The inevitable September Collapse of the Texas Rangers

Discussion in 'Houston Astros' started by SooneRockStro, Aug 30, 2016.

  1. Major

    Major Member

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    Except I didn't ignore the slumps - I specifically did exactly the opposite. *Including* the slump, the Astros have been every bit as good as the Rangers for 4 months now. That's the whole point.
     
  2. PokeJ

    PokeJ Member

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    Then why don't you just use the entire season?
     
  3. Hey Now!

    Hey Now! Contributing Member

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    Come on... pointing out statistical anomalies is a far cry from delusion. No one is invalidating the Rangers; validating the Astros. It is what it is. And anyone who thinks the Astros are better than the Rangers are not very astute and their opinion should be disregarded.

    But... to find a patch of gray... again, the numbers support the staggering one-sided nature of the rivalry being completely unsustainable. The Astros are 149-114 against every other MLB team since 2015. That's a 91-win pace. Losing 24 of 32 to *any* team - good or bad - over the same period is... inexplicable and is (hopefully) predictive of a leveling in the not-so-distant future.
     
  4. Hey Now!

    Hey Now! Contributing Member

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    Yeah, except... they were losing 100 games just three years ago. Routinely. So to already be seemingly impatient after literally one season of success seems... well, like you need to be reminded that, prior to last year, they lost 416 games over a four-year stretch, didn't post a winning record for six straight years, and hadn't been to the postseason since 2005.

    As someone who used to live and die with my sports teams, I can tell ya - sports is soooooooooo much better with context. Each their own, and all... I get it. But I won't feel unsatisfied if '94-'95 is all I ever get. I mean, we could be Cub fans...

    I would replace "bitch" with "dumb" - anyone saying that is not very smart.
     
  5. Nimo

    Nimo Member

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    I love hope...finding patches of gray. It's what makes us keep watching the scoreboard every night. Sometimes the analytics predict the scoreboard; sometimes they don't. But the scoreboard is still what we watch for real progress.

    As an astros fan, I'm not scared of the Rangers. Every day is a new day; every game is a new game.
     
  6. Major

    Major Member

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    I'm not sure what you're suggesting. I already said April counts as much as anything else. But I would hope people see a difference between the team the Astros have today and the one they had in April. Using data from April to decide how good the team is going forward just seems like a stupid idea.
     
  7. jim1961

    jim1961 Member

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    Last year we had a great April (15-7) and a terrible September (11-16).

    http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/HOU/2015-schedule-scores.shtml

    It works both ways.
     
  8. MadMax

    MadMax Contributing Member

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    Are you talking about the front office? I'm not. I said a segment of the fan base. And yes, there is a loud blogger group in the Astros fan base that says exactly that.
     
  9. MadMax

    MadMax Contributing Member

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    You think it's arrogant or prideful to expect that a MLB franchise win at least 1 World Series in 55 seasons?
     
  10. MadMax

    MadMax Contributing Member

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    delete. Duplicate post
     
    #70 MadMax, Sep 1, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2016
  11. Houstunna

    Houstunna Contributing Member

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    They're good, just not 20-games-over-.500 good.

    Except.... that's ridiculous

    Ridiculous comparison...

    1) Chicago wins championships, Houston does not.
    2) Cubs have equal WS appearances as Astros last 70 years.
    3) Cubs fans can, at least, enjoy popularity regardless of wins.
     
    #71 Houstunna, Sep 1, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2016
  12. Major

    Major Member

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    Yes - not sure what your point is. Everyone agreed that the team needed to improve the bullpen (the main failing in the late season collapse) because the struggles at the end of the season were more representative of the team we had going forward than the awesome April was.

    Similarly, looking forward, the team we have today is more representative than the team we had in April.
     
  13. Major

    Major Member

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    So you're annoyed that a segment of the fan base looks at the long-term picture instead of just demanding "WIN NOW!!!" ?

    I wouldn't say arrogant or prideful. I'd say silly. This team has nothing to do with the last 54 seasons. You're putting a silly burden of expectations on them if you complain that anything less than a championship isn't good enough because of what 5 decades of random other players did before them.
     
  14. MadMax

    MadMax Contributing Member

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    Ok thanks :)


    EDIT: coming back to say the first point is a complete misstatement of my position which is probably my fault for not being clearer

    Second point is about perspective. The Cubs are the Cubs because of their history. Totally unfair to the team kicking ass today there. But they are. The Yankees are the Yankees because they won 26 titles. That says nothing of their team today, but it's true regardless.

    Bottom line: I want to see this team win a title before die. Really don't feel like that's illogical or irrational. It bothers me my grandparents, who were huge fans, never got to see one. I've lived through lots of different owners and GMs and players. I'll still be a fan after these guys are gone and moved on. Asking for a franchise to find a way to win 1 title in 55 years or so. I don't feel like it's asking a whole lot. And I don't think expecting that is silly given we are one of just a few that haven't won a title in that span.
     
    #74 MadMax, Sep 1, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2016
  15. jim1961

    jim1961 Member

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    I suppose my point was that representation does not always equate to the win/loss column in as short a time as a month.

    Said another way, the team of April may not have been as bad, nor the team of now as good, as the one month w/l totals might tend to indicate.
     
  16. jim1961

    jim1961 Member

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    I read your post as We deserve it because we have been 55 years without a title. Your later post makes what you meant a bit clearer.

    Rather than deserve, I feel we must earn a title.
     
  17. MadMax

    MadMax Contributing Member

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    As a fan. Honestly. I kinda feel like I have earned it. :)
     
  18. MadMax

    MadMax Contributing Member

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    I get that many of you connect with this team differently than I do. That's all good. Some are probably way more clinical about it than I am. Clearly. I readily admit being the Pythagorean theorem champs means nothing to me. My connection with the Houston Astros is deep and emotional and has a lot to do with my relationship with my grandparents and now my sons. I just wanna see them be the last team standing once before I die. Just once. If that's silly or illogical or whatever else then whatever.
     
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  19. Hey Now!

    Hey Now! Contributing Member

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    Ridiculous how, exactly?... That was a factual statement: three years ago, the Astros lost 100+ games for the third year in a row.

    1) We're talking about baseball:
    2) Let's level the playing field since none of us are 70 years old: since 1962, when the Astros started playing baseball, they've been to the World Series once and the postseason 10 times; the Cubs: 0 and 7. You think being a Cub fan was better over that stretch?
    3) Who gives a flying **** how popular a team is? That makes losing more enjoyable? That's bonkers.
     
  20. Hey Now!

    Hey Now! Contributing Member

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    But it doesn't mean anything *to anyone* - you're using it, at least as it reads here, condescendingly - it's very nerds/mom's basement sounding (which may not be intentional but, that's how I'm reading it, at least). There's no shame in processing results with fewer (no) emotions.

    We're all, at some level, in the same camp: disappointed. I mean, no one here is *happy* they've never won a World Series. How we process that, though, can be different. And then we come here and exchange all of those perspectives and hopefully, move some of our needles. Right?

    I'm a (mostly) silver lining guy because I find rampant negativity burdensome. I don't watch sports to celebrate championships; I watch sports to be entertained and amazed. I would never suggest everyone should absolutely adopt my perspective (though, I'm telling you.... it is SOOOOOOOOO much more fun) - but that's where I come from. I'll find hope in a pile of dirt or I'll find something better to do.
     
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