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The Results Are In! The Best Two Rockets Attacking The Basket Are...

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by DonKnock, Dec 4, 2016.

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  1. DonKnock

    DonKnock Member

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    #1 DonKnock, Dec 4, 2016
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2016
  2. Batman Jones

    Batman Jones Contributing Member

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    I won't defend against any criticism of Brewer. He has a lot of holes in his game. But his circus shots are almost more reliable than his 3's and that's pretty entertaining. He plays like a snake around the basket and when he makes one the announcers are almost always like, "Did you see THAT shot?!" When he's hitting he's a fun player to watch.
     
    #2 Batman Jones, Dec 4, 2016
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  3. ThatBoyNick

    ThatBoyNick Member

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    Surprising, I was expecting Dekker and Harden.

    Dekker's finishing ability is legit.

    Glad Brewer is doing a little better this season, get that trade value up so we can get some minutes for KJ!
     
    #3 ThatBoyNick, Dec 4, 2016
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  4. dharocks

    dharocks Contributing Member

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    I'm laying off Brewer for now. He's been playing well since D'Antoni took him out of the starting lineup.
     
    #4 dharocks, Dec 4, 2016
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  5. PhiSlammaJamma

    PhiSlammaJamma Member

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    Doesn't seem like the % is relevant enough though, you'd certainly want to take into account the fumbles pre-and-in drive which comes to mind with Brewer, Nene, and Gordon. Ariza is mostly %, but god awful as expected. It's like he was born to stutter in the lane. Please Morey, put a limit on him. Ennis for as crappy as we all know he is, like Jeremy Lin, gets to the basket extremely well and can finish.

    Brewer did improve over last year though, up from a sick 34%.
    Ariza even lower than last year's robotic effort.
     
    #5 PhiSlammaJamma, Dec 4, 2016
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2016
  6. Victorious

    Victorious Member

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    That lakers game where he fell down on a fast break took his drive stats in the gutter
     
    #6 Victorious, Dec 4, 2016
  7. Easy

    Easy Boban Only Fan
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    I am guessing Nene starts his drives mostly from about 6 feet out.
     
    #7 Easy, Dec 4, 2016
  8. DonKnock

    DonKnock Member

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    Drives: Any touch that starts at least 20 feet of the hoop and is dribbled within 10 feet of the hoop and excludes fast breaks.
     
    #8 DonKnock, Dec 4, 2016
  9. rockbox

    rockbox Around before clutchcity.com

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    FG% is deceiving statistic because Harden gets fouled a lot. Points per drive would be better indicator.
     
    #9 rockbox, Dec 4, 2016
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  10. DonKnock

    DonKnock Member

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    Points percent per drive still has Nene 1st and Brewer 2nd lmao

    Nene - 85%
    Brewer - 84%
    KJ - 69%
    Dekker - 63%
    Harden - 62%
     
    #10 DonKnock, Dec 4, 2016
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  11. heypartner

    heypartner Contributing Member

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    Thx for the stats. I know this is a tongue in cheek thread. But let's go ahead and waste some time this morning and look deeper

    First off Pts% is not PPS, so it is affected by times he passes. the formula is

    Pts% = pts/drives
    PPS = pts/fga

    So, if you passed every time, then it is 0%

    # of Drives
    Nene = 7
    Brewer = 24
    Harden = 248

    I think we can take Nene out of the equation. I mean, he's shooting 66% from 3ptrs too, :D
    But I think Brewer might be a good measure of how open the lane is this year.

    PPS, TS% and FG%* on Drives
    [​IMG]
    * (note, since no three pointers are shot by definition on drives FG% = eFG%)​

    Anyone want to attempt an explanation of Harden being down significantly on FTA, and thus PPS/TS% on drives. I think he must be passing more when in traffic vs flailing for fouls. Maybe the media needs to be alerted!

    Another thing to note...looks like he is driving a TON more this year. Getting into the lane easy.

    I'll run other numbers. Let me know what you want. The stats come with Passes per drive too. I think we need to check FTA per FGA
     
    #11 heypartner, Dec 4, 2016
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  12. Easy

    Easy Boban Only Fan
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    I was joking. :)

    @heypartner
    Does PTS include only the points the player scored, or team score? What I want to know is how many points a drive & dish produces.
     
    #12 Easy, Dec 4, 2016
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  13. heypartner

    heypartner Contributing Member

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    OK, check this out. This is a pretty cool table to show D'Antoni PG Harden vs McHale Harden

    He noticeably passes more and goes for less fouls. He's creating more than double the assists. But at the expense of his FTAs per drive and per shot are down significantly.

    Also added Lin/Parsons for funzies.

    [​IMG]
     
    #13 heypartner, Dec 4, 2016
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  14. heypartner

    heypartner Contributing Member

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    It's just for player.

    But you can kinda calculate it by creating a formula to use the Assists (2nd table) with some team-wide PPS on drives. I gotta walk my dog. Let me know what you think that formula should be. You can go to NBA.com and see the Team Wide stats on drives. So, I was thinking using that PPS to apply to Harden's assists on drives.
     
    #14 heypartner, Dec 4, 2016
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  15. jsingles

    jsingles Member

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    Sewer, he's not the hero we want, or deserve, but the hero we're stuck with.
     
    #15 jsingles, Dec 4, 2016
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  16. ParaSolid

    ParaSolid Member

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    Thanks for the info!

    So Harden is generating 1.378 points per drive this year, which is considerably less than previous years. I'm curious about what you think these two questions:

    1. Does current Harden do more damage outside of his drives versus previous years such that it makes him a more effective player this year even with his lower PPS on drives?
    2. Or is Harden not as impactful as he was in previous years and we're just not perceiving this?
     
    #16 ParaSolid, Dec 4, 2016
  17. heypartner

    heypartner Contributing Member

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    That's not points per drive. It is points per shot. And I wouldn't use the word "generating" vs "scoring". Generating would include assists.

    The table also shows assists. He assists per drive are more than double this year.

    The table aslo shows FTs per Drive and FTAs per Shot. Those are significantly down. So, clearly his PPS number are being affected by less free throws on shots.

    His less FTAs per FGA on drives is very interesting. Is he not getting the calls, or is he more picky, so passes when covered vs trying to draw contact. All sorts of ways to discuss that.

    He's getting the team involved more.
     
    #17 heypartner, Dec 4, 2016
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2016
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  18. DonKnock

    DonKnock Member

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    Yea I started investigating if Clint was top 10 in FG% on post touches (he's 4th among starting C's btw), then started snooping around for some stats that would show Montrezl playing well and ended up seeing Nene with the crazy high drive FG%. Converted the filter to Rockets only and saw Brew up there next.

    Also saw that Wiltjer is leading the league in eFG% on pull up shots :eek: haha

    I think Harden getting fouled less has to do with another stat I found.

    Our Forwards as a position group are decisive with the ball. Once the ball gets there they are spotting up, going to the rim, or giving the ball right back to Harden. The main group that Harden plays with, in terms of their Adjusted Assist-to Pass% Ariza barely makes the cut of starting caliber players (57th) and Anderson is bottom quarter among qualifiers (193rd). It seems to get a little better with the bench unit Brewer(31st), Harrell (114th), Dekker(127th), KJ(197th), WiltJr(220th).


    Assist-to-Pass Percentage Adj - The percentage of passes by a player or team that are assists, free throw assists, or secondary assists.


    Compare Andersons meaningful pass rank with his overall pass total rank (52nd) while Ariza remains roughly the same (60th).
    The bench guys total's will obviously be lower due to less minutes but: Dekker (104th), Harrell (143rd), Brewer (167th), KJ(197th), WiltJr(213th)

    Moving over to passes recieved, they seem to roughly line up with passes madeAnderson(53rd), Ariza(68th), Dekker(127th), Harrell(133rd), Brewer(166th), KJ(181st), Wiltjer(206th)

    The playmaking is clearly coming from our guards.
    Harden: (3rd) Adj. Assist-to-Pass%, (3rd) Passes Made, (1st) Passes Recieved
    Bev: (21st) Assist-to-Pass%, (58th) Passes Made, (73rd) Passes Recieved)
    EGo:(42nd) Assist-to-Pass% (114th) Passes Made, (89th) Passes Recieved

    Now, to tie all this back to the original question. Last year Harden seemed to use his "flail drives" as a last resort in the shot clock when the ball would go to Dwight in the post, he would look around for a little, possibly make a few dribbles, then exit the ball from the post before it would work its way back to Harden with the expectation for him to do something. This play has been virtually eliminated from occurring. The main post up player now is Nene and he can usually twist and turn his way into a shot once he gets the ball on the block or dump off the ball to a cutter (Nene (27th) in Ast-to-Pass% among Centers).

    Because the forwards this season are being trained to act quickly, if Harden collapses the defense and kicks out and the shot is not there, the forwards can reset the look to Harden, Gordon, or Bev and actually get another full action in rather than panicking with the shot clock running down. :eek:
     
    #18 DonKnock, Dec 4, 2016
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  19. Drogba

    Drogba Member

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    Harden has been missing a lot of easy layups this season. Not sure why anyone's surprised by his stats.
     
    #19 Drogba, Dec 4, 2016
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  20. SF3isBack!!

    SF3isBack!! Member

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    Brewer needs to go. He still dribbles the ball off his own feet and sucks at three's cant defend because he's always gambling, hell no he has to go.
     
    #20 SF3isBack!!, Dec 4, 2016
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