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The Tennis Thread

Discussion in 'Other Sports' started by malakas, Sep 13, 2015.

  1. Duncan McDonuts

    Duncan McDonuts Contributing Member

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    Serena takes up her aggression a notch by being verbally abusive and physically threatening towards others, which can be a criminal offense. I don't like when Murray constantly curses himself and smashes his racket, but that's all internal frustations manifesting. Nobody else on the tour does what Serena does.
     
  2. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Insider Newsletter™ 2X Diamond Member
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    We'll see how it plays out. Her time is almost up.

    I hella respect modern day players breaking old records. Much like how some people can overlook Kobe or MJ's transgressions off the court, I'm indifferent to most of her antics w/ the refs, which is a lot tamer all things considered. Chalk it up to passion and the heat of the moment....

    She won mostly through her own hustle and has several comebacks at times when I stopped paying attention. That's remarkable.

    Having said all that, Osaka should've had the winning ceremony she rightly deserved.
     
  3. ferrari77

    ferrari77 Contributing Member

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    Nick Kyrgios doesn't exist anymore huh? Interesting.
    http://www.espn.com/tennis/story/_/id/17153371/nick-kyrgios-controversies --- that was just up to 2016

     
  4. ferrari77

    ferrari77 Contributing Member

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    https://news.sky.com/story/serena-w...player-umpire-carlos-ramos-has-upset-11494215

    Serena was definitely in the wrong for her reaction but so was the umpire.
    This incident sure brought out the Serena haters like bees to honey.
     
  5. Duncan McDonuts

    Duncan McDonuts Contributing Member

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    I'm not familiar with him as I haven't kept up with tennis for a while, but that video is very tame compared to what Serena did. Most of his controversies are, too. Serena has physically threatened people, and also threatened the career of the ump. Isn't using one's position of power against another contradictory to the MeToo movement?

    And I don't hate Serena. She's a great competitor and will go down as one of the GOATs. But she has a temper problem and should be called out on it. You can like her but still criticize her and not be grouped into a fan or hater. The world is not binary.
     
  6. ferrari77

    ferrari77 Contributing Member

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    Wait did you really say that most of Krygios' controversies are tame? Yeah you really haven't kept up with tennis. The link I sent you was just a list of stuff he was involved in...up to 2016! Not even including stuff he's said and done in 2017 or this year. He legitimately brings the game into disrepute. I don't think Serena is even close to his level in terms of that.
    Threatening the career of an ump.Are you serious? You actually wrote that but ignored that Nadal actually said the same thing to the same ump! No uproar over that. Serena told the ump that he would "never, ever be on another court of mine". Nadal told the ump that he would "never chair another of his matches again". That's literally in what I posted above. So how does that relate to the MeToo movement as compared to what Nadal said...since you brought it up?

    For sure it's not binary and I'm glad you can be considered one that appreciates her talent but won't shirk from criticizing her if need be. Hopefully you also go to bat on these here internet forums or in your everyday life when you agree with something she's done and see those just looking to criticize.
     
  7. Senator

    Senator Member

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    Either you have poor cognitive ability or you think the race card allows you to be wrong in a fit of emotion.

    Kyrgios tantrums are swearing at himself or no one in particular or complaining about bird sounds. There is a difference in the rules when you get personal with authority , you can get away with it against opponent of either sex. He doesnt threaten the lives of jobs of umpires, and all tennis players without sponsorships to protect agree -

    The 36-year-old had already had a point penalty for smashing her racquet and a code violation for coaching when she was penalised further for calling Ramos a "thief" and a "liar" in New York.

    Speaking on the eve of Great Britain's Davis Cup match with Uzbekistan in Glasgow, US Open mixed doubles champion Murray told BBC Sport: "I think the umpire did what was within his rights.

    "Coaching is common, a lot of people are doing it, some people aren't getting called for it. To get called in a Grand Slam final was perhaps a bit tight, but I think the reaction was pretty overboard.

    "I've seen a lot of people get called for coaching before, and you might have a grumble and stuff, but you get on with it."

    Ramos will umpire Croatia v USA in the Davis Cup this weekend. Speaking before the tie, US captain Jim Courier told the AP news agency: "It's been polarised and in some ways politicised. But we have no doubt that Carlos was just enforcing the rules as he sees them."

    American player Steve Johnson added: "Look, I don't want this to come out the wrong way, but he enforced rules that have been enforced on me over the years.

    "I've never been called for coaching, but the racquet abuse, the verbal abuse, that's just part of the sport. I think a lot of it maybe got over-amplified because it was the finals of the US Open."


    https://www.bbc.com/sport/tennis/45513038
     
    #147 Senator, Sep 13, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2018
  8. ferrari77

    ferrari77 Contributing Member

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    You might want to shine that flashlight of poor cognitive ability on yourself while you out your agenda. Where the flying f^ck did I say anything about Serena's race? That speaks volumes about you and your agenda on this thread and in your response to me that you even mentioned race when I said nothing about race nor brought that up. Clap for yourself sir.

    And as for Krygios, are you intentionally trying to be dense or you just didn't bother reading or researching his history...if as it seems, you've forgotten.
    Here, I'll remind you...since you seem to think all Nick does is "swear at himself or at no one in particular or complain about bird sounds".

    But SURE Krygios just swears at himself. What a choir boy. Most definitely doesn't bring the game into disrepute. Get the heck out of here with your nonsense.

    And as for your saying he doesn't threaten the lives of(or) jobs of umpires....where the heck did I say he did that? But you conveniently ignored where I said Rafa Nadal made the same exact threat TO THE SAME EXACT UMP as Serena did. But hey, let's forget about that. Ridiculous.
     
  9. DCkid

    DCkid Contributing Member

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    I don't know much about this Kyrgios guy either...sounds like a bad dude. Also sounds like a case of unrealized potential. Never ranked higher than 13th. Never been to a grand slam semifinals. Currently ranked 30th. Also seems pretty much universally disliked, and there's not really any debate about it. Probably why only people who follow tennis would have heard of him. He doesn't appear to have people bending over backwards to support/justify his awful behavior. Fans boo him instead of booing the umpire. etc. I could go on noting the differences between him and Serena. Seems like he's been penalized a lot over the years. So, I'm not sure what your point in bringing it up? If it's just a to say there is also a male professional tennis player somewhere in this world (with little influence) who behaves worse than Serena, then I would concede. She's not the worst behaved professional tennis player in the world...but maybe second? A few questions, has he ever told a lineswoman that "I swear to God, I'm going to shove this ****ing ball down your ****ing throat?" Has he ever had a scene with an umpire that extended across multiple game breaks without being penalized, and was Ramos the umpire? Were people trying to justify his behavior in the aftermath of these incidents (I've counted 7 articles in the Washington Post this week in support of Serena...maybe 1 negative one, and all that one did is quote Martina Navratilova)?

    And as I recall, Ramos didn't penalize Serena for that remark. Seems like in generally umpires will ignore curse words, complaints, airing of grievances. They appear to give a lot more leeway than most professional sports to let the player fume a little. But when it turns to a direct attack on their character (a thief) then it is within the rules and their right to defend themselves by taking action. Seems to me she should have been penalized when he was called a "liar" just before that

    I think if this was a situation where Serena acted like this, and everyone just kind of rightly agreed her behavior was ridiculous, then people just see it and move on, cause what else is there to talk about? But if people see the same behavior by a 37 year old adult, and then come across articles saying all she did "was show emotion" or "show anger," and then call a well-respected umpire sexist without showing any evidence of it, most people are going to stop and say "wait a minute, in what world can someone get this much support for acting this way"
     
    #149 DCkid, Sep 14, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2018
  10. Senator

    Senator Member

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    Not playing the race card... What race are you then, Mr. Unbiased? You've shown your cards by defending Serena in a situation where she was clearly wrong, using the same arguments from the same vehicle.

    Nick has been penalized, suspended and basically had to train by himself for 6 months regarding comments. Even then, none of them have been as aggressive towards the authority as Serena in the US open. The issue is when people point out Serena's bad behavior, people who live a life of victimization hide behind the gender and race card.

    This is a cartoon the same guy drew a few days earlier regarding the chair motivating Nick to play harder:

    [​IMG]


    Everyone piled on Kyrgios and the media has always piled on Kyrgios. No one accused the cartoonist of racism or exagerated features because well... that's what caricaturist's do . Are people not allowed to point out Serena's bad behavior in public because of her race? Is she supposed to be depicted as someone who doesn't have that exact body? That is wrong and dangerous to society.

    The facts are simple, every tennis pro agree's: She got what she deserved in terms of officiating and strategically did what she does when she is about to lose in a big match. It's not about liking or disliking her, accept the truth and move on.
     
    #150 Senator, Sep 14, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2018
  11. apollo33

    apollo33 KMart Only Fan
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    I like you bring up Krygios, talk about setting the bar low. Krygios is like Draymond Green level in terms of being a general POS. I guess Serena is at least less of a cunt than Krygios, the fact that we have to go that low just shows how bad Serena's behavior his.

    Even with Krygios I don't remember him directly threatening umps like Serena did in 2009
     
    AroundTheWorld likes this.
  12. ferrari77

    ferrari77 Contributing Member

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    You're a race baiting idiot so please stop talking to me. Nowhere on here did I bring up her race. What does my race have to do with this? If you don't want people to bring up race in an argument then here's a tip...don't bring it up yourself. I'd rather respond to the others that actually responded without bringing race into their argument or assuming that's what my point was based on. Cheers.
     
  13. ferrari77

    ferrari77 Contributing Member

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    You're right "apollo33" it is a low bar in mentioning Krygios and there's been no dispute from me that her behavior was inappropriate. Not at all. My bringing up Krygios was in reply to this

    I responded with Krygios if by him saying nobody else on the tour does what Serena does he meant insulting umpires, fans, verbal abuse, breaking rackets and generally bringing the sport into disrepute. I wasn't wrong in mentioning Krygios albeit using a low bar.
     
  14. Senator

    Senator Member

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    Do not look for excuses and point out the bad behavior of other kids because your kid behaves bad ... or whoever you feel is on your team because they look like you. Kyrgios has been penalized much more than Serena for his lesser behavior and no one in the media has supported him. There were no accusations of racism when a cartoonist drew him in an accurate depiction of events. Your behavior is cringe worthy to other educated adults and I'm being kind enough to be real with you about it.
     
  15. ferrari77

    ferrari77 Contributing Member

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    For sure you're right about what you wrote on Krygios. I responded to "apollo33" w/regard to my point about bringing him up. Look again at the post I responded to when I brought up Krygios' name.
    And perhaps people don't try to justify his behavior because he is what he is in terms of unrealized potential. When Nadal had his issue with Ramos, people did try to justify his behavior. It wasn't on a stage like the US Open (in terms of making the American press react and the home public...rooting for their own player) so of course he didn't have North American media outlets writing in support of him. Plus, you brought up the Washington Post. As some of our resident CF Republicans would tell you, that would be par for the course for the Washington Post to write in support of Serena.

    She went too far in her remarks to him during the game, I didn't argue about that. He did penalize her for her remark. She lost a game for it.
    Calling him well-respected amongst other tennis players is debatable. He's well respected amongst his peers...there's no doubt.
    I pointed out where he failed to penalize other male players for insulting remarks toward him. There are other instances of other males (and females) insulting umpires with worse things than what Serena said. Whether it's sexist or racist might be up for debate, I don't know. I just know her behavior was not appropriate and the umpire also bears some blame in what occurred. That's it.
     
  16. ferrari77

    ferrari77 Contributing Member

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    Pal, be quiet and go talk to a wall or someone else. I'm talking to other adults on here that aren't telling me I'm bringing race into the discussion...when I have done no such thing(and it wouldn't be a problem if I chose to). Take care and be well.
     
  17. Senator

    Senator Member

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    Excellent work, you've done the team proud.
     
  18. DCkid

    DCkid Contributing Member

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    Okay, we'll agree to disagree.

    1.) I don't think you or anyone else has fully provided an overarching comparable set of circumstances of a male player exhibiting the same behavior...rambling at the ump for several minutes across multiple game breaks, embarrassingly using parenthood as some self-righteous defense, demanding an unwarranted apology over and over and over again, threatening his career and job prospects by saying you'll never umpire one of my matches again, and then finally directly attacking his character (not competency) by calling him a liar and thief. Maybe there is some example of one of those things out there... maybe two, but good luck finding an instance of that all-inclusive **** show. And even if you do, I'm sure it's just as easy to find some other verbal abuse violation of a white male player out there, which was even less serious than what Serena did. Neither anecdote would prove anything. Bottom line is that it's obvious to anyone without an agenda that her behavior was worthy of a verbal abuse violation. Trying to insinuate she is a victim by suggesting at some point in history there was an umpire who didn't penalize a male player for calling him or her a name doesn't change that.

    2.) If we're looking at historically, I don't think you or anyone else has shown a tennis player saying something worse and more unhinged to an official "than I swear to god, I'm going to take this ball and shove it down you're ****ing throat." There's a clear history of extraordinarily appalling behavior from her when she's losing that is exceptional even when compared to male players.

    3.) I don't think the umpire deserves any blame whatsoever. My opinion is that he simply did his job. She looked at her coach as he was coaching her. He gave a warning for coaching. I believe that for any other tennis player in the world that would have been it. Play would have just continued like normal. She has some unique mixture of issues that elevated a minor warning into a humiliating spectacle.
     
  19. ferrari77

    ferrari77 Contributing Member

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    No problem, we can agree to disagree as you said.
    1. I will point out once again.. as I'm not sure why you included this in your response to me...I never wrote that her behavior was not worthy of a verbal abuse violation. I stated that she reacted terribly and inappropriately while he also could have given her a warning beforehand as Chris Evert mentioned

    2. No argument from me that she can be a sore loser. She wouldn't be the first tennis superstar or even professional athlete to be one.

    3. Whether she was receiving coaching is debatable but regardless he enforced it when other umpires might not have. That doesn't make him bad and in a way makes other umpires look worse but I'll stick with the belief that he deserves some blame for not warning her about the verbal abuse before enforcing it in that match. You disagree on that and it's ok.

    I will say I detested the post match interviews after every damn match when we had to hear about her and her child...as if she's the only female athlete to ever have a child and continue playing at a high level. That annoyed me. Other than that, I'll stick with my belief that there's enough blame to go around between her for her actions and the umpire as well.
     
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