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The real reason we don't have a strong team.

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by NewYorker, May 8, 2007.

  1. NewYorker

    NewYorker Ghost of Clutch Fans

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    Looking at the rosters in the last 9 or so years....

    1998-1999

    We had one future asset - Cutino Mobley. One.

    We drafted a bunch of guys (Bryce Drew, Michael Dickerson, and Nachbar) - but only Nachbar would turn into something. We had Othella Harrington - and undersized pf. Our starters were about to all be gone....

    If ever there was a time to rebuild - it was here. Not as in let's get back to a ring - but - let's stack up on talent.

    1999-2000

    So we picked up Shandon Anderson, Kelvin Cato, Steve Francis, and Kenny Thomas.

    Looks like we are heading in the right direction - although Mr. Anderson is a bust, we stil have Francis, Mobley, Cato, and Thomas to build around.

    2000-2001

    We get Jason Collier, Dan Langhi, and Walt Williams.

    Yawn. A wasted year.

    2001-2002

    We trade away Richard Jefferson for Eddie Griffin.
    We acquire Glen Rice

    Another wasted year - actually - a move that would cost us an all-star

    2002-2003

    We draft Yao Ming in our biggest win since Hakeem

    Nachbar joins the team, and we pick up Mo Taylor (why?) , and James Posey

    We have a great young core - but not mature talent. This is a young fun, exciting team to watch. We're loaded with talent - finally. But it's raw and years away from developing.

    2003-2004

    The arrival of JVG. Things go nuts - we get a bunch of older more mature players. Kenny Thomas is gone. We pick up Jim Jackson, Charles Oakley, Clarence Weathersppon, Mark Jackson, and others.

    Here's the critical error. JVG plays to win now with a team that can't win now. In a changing league moving to favor athleticism - we get older and more experienced. We begin to trade potential for give me something now. Or rather - give me anything now.

    2004-2005

    The big trade. T-mac, Jho, Vin Baker, Jon Barry, Bowen, Mike James, Deke, Rod Strickland, David Wesley, Bob Sura in.

    Out: Francis, Mobley, Cato - leaving us with just Bostjan Nachbar and Yao Ming as a young core of talented players to build around. That's it!

    2005-2006

    We pay for an aging roster when t-mac gets injured and other injuries to bob sura expose us for what we are - not a very good team sans Yao.

    Acquisitions of Derek Anderson (old) and Stromile Swift (unproven) lead to nothing. Another wasted year where we didn't get better. In fact, we let go of a young talent in Boki.

    MIke James for Rafer is even at best, but we do pick up some young mid range talent in Hayes and Head.

    2006-2007

    Out goes many older players (showing their short-term value) and we pick up Shane Battier (once again trading away youth for experience now), and sign Bonzi Wells in hopes of deepening our roster and getting a 3rd scorer. We pick up Vspan and Novack - both not NBA ready.

    We all know the results all too well.

    We've gone many years now as a team of two or three stars surrounded by super young talent or rapidly aging role-players....or journey men.

    It's a forumula that doesn't work. Not in today's NBA.

    Conclusion:

    Stop trading away undelovped youth for guys with a year or two left in the tank. Stop buying high and selling low. We aren't close to winning and yet we went for the win. You can't do that. You have to build a contender by hording talent and then making that final trade or transaction to bring you to the promised land.

    Besides T-mac and Yao - who do we have that gets mentioned as a great player? Look at the Suns or Golden State, or even Utah, and the names of the guys who do their roles well just go on and on. Deron Williams, Mehmet Okur, AK-37, Boozer, Harping, Girechek, Fishcher, Milisap. We'd love to have any of those guys on our team. Any!

    Do you think Utah, GS, Dallas, or Phoenix would care to have Rafer Alston? How about Luther Head? Or Chuck Hayes? Juwon Howard?

    We need to start acquiring talent - and forget about trying to win a ring in one swell swoop. Champions are built over time - not born over night. Every year it's - this is the trade that will bring us a ring.

    That's fool's gold. Let's forget about the ring - and just worry about building long-term success. We need not a one year plan, but a 3 year one. What can we do over 3 years to build a super-strong contender?
     
  2. vlaurelio

    vlaurelio Contributing Member

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    Solution:

    Fire JVG!
     
  3. barbourdg

    barbourdg Contributing Member

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    Wow Nachbar has been in the league a long time :confused: Or did you mean Turcan the Turkey, who never did anything in the league :eek: :eek:
     
  4. Luckyazn

    Luckyazn Contributing Member

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    We should have KEPT NACHBAR I felt he would more of a "thrown in" for the Jim Jackson trade :rolleyes:



    Tmac
    Yao
    Shane
    Nachbar
    Rafer

    Bonzi, Head, Deke
     
  5. blazer_ben

    blazer_ben Rookie

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    Youre acting like boki was a star player here. everytime he went on the floor he had a 1-8 or 2-11 shooting nights. he sealed he's own faith.
    When we pickedup Taylor, the guy was young and he was puttingup 20 and 9 for the clippers. lot of teams were after he"s signature.
    You dont think a 2 TIME LEAGUE SCORING CHAMP AND 5 TIME ALLSTAR IS NOT WORTH TRADING FRANCIS AND cat for because it leaves us with a supposed lack of drain in the youth department?. besides last season, we've had 2 50 plus win seasons with mac and yao. with francis the best win loss season we had was 45.
     
  6. DonkeyMagic

    DonkeyMagic Contributing Member

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    2001-2002 was the real stinker. 3 completely wasted 1st round pick. just mindboggling.
     
  7. Old Man Rock

    Old Man Rock Contributing Member

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    Of all the mistakes the Rockets have made the absolute worst was hiring Jeff Van Gundy. Never before in the history of the Rockets organization have they had an ego-maniacal, self indulging, manipulative, tyrant for a coach. And the fans were forcefed him for 4 years. What a disiaster. This will go down as one of the biggest mistakes in Rocket history. Support the Rockets got to www.firejvg.com!!!
     
  8. pirc1

    pirc1 Contributing Member

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    Let's see how does this Morey guy handles this team. Hopefully they did hire Thomas II.
     
  9. blazer_ben

    blazer_ben Rookie

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    Kep you're blood pressure ol chap. he's gone. you can breath again.
     
  10. subtomic

    subtomic Contributing Member

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    Actually it was 4 - we traded a future 1st round pick (which was owed to us by Detroit for trading the rights to Mirsad Turckan) for Terrance Morris as well.

    What was equally frustrating is that we traded Glen Rice AND a pick to Utah for John Amaechi. Given that Rice's contract was expiring, I don't get why we made that trade.
     
  11. DonkeyMagic

    DonkeyMagic Contributing Member

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    yeah. trading jefferson and then passing zach randolph, tony parker or even gerald wallace for griffin was a much better decision. :rolleyes:

    support the rockets. stop trying to look for a scapegoat. Take of the rocket red glasses people. this team has major player personnel flaws.
     
  12. one blood

    one blood Member

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    very nice post dude.very well thought out and and put in words.
     
  13. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Contributing Member

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    I think it is easy to get distracted by the particulars of past roster moves -- the Griffin mistake, the Thomas/Posey mistake, etc. -- but ignoring that stuff, I do agree with you that our problem has been (especially in the JVG years, though I don't blame him) mortgaging the future to try to hit a homerun in the current year... but not having enough talent to do it. We do it with the roster moves and with playing time. We had a good season 2 years ago, but we'd probably be happier today if we had sacrificed that success for some players with growth potential that we could have harvested this season. It seems to me that this last offseason, we started to take a longer view with V-Span, Lucas, Snyder, etc. Hopefully, we don't ditch them to get just a little more juice for next season.
     
  14. bladeage

    bladeage Contributing Member

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    if the bulls can do it, we can do it.
     
  15. rayrocket

    rayrocket Member

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    Great post, history is HD mirror, Rockets management is kind of weak.
    JVG is the guy who uses or say trust his old budies, this is ridiculous. Jeff dislike European players without reason, but he was simply defeated by AK47 and Okur. JVG does not allow CD or Dream to train Yao, only trust his old centers and assistant coach, those guys did good job, but it would be better if Yao got earlier help from CD or Dream. To be honesest, I think JVG is a perfect assistanst coach and he will never turn out to be a master head coach. Look at Sloan or Nelson, they make quick changes anytime is a game, they are top hunting dogs with sharp nose and eyes. JVG is always sticking to his "old" stuff and thoughts, and even notes in pocket, he trust those things more than his eyes. He is so predictable. And most of all, a coach can not develop young or new players will never be a great coach.

    Fire JVG, get rid of Rafer.Coach is the brain of a team, PG is the commander on court. JVG and Rafer brought us that miserable loss. Look at Deron or BD, why can not we find a good pg?

    That is all what I what, how about you?
     
  16. blazer_ben

    blazer_ben Rookie

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    The bulls went through a patch where the regulary had a lottery pick due to there horrendus record. they were litterally thrash for that period. i dont wanna see the rockets go through tht period.
     
  17. zhangstein

    zhangstein Member

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    I have seen many trade scenarios here on the forum, assuming the other teams' management is so dumb that they would trade their assets for our throw-aways.
    It turns out the Rox' management is the dumb ones :eek:
     
  18. count_dough-ku

    count_dough-ku Contributing Member

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    I won't criticize the Battier/Gay trade. Rudy Gay could be terrific in a few years, but Battier was a good fit for a team looking to win right now. With T-Mac's fragile back and Yao suddenly unable to play more than 50 games a season the last two years, you can't afford a 3-year plan. Never mind the fact that the Rockets organization would have a hard time selling that idea to a fanbase that hasn't seen a playoff series victory in over a decade now.

    That being said, the personnel moves by the front office have been for the most part disasterous. Not only were a lot of their free agent signings and draft choices piss poor, but they wasted valuable lottery picks and used up any remaining cap space.

    I guess if you wanna look at the bright side(if there is one following a Game 7 loss at home), the organization can no longer ignore the fact that the NBA has evolved and without some young, athletic players around Yao and T-Mac, it's gonna be near impossible to accomplish anything in a loaded Western Conference. Which is why Van Gundy's probably on his way out. He refuses to accept that the game has changed.
     
  19. tinman

    tinman Contributing Member
    Supporting Member

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    This is a great thread. Here's a history lesson on how to build a championship team. Slowly add good pieces and subtract bad pieces.


    1987-88 Houston Rockets
    Hakeem Olajuwon
    Purvis Short
    Rodney McCray
    Allen Leavell
    Sleepy Floyd

    1988-89 Houston Rockets

    Hakeem Olajuwon
    Otis Thorpe
    Vernon Maxwell


    1990-91 Houston Rockets
    Otis Thorpe
    Vernon Maxwell
    Kenny Smith
    Hakeem Olajuwon
    Matt Bullard

    1991-92 Houston Rockets
    Hakeem Olajuwon
    Otis Thorpe
    Vernon Maxwell
    Kenny Smith
    Matt Bullard
    Carl Herrera


    1992-93 Houston Rockets
    Hakeem Olajuwon
    Kenny Smith
    Vernon Maxwell
    Otis Thorpe
    Robert Horry
    Carl Herrera
    Matt Bullard
    Scott Brooks

    1993-94 Houston Rockets (CHAMPS)
    Hakeem Olajuwon
    Otis Thorpe
    Vernon Maxwell
    Kenny Smith
    Robert Horry
    Mario Elie
    Sam Cassell

    Scott Brooks
    Carl Herrera
    Matt Bullard
     
  20. blazer_ben

    blazer_ben Rookie

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    So all we got for a expiring contract and a pick was boobs man?....
     
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