

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    Hmm..I don't think they are clowns..they are pretty good to me..they had to force some shots..I think they would be good as off guards..just shoot open shot..or make the passes..theier defense isn't that bad. You make them sound like they suck
     
  10. Axeman

    Axeman Member

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    Bottom line is that the Rockets just aren't using guys the right way, in my opinion. I agree that Howard or Taylor need to go because they overlap too much. Other than that, I just think the Rockets are going with the wrong strategy. They need to establish Yao more, then the other guys will have an easier time. To me, that's been the biggest problem in all these games. They don't go to Yao early enough. By the time they try to ride Yao by feeding him the ball consistently, it is too late to come back all the way. They get back into the game but can't finish. If they had started off the game going to Yao they wouldn't be in a position to have to expend all their energy getting back in it. They would be in control of the game and be forcing the other team to actually play defense, making them the more tired team at the end of the game.
     
  11. patlabor1

    patlabor1 Member

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    So Howard's bricklaying days are over in H-Town, damn I was so looking forward to seeing TC 2 on the cheap. :D

    On a more serious note, All 3 players we got extra from the trade have all proven to be a bust, Gaines is somewhere in the bleachers area getting a nose blead while Lue needs to grow another 7 inches to make a decent pass down low (as he practises playing frisbee with the passes) and

    Howard's still fat contract won't get us much in any deal, at least we'll have the pleasure (if he can't be traded this season) of watching him getting the offensive rebound after his own brick shots. That's a talent you rarely see in the NBA now.
     
  12. rvpals

    rvpals Member

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    One thing we desperately need is a great 3 point shooter. A guy that can hit the open 3s most of the time. So many times this season, guys get wide open looks for a 3 and missed. Imagined if we have Steve Kerr at his prime.

    We also need a good perimeter defender.
     
  13. Jeff

    Jeff Clutch Crew

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    The real problem is that, after Yao, McGrady, Jackson, Taylor and, hopefully, Sura, we are VERY short on athleticism/quickness and shooting. It's a better position to be in than, for example, Memphis, a team loaded with quickness and scoring but not a go-to guy among them.

    I agree that you have to establish Yao, but it is very difficult to do that when he has two defenders in his lap. And even when they DO establish Yao (30+ points tonight seems pretty damn well established), open players have to hit shots.

    Tonight, the stats tell the story...

    Yao: 11-21 (52%)
    Rest of Team: 16-57 (28%)
    3-pointers: 6-20 (30%)

    Yao: 32 points
    Only other player in double figures: Jim Jackson - 15

    Yao FT: 10-12
    Rest of Team: 9-11

    The guy couldn't do much more to carry the team than he did tonight without McGrady. The other guys out there are just poor shooters with little overall quickness and below-average rebounding skills. Yao did pretty much all he could to not only make shots but to put his teammates in position to take WIDE OPEN shots and they couldn't convert.
     
  14. Jeff

    Jeff Clutch Crew

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    Let me also say that I don't necessarily think these guys are poor players individually. I just think that the combination of role players we have is unbalanced. Independently, guys like Ward and Padgett and Taylor could all be a help to the team. But when you mix them with other guys who are very similar to their own skill level and style of play, you are creating problems.
     
  15. jopatmc

    jopatmc Contributing Member

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    After watching tonights game against the Lakers, Im beginning to wonder if we would be better off with Padgett starting and bringing MoT and Juwon off the bench as the second line for Yao and Padgett. Padgett can definitely spread the floor and he does a better job guarding the 4s with range than either Mo or Juwon. He also looks like he goes to the boards better than both of them. Im thinking we might need to start Boki and Padgett at the forward spots, with Van Gundy having a quick hook if it is obvious that someone is overmatched on the defensive end. Let those 2 open up the floor to TMac and Yao and get some offense going early. Then our bench comes back with JJ, Howard, and MoT, down low with Lue at the point. We would still have a good scoring second unit with the rule changes it looks like offense has a much higher priority than years past. It is obvious that we need a big banger, a 3 point shooter and an upgrade at the point.
     
  16. clove

    clove Contributing Member

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    Good point.
     
  17. mogrod

    mogrod Contributing Member

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    Not sure how much better you want them to shoot the 3, but both the team and Nachbar were 2nd in the NBA in thier respective 3pt categories before tonight's game. Though I agree with your Steve Kerr coment.

    TMac is pretty good. He is certainly underrated defensively.

    I really don't understand why everyone keeps saying this. I just can't imagine a GM wants a 32 yr. old, average PF, making pretty good money with 4 yrs. left on his contract.

    I actually think Spoon is our best tradeable asset at the PF. His contract ends after next season, so he has value to a team looking to cut payroll in the next season or two.

    I actually think JJ is the Rocket's best tradeable asset overall. I would believe most teams would love to have him one thier roster. I look at a team like Denver where they would view JJ with alot of value. They need wing help and his veteran leadership would help that young team out. I could see a JJ for Nene swap. Of course this would all depend on if the Rockets felt that Boki could handle the starting role.
     
  18. nyquil82

    nyquil82 Contributing Member

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    good analysis,

    to add to the point that many of our players have the same strengths, many also have the same weaknesses while also having no major strengths. Howard and Mo are subpar rebounders, and although Mo does have more O, its only above average. Bowen, Padge and nachbar are all also subpar rebounders (padge being average) and subpar defenders. All five of them are average or below average passers, none of them are particularly fast, athletic, and none are good shotblockers nor good at steals. I agree, we need diversity, and we need to keep some of the roleplayers and get some guys with some specific strengths.
     
  19. giddyup

    giddyup Contributing Member

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    Badiane is coming. Have no fear-- not much anyway....
     
  20. crash5179

    crash5179 Contributing Member

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    One thing I think needs to happen is that Jackson either needs to go to the bench or improve his game this season. His decision making has been atrocious as has his shooting. Boki has actually been playing better than Jackson this year IMO but because Boki has no real history and Jackson has a long history Boki has a very short leash and Jackson has a very long one.
     

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