1. SirIvyLeague

    SirIvyLeague Member

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    Majority hype.

    SIL
     
  2. vlaurelio

    vlaurelio Contributing Member

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    FG% by distance

    Giannis
    10-16 16 <3 3P
    2015-16 .288 .359 .257
    2016-17 .338 .342 .272
    2017-18 .382 .324 .292

    Harden
    10-16 16 <3 3P
    2015-16 .426 .402 .359
    2016-17 .419 .427 .347
    2017-18 .500 .250 .396
     
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  3. YOLO

    YOLO Member

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    not sure why you're quoting me. im specifically talking about giannis. nothing to do with harden
     
  4. vlaurelio

    vlaurelio Contributing Member

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    just included Harden's numbers for reference

    but curious when you say Giannis is hitting jumpers consistently now, you mean the .38% he hits from 10 to 16 feet right?
     
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  5. knote32

    knote32 Contributing Member

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    Don't count me as one of those crazies, or any group that SIL is in.

    Giannis is awesome.
     
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  6. YOLO

    YOLO Member

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    which obviously is showing improvement than previously. thats what you want to see in guys isn't it. like i said. hes hitting jumpers just not behind the 3pt line
     
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  7. JayZ750

    JayZ750 Contributing Member

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    I'm trying to figure it out.

    You have Harden as the #2 offensive efficiency phenom in NBA history, which you support with Points Produced.

    Ostensibly you're saying Harden is one of the top 2 greatest offensive players ever. Efficient + Most Points Produced. Correct?
     
  8. JayZ750

    JayZ750 Contributing Member

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    I mean, I agree... but that's not what the post I was quoting proposed. It proposed an all NBA draft.

    Also, my perspective as a Rockets fan isn't what will they do for the next 2-3 years. It's solely how to get a championship, and do it sooner rather than later. The only way I'd sacrifice the last part would be if I knew I might have to wait 2 more years, but would have a real dynastic type team.

    That's a real question because GMs have rosters to fill and youth is what most of them need.

    Harden is both amazing, AND has a roster and coach and system around him that is maximizing him, yes.
    But again, the post in question was about an all-nba draft. The team/roster/system/coach/etc. wouldn't be the same around him.

    Yes, absolutely. The roster, fit, coaching, etc. with the Bucks isn't amazing right now. The Bledsoe move makes sense because of what they gave up, but I'm not in love with it.

    Which is why I've noted, healthy CP3, I like:

    CP3, Gordon, Giannis, Anderson, Capela, Bench (maybe Ariza starts, Anderson bench)
    equally with
    CP3, Harden, Ariza, Anderson, Capela, Bench

    Because the Giannis lineup has the same kind of great roll players type around him and CP3, still has a dynamic, Nash-esque PG that would be maximized in MDA's system, has better offense/defense balance, the guy who controls the ball the most in that scenario (CP3) is much less turnover prone and also a defensive leader, and Giannis would shine in an MDA offense as well, probably more so.

    It's all hypothetical though.
     
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  9. JayZ750

    JayZ750 Contributing Member

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    Lol... give him time.

    As is in his 22 year season he led a team to the 7th seed in the playoffs. A not very good team around him.

    Which is more than Harden did at age 22.

    Mind you, I REALLY DON'T LIKE this Giannis vs. Harden black and white.

    Harden's been great at making most players around him better and winning games... obviously.
     
  10. Reeko

    Reeko Member

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    I have him as an AD type who just so happens to play in the East until he proves that he can guide a team to 50+ wins and get past the 1st round...guady numbers, a top 10 player, but no Harden when it comes to making others better or carrying a team to anything better than mediocre

    before acquiring Bledsoe, his team was 5-7 and looked to be headed for 40 wins...Harden with that exact same roster pre-Bledsoe in place of Giannis would probably have been top 3 or 4 in the East...his offensive production/impact is that dominating
     
  11. BigMaloe

    BigMaloe Contributing Member

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    But....

    Let's not give harden time to figure it out in the playoffs now that he finally has legit help around him.

    Got it.
     
  12. MystikArkitect

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    And I believe it to be Harden because he’s proven he can drag a team into the playoffs and succeed while making everyone around him better. Giannis has yet to prove that right? He’s putting up gaudy numbers on a mediocre team in the East. Harden is putting up gaudy numbers for the 5th straight year on the team with the best record in the West with his #2 being out.

    He is not playing close to Harden level. No one is. Only Lebron gets close right now. Harden is basically Neo at the end of the Matrix right now in terms of game control. Giannis has yet to show that level of potential. He’s a better at the two way aspect of the game, sure. Harden will never be known for his D but his impact drowns Giannis and Kawhi.
     
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  13. JayZ750

    JayZ750 Contributing Member

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    Lol... you're right... Harden hasn't had enough time to figure it out yet. That's what the problem was in Game 6 last year!! /sarcasm

    As I've said though in plenty of previous posts... Harden CAN turn it around. I hope he does. I'm just not optimistic about it. And again, turn it around doesn't mean he sucks or is horrible. It speaks to the playoff performances, every year, that I've referenced.
     
  14. JayZ750

    JayZ750 Contributing Member

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    Clearly Harden is playing the best in the NBA right now.
    I'll take regular season Harden for sure.
    I think GMs will look at more than that.
     
  15. Pen15clubber

    Pen15clubber Member

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    Get sum bia.
     
  16. vlaurelio

    vlaurelio Contributing Member

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    like how the hell the rockets won 2 games with 1 star (who played 81 games of winning MVP-level bball at a frantic pace at the most minutes and most points produced) against a clearly superior spurs team who won 6 more games? 7 of which their best player not even playing? and beat the rockets 3-1 during the season?

    Morey saw that and that's why he extended Harden to a max extension
    CP3 saw that that's why went and join Harden
    Melo saw that that's why he wanted to join Harden as well
    Same with Tucker and LMM who took a paycut
    Les and Tilman both saw that as well

    all GMs in Morey's place would have done the same. Extend & improve
    and not quit, take a step back, and pray you get lucky
     
  17. Swiss Roll

    Swiss Roll Member

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    lamo trade Harden for Giannis? This is literally the typical "The Devil You Know" Scenario. We all know that trading Harden for any of the current crop of stars would be a silly idea, as we have all seen their postseason failures, so trade him for a man who hasn't done **** in the postseason!

    At age 23, Harden was balling out in Houston, with averages of 26-6-5 in his first year down south. He was fresh off of a finals trip partially thanks to him sinking a dagger stepback-3 in Kawhi Leonard's face along with carrying the Thunder against the Spurs. He had made the playoffs every year in his career and consistently balled out except in the 2012 finals, because no 22 year old has ever struggled in the finals.

    Giannis. has gone through two postseasons. He got swept by LeBron in 2014, but that was a pretty crappy bucks team. He made it back to the postseason in 2017, fresh off his first all star appearance, as a starter no less! He lost to the perennial playoff underachiever Toronto Raptors in 6 games after taking a 2-1 lead. His lack of an outside shot allowed Toronto to pack the paint and play the passing lanes, similar to how teams defend DeRozan in the playoffs.
     
  18. YOLO

    YOLO Member

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    all good. this was SIL's take on capela just two months ago

     
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  19. JayZ750

    JayZ750 Contributing Member

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    You keep saying this. But it doesn't make it so. This was the Spurs starting lineup in Game 6 of last years playoffs. A Rockets home game, must win.

    Patty Mills, Danny Green, Paul Gasol, LMA, Jonathan Simmons
    Their two bench players with meaningful minutes played were Dejounte Murray and Kyle Anderson.

    Murderer's row lineup there, lol.

    It is also what they rolled with 4th Q of Game 5 and OT. At least that was an away game.

    The Rockets didn't surround James with ridiculously amazing talent, but it was well matched to his and MDAs style and deep. But sure, if Anderson and Gordon and Ariza and Anderson, etc. suck, what can Harden do? Did they suck? Well... kind of... depending on the game in the series. Yes.

    But as we all know, Harden disappeared. In the exact moment he should have been turning it on since the other team's star player(s) went out.
     
  20. vlaurelio

    vlaurelio Contributing Member

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    Spurs weren't dependent on Kawhi the Rockets were. Pops, Morey, MDA, CP3 knows that.

    And don't act like that game is totally independent to all 92 games before it. Game 94 was the farthest anyone could have physically single handedly carry the Rockets to last year

    If they had Lebron, they would have been swept by the GSW in the 2nd round

    If we switched harden with KD or Curry, GSW will still be champs. And the Rockets either bumped off in the 1st round or swept in the 2nd.

    So now it boils down that harden actually single handedly carried the Rockets the farthes.
     
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