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The Obama Foreign Policy

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Major, Aug 24, 2011.

  1. Major

    Major Member

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    Lost in all the economic talk is that Obama has been exceptionally successful in the foreign policy arena - something that most Presidents struggle with early on simply because it's a whole new world. Beyond the fact that the exact strategy the GOP criticized - Obama putting people on the ground in Pakistan without Pakistani approval - was what got OBL, Libya now stands as a crowning achievement for him - and possibly the template for the Obama Doctrine:

    http://globalpublicsquare.blogs.cnn.com/2011/08/23/a-new-era-in-u-s-foreign-policy/?hpt=hp_c1

    A new era in U.S. foreign policy


    Back in March, many neoconservatives in Washington were extremely dismissive of the way President Obama was handling the intervention in Libya. They argued that he was doing too little and acting too late – that his approach was too multilateral and lacked cohesiveness. They continuously criticized President Obama for, in the words of an anonymous White House advisor, "leading from behind."

    But now that these critics are confronted with the success of the Libya operation, they are changing their tune and claiming paternity of the operation. They are further arguing that if their advice had been heeded, the intervention in Libya would have been swifter and even more successful. But the Libya intervention is so significant precisely because it did not follow the traditional pattern of U.S.-led interventions. Indeed, it launched a new era in U.S. foreign policy.

    The United States decided that it was only going to intervene in Libya if it could establish several conditions:

    1) A local group that was willing to fight and die for change; in other words, "indigenous capacity".

    2) Locally recognized legitimacy in the form of the Arab League's request for intervention.

    3) International legitimacy in the form of United Nations Security Council Resolution 1973.

    4) Genuine burden sharing with the British and French spelling out precisely how many sorties they would be willing to man and precisely what level of commitment they would be willing to provide.

    It was only when all those conditions were fulfilled that the Obama Administration agreed to play a pivotal but supporting role in the Libya operation.

    It is important to emphasize that even though it was a "supporting role," the U.S. was indispensable to the operation. Nobody else could have eliminated Gadhafi's air defenses – and, effectively, his air force - within three days. Without America, the operation in Libya could not have taken place. But the U.S. was also "supporting" in the sense that after these initial strikes, it moved into the background and asked its NATO partners to do the heavy lifting. Thereafter, the U.S. intervened only when it felt it needed to. All of this suggests a very different model for intervention, which I believe is a vast improvement over the old, expansive and expensive model.

    The new model does two things:

    First, it ensures that there's genuinely a local alliance committed to the same goals as the external coalition. This way, there is more legitimacy on the ground. And if there is anything Afghanistan and Iraq have taught us, it is that local legitimacy is key.

    Second, this model ensures that there is genuine burden sharing so that the United States is not left owning the country as has happened so often in the past.

    Compared to the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, the Libya operation was a bargain. It cost the U.S. about $1 billion. The wars in Iraq and Afghanistan collectively cost the U.S. $1.3 trillion. In other words, success in Libya could be achieved at less than one-tenth of one percent of the cost of the interventions in Iraq and Afghanistan. That's not a bad model for the future.

    Now there are critics of this approach on both the right and left. Some on the left – the great liberal internationalists – are horrified by the fact that people in Benghazi cheered for French President Nicolas Sarkozy. They think only President Obama's name should be on the lips of the liberated Libyans.But there is actually nothing wrong with a world in which the Europeans are also associated with the cause of freedom and liberty. It means that they will also be more willing to bear some of the burdens and pay some of the costs of intervention. And it means they are more likely to be involved in the difficult process of reconstruction.

    The old model of American leadership - where we took all the decisions, bore all the burdens, paid all the costs and took all the glory – has to change. People in Washington are going to have to realize that when other countries step up to the plate, they too will naturally get some share of credit. It's more important that Libya be saved than that Washington is seen as the sole savior.

    In the future, we will again have to follow this limited model of intervention. The United States is not going to have the kind of defense budget nor the national will to engage in a series of major military operations in countries that are, frankly, not vital to our national interests. Defense Secretary Robert Gates was very clear and he was right: Libya is not vital to our national interest. The point, however, was that the Libyan revolution was an important event in the context of the Arab Spring and that if we could be helpful, it would be of great benefit to Libya and to America.

    The question before Libya was: Could such interventions be successful while keeping costs under control - both human and financial.

    Today's answer is: Yes.
     
  2. SacTown

    SacTown Member

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    He handled the situation in Egypt well too by staying on the sidelines.
     
  3. ILoveTheRockets

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    I was just ridiculed for two days for saying Obama is one of the finest military minds we have had in the white house.

    For a democratic president to do what he has done with our military is inspiring. If he could of gotten a grip on the economy I am sure nearly every American would be agreeing with the statement. When it comes to our military, President Obama is a champ in that regard.

    I just can't see him fulfilling the promises on job growth.
     
  4. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    It is interesting that the Obama Presidency is starting to resemble the GH Bush Presidency in many aspects.
     
  5. Major

    Major Member

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    Agreed - he seems to have a much better grasp on foreign policy than he does on connecting with people on the economics. He's going to have to change that quickly if he wants to win against a Romney type in 2012.
     
  6. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

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    George HW Bush had to run against Bill Clinton, a master of the public display of empathy.

    Romney's only display of empathy tends to come through when your last name is Inc., L.P. or LLC.
     
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  7. Major

    Major Member

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    Agreed - but Obama's economy is much worse than Bush's (which was a pretty minor recession). If people view Obama as disconnected from their problems, then the challenger really just has to pass the threshold of "not crazy" more so than "I love him". Clinton got the latter, which made things that much easier and helped against Bush's "war hero" status. I'll be curious to see both if Obama can improve his image and if Romney can present himself as not-crazy. And then the other question, which addresses your point more directly, what happens if both candidates seem disconnected from people's problems?
     
  8. Nook

    Nook Member

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    I don't think that anyone would be doing much better on the issue of job growth. Obama took over and only the tip of the iceberg of our economic woe was known....

    Poorly placed taxation, runaway spending, and fighting wars for 8 years put Obama squarely behind the 8-ball.

    Having said that, he has not made radical cuts as needed, nor has he increased the tax burden on the top 1%.
     
  9. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Contributing Member

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    I think this article is jumping the gun a bit. We have backed local insurgencies many times before and had things go a lot worse than this. Besides, the story arc of Libya's revolution is only half done and can still end up a disaster. Will civil war now break out between factions of the victors? Will foreign interests (besides us) hijack the revolution to their own ends? Will the power vacuum get filled by another backward and/or anti-American dictator? The whole thing can still turn in ways that might make us wish we had a more active role in the process. I think it's dangerous to be more than cautiously optimistic.
     
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  10. Carl Herrera

    Carl Herrera Contributing Member

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    Obama foreign policy = Daryl Morey basketball policy: priority #1 is to avoid signing long-term bad contracts. Dubya gave us a real Mo Taylor contract in Iraq. Whatever happens to Libya, at least it won't end up as costly to the US at Iraq and limit our ability to sign free agents.
     
  11. Classic

    Classic Member

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    True, Libya has been pretty Bonzi Wells'ish
     
  12. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

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    which makes Afghanistan Juwan Howard . . . good at first but then a drag and now just won't freaking go away.
     
  13. justtxyank

    justtxyank Contributing Member

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    Seriously. I feel like I'm in crazyland all of a sudden. Libya's rebellion has suddenly taken a turn for the better, but the dictator is still at large and no government has been formed and now this is an amazing foreign policy achievement and Obama is one of the "finest military minds" to sit in the White House?

    Slow down cowboy.
     
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  14. geeimsobored

    geeimsobored Contributing Member

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    Well what recent examples are there for supporting movements like the Libyan ones? I'm sure there are some I just cant think of any
     
  15. Major

    Major Member

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    I don't think anyone is saying this will turn out perfectly - no one can know that for years or decades. But it does create a template for how to effectively intervene in a foreign situation: get international support, get local support, support an in-country commitment rather than intervening directly, etc.

    The point is that not that everything is perfect. But it's that the west was able to intervene in such a way that created conditions ideal for a country to stand on its own two feet, without the extensive cost in $$ or lives of other interventions. Whether Libya succeeds from here is up to the people of Libya - but that's exactly how it should be. It's not for the US to determine their future; our job was simply to give them the opportunity by helping liberate them from a dictator.
     
  16. justtxyank

    justtxyank Contributing Member

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    How can you possibly say we created conditions "ideal for a country to stand on its own two feet" when that has not happened yet? If radical extremists take over then what? Is the template no longer good?
     
  17. Major

    Major Member

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    They've eliminated a generally unpopular dictator. The rebels seem to have the support of the people. There are no foreign troops on the ground dictating things. The "civil war" last months instead of years like you see in many cases. From what we know, the rebels haven't engaged in reprisals, mass murder, rape, etc that a lot of rebel groups do. There seem to be plenty of advance planning already in place to try to develop a Constitution and governing structure. There doesn't appear to have been looting or widespread chaos throughout the country - basic government seems to still be functioning. The core infrastructure of the country is still intact.

    All of these things are GREAT - and often things that are forgotten about in these types of situations. It may not hold - and if so, that will be a failure. But the conditions are about as ideal as you can get in a situation like this. All the pieces are in place.

    Iraq's not a perfect example, but compare all these things to what we did there: where we blew up the country's roads, bridges and basic infrastructure; where we didn't secure the support of the people; where it became an outside invasion creating a staunch resistance; where there was no local leadership in place; no planning for a Constitution or local governing body; tons of looting, destruction, etc; no basic security for the population; lots of revenge against Saddam's regime (killings, booting everyone from the army, etc); etc. That's an example of having all the conditions in place for failure.
     
  18. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Contributing Member

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    I don't want to take the trouble of naming one only to have some wiseguy come and poke a hole in it because it differed on this or that point. I think Libya's insurgency might have been a better prospect than our usual clients because they already controlled half the country before we jumped in.

    It's too ealry to call it a template. We may not have perfect hindsight for decades, but even a year or tow will give us a lot of perspective. This point in time is like in Iraq right after the shock and awe campaign and the collapse of Saddam's government. At that moment, our invasion looked pretty good. A year later, people were making jokes about Mission Accomplished.

    Besides that, adhering to these standards may mean the template can't be applied anywhere else. Libya was some low-hanging fruit, with half the country already in rebel hands and Europeans already chomping at the bit to do something. Where else will we find a regime already teetering as it is, betrayed by regional allies, and abandoned by UN power-brokers? If it happens again, than sure why not?

    Of course, that means sitting out most of the time and not intervening in the politics of other countries, which I'm perfectly fine with. But the US has a hard time sitting on its hands.
     
  19. Carl Herrera

    Carl Herrera Contributing Member

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    One thing that folks worried about the rise of "fundamentalists" and "radicals" in Libya after the fall of Qaddafi tend to forget is that there's no guarantee that leaving Qaddafi in place wouldn't run an even higher risk of resulting in the rise of the "fundamentalists" and "radicals" in the upcoming years. specifically, Qadaffi may well have crushed this rebellion without NATO air power, but it doesn't mean there would not be another rebellion, possibly led by people who are more detrimental to U.S. interests than the current group.

    What people need to realize is that the U.S. and NATO do not really get to choose to have the Qaddafis (and the Ben Alis and Mubaraks) stay in place if internal pressure is strong enough.
     
  20. justtxyank

    justtxyank Contributing Member

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    Look Major, I'm not knocking this policy. I just don't think saying it was a success yet is wise either. We didn't blow up infrastructure in Iran when the Shah fell. That didn't work out too well. As far as the civil war lasting months not years, lol wut? Did I miss the end of the war and the peaceful establishment of government on my twitter feed? Saddam fell relatively quickly as well. There were celebrations in the streets remember? They were knocking over his statue remember?

    You are giving credit for things that haven't happened yet. For all we know, 6 months from now war could still be going on in Libya between radicals and moderates, between Qaddafi's tribe and the other tribes, etc. etc. Hell, Qaddafi is still in Libya!
     

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