Oh really? The nuggetts are about to cough up anthony, who on the rockets would trump the youth and production of wilson chandler, the upside of randolph, the 12m contract of curry and the pick?
yao's contract trumps curry day in and day out. we could even take back another player and provide significantly more cost savings. randolph is a bust. i don't care about the hard on clutchfans has for the guy, he's a dumbass with nothing between his ears. on the rockets, PPat would trump him. chandler is an intriguing player and the best part of this package. with yao's contract involved, i think they can look past this for a budinger type player, but the inclusion of twill could definitley do it. Do i think twill is in the same idiot mold as randolph? sure, but he's had less strikes against him and would be a player with the upside the nugs crave. but but but, the nuggets didn't want him and that's why he was traded to the rox for a first. no, the nugs didn't want him back for anthony. but for nene, they would be more inclined to take a risk, especially if they achieve salary cap flexibility and have subsequently attained several picks from the anthony trade.
Studdog, please tell me why Yao contract trumps curry's when oth are expiring. While you're at it, tell me who you would prefer to handle the sf post carmello, chandler or anything the rockets have. Say what you will about randolph, but his upside along with favors is far better than what the rockets have also. The fact that when he played consistent minutes in gsw he played well and he would be going to play for a coach that had shawn kemp early in his development. Lets do this and this may or not happen with Nene,but for package sake, lets put it on the table. We're going to assume carmello is gone. We will also assume the nuggets salary stays the same post anthony. If you're denver, would you prefer Curry(11m),Chandler(2m) and randolph(2m) for Nene(11m) and Smith(6m) or the package of Yao(17m) and chase,lee,or whomever you're trying to throw in?
have you forgotten the $8M insurance payout with Yao's contract? It's instant ROI. did you look at the players I suggested? or are you just frustrated with the rockets current position and want to just discount everything. and btw, i'm merely stating we can trump their offer. I'm not sure I would. Nene, while a clear upgrade, is continually injured and doesn't represent a "get us over the top" player. I don't want retreads and would prefer to begin the ardous task of attaining draft picks and building through the draft.
Studdog, the rockets and nuggetts will still have to be between the 25% +100k. So even with the insurance, both parties will have to use the rule. Yao is on the books for 17m, nene 11m,the rockets are still going to have to take back a 2m dollar player. So lets say its affalo for debating purposes, the nuggetts are now giving up nene and affalo for a contract? At least they're getting 2 guys who can play right now with upside.
leebigez - there are sevral possibilities available in the +/- 25k range. We have endless flexibility. for starters take the following deal. yao, bud and patterson for nene and jrsmith we also have the ability to take al harrington if we really needed to facilitate the trade. again, i'm not necessarily for this unless the price for nene is more like a bud/jhill package with yao, but reality says noone wants hill and the demand for bud is only slightly greater. i think it would take ppat and thug-will and that is just more than i am willing to pay.
As far as Randolph>Patterson, HELL NO!. Randolph is esentially Jordan Hill with possibly better skills.
leebigez, I'd fall somewhere in between you and studogg. I think that the Rockets CAN put together a better package for Nene and Denver's junk. It sounds like the Nuggets have other offers for Smith, so they could probably dump his expiring contract for salary relief and/or a pick fairly easily. Like studogg, I'm not a huge Randolph fan. While I like Chandler, I think his numbers are largely a product of D'Antoni's system. I think a package of Yao, Hill and Budinger for Nene, Smith and Balkman saves Denver more money (this year and beyond) than the New York deal.
If your scenario (Bud/Hill) can get it done, then I'm all for it. It would provide a legit starting center and free up minutes for players that I think need to play (PPat/TWill). I think Denver will want more talent and will demand at least one of PPat/Twill and probably both; especially since Smith is a noteable player. I wouldn't be surprised if they also asked for a draft pick, like this years second round pick. (very valuable to a good gm--high second rounder with a non-guaranteed deal. perfect for a euro pick and stash or overlooked player.
I choose to believe the Rox will use Yao's DPE by 1/31. You bubble-busting party-poopers seem pretty sure they won't. While your smugness shakes my faith a bit, I think there are reasons it could happen: 1) The big stuff will happen in a whirlwind, near the trade deadline. If we get a significant part of our business done by 1/31, we can focus on the big stuff. For instance, we can get a decent defensive center now, and spend all our energies near the deadline looking for semi-blockbusters that give us a good bump in talent. 2) We do have to worry that the good trades will disappear before we get our shot. I am sure that other teams have to think of this, too. For instance, a team that is looking for a 7-footer with upside might jump at the chance to get Hill now, rather than waiting for a perfect deal later. Of course, the DPE deal is the main feast; the Hill trade would just be a part of it. Likewise, there is reason for us to do a deal that might slip away if we wait until the last minute.
Shouldn't the Rockets be leery of getting Nene considering he has a early termination option on his contract. I can see him opting out of his final year and deciding to go to a contending team.
Bima, the thing NY has over the rockets besides the best player in the deal in chandler and the one with the greatest upside in randolph, they don't care about the lt which we know the rockets are always leery of. Even if they took out smith,which is a possibility and added balkman, ny doesnt mind taking on those contracts. I'm not saying it will happen and as crazy as it sounds, the nj,den,ny might be involved together with denver getting the picks they want.
typical "cheapskate owner" fallback position. do you really think we just applied for a DPE for Yao and have no intent to be over the lux tax? we already have a TE that is roughly the same value. we also have some smaller TE's and we are currently over. what in this situation tells you that we won't go over teh luxtax for the right deal?
I will sig bet you like i did Bima in the off season there is no way in hell the rockets will be over the lux tax. When the all in motto was used in terms of keeping and matching lowry and scola, we made a sig bet. Well as you see, the ariza tpe is still unused and i suspect the exception they got from yao will be also. The rockets are 3m above,but by trade deadline, they will be under. Care to do a sig bet? This team is more than a 6.3m player away from being serious. They have the dpe and the tpe, but those are small money players. Now if they had a 15m tpe like toronto or cleveland have or like utah had in which they used for jefferson, then thats another deal. Show me a 6.3m dollar player the rockets can trade for that would be worth paying dollar for dollar for and the team winds up in the lotto?
i'd love a sig bet for the right bet. however, while i don't think les is a cheapskate and would go over the cap for the right player, i believe the cost of playes like nene, kaman, camby, et al, are going to be higher than what we are willing to pay. when faced with this situation, i think morey will sell off shane and jefferies and reduce salary while capturing a late first and a second.
Don't know if I want to give up most of our assets for Nene, and whatever. Solid, but not a real rim protector. No way I include PPat. Thing that might make a cost-conscious Denver give pause is that both players will be up for a new contract for next season(iirc).
Actually, NY is more worried about cap room than Houston. The Knicks want to clear room in 2012 for Paul or D. Williams badly. Houston is taking an approach of rebuilding via trade. Hence, if any team would take on additional long term salary, it would be Houston. Also, Denver specifically is not interested in Randolph. There's a reason NY is trying to trade him for a first rounder. I'm not saying that NY won't put together a better package for Nene than Houston. But it'll be close.
That last sentence was interesting to say the least. More than likely, the rockets are going to have to give up a pick along with a player to a team to get under the lux tax. Now, if they want a guy like kaman, they could probably just trade Yao contract for him and get under the tax. The rockets would have to take back 25% plus 100k, so they would need to take back about 13m. Kaman makes 11 and butler makes 3. Trading Kaman and butler for Yao would solve 2 problems short term for the rockets. When healthy,just like yao,kaman is a quality center. Problem is he's hurt alot recently and the team has been playing well without him anyway. There have been many people saying this and that about kaman,but he's a pretty good player when he plays. Production wise, he produces more than Nene and they're about the same age. Again,Kaman has been injured alot lately and nene has been playing. If the rockets are still holding on to the "we can be a dangerous team" mantra, Kaman would be a good option. Another option would be Gortat and childress. The suns are in blowup mode right now. Childress has struggled with them and they might be willing to dump him. The rockets wouldnt have to use the contracts of yao,but use the expirings of say shane and jeffries. Childress and gortat for shane and jeffries would get the rockets down the lux tax also and clear money in phoenix. Gortat would give the rockets a young 7ft er and childress plays off the ball well. Both moves would help the rockets get younger and get more 2 way players which they sorely need.
i'm now 50-50 on Gortat...isn't he benched right now over Lopez? it seems that he's not a starter material..lousy stats especially the rebounding numebrs..
