Some statistics questions

Multiply your stat number (blocks, points, rebounds, etc) times 48 and divide by minutes played to get per 48 minute stats.

Per 48 minute stats are basically a way to make mediocre players that don't get much playing time seem respectable. What it fails to do is point out that those players most likely would be a detriment to the team if they DID play starters minutes...

 

LOL, typical A-Train negativity, though with some degree of truth.

To me, per 48 min. stats are kinda like fg% stat, it balances out the mere ppg number. It tells you how efficient a guy is in achieving his total count.

 

That's a freakin great point.

and you beat me to it, but I wanted to state that Kelvin Cato loves this stat because when used for his numbers, he comes across as more productive than he actually is.

 

Not entirely true.

If your comparing two starters and Player A scores 25 ppg and Player B scores 21, player A looks like the better scorer. But if we suddenly note that Player A plays 43 mpg and Player B only 36 then Player B is more productive for 48 minutes.

This type of stat IMO has significance in comparing players on teams with different or longer rotational lengths (Blazers, Kings). It is also a measurement of the frequency with which something is likely to occur.

While it is true that no rotational player can sustain his level of pruductivity over 48 minutes, it is also true that a starters level of productivity is not sustainable due to fatigue.

C'mon A-Train...give the role players a break.

 

Nachbar scores 18.1 pts per 48min and grabs 7 boards.

but, unfortunately, he gets 8.1 fouls per 48 minutes to make it all ridiculous.

a lot of the 48min stats are silly. You can't count blocked shots and rebounding, because a lot of those guys do it with no concern for fouls. You make them a starter, and they'll have foul trouble and the per 48min numbers will go down....rendering them completely useless as stats.

also, spark plugs off the bench are getting numbers against other 2nd stringers and against tired starters. Make them a starter and increase their minutes, and the spark plug faces better competition and he gets tired...thus lower his per 48mpg numbers.

imo, you should only compare per 48min stats between players with similar real mpg....like within a 5 minute range.

 

as someone said, the per 48 minutes or per minute figure has utility, but it's always important to keep them in perspective.


comparing bench players that get 12-24 mpg works

comparing starters that get 32-44 mpg works within reason

comparing a player to his OWN historical numbers works, and is one of the best uses of such stats. I like to track a guy and see how he is doing historically. They typically peak at per minutes production at about 28 years of age.

comparing a players numbers to others who play his position works.

Take rebounding. If you check most players you will find that their rebounding over their career nevers varies more than 20% from the per minute figure their rookie year. A guy plays 12 mpg his rookie year and gets 2.5 rebounds. That's .208 rebounds per minutes or 10 rebounds for 48 minutes.

If he's a guard or a small forward, that is a good number. If he's a center or power forward, he needs to get it better.

My analyses show that the guy who averages .208 rebounds per minute his rookie year will not likely improve that number more than 20%. There are exceptions. I think Dirk was one.



The most important thing to remember is that per minutes is a number which does not speak to overall quality of play, except inferentially. Different guys have different levels of efficiency. Eddie Griffin is best at 20-28 mpg so far. That might change, but it's true now. Playing him too many minutes would affect his production per minute negatively. Fresh legs help all stats.

 

speaking of stats...what is a team rebound?

 

When no one can be credited with a rebound, such as a ball being tipped around on the ground and someone finally grabs it. That's the way I understand it.

 

The most common type of team rebound is when the someone bricks a shot and the ball goes directly out of bounds. Possession turns over to the other team, so a rebound must be credited. But since no one physically got the rebound, it is considered a "team rebound."

 

here's another quirky situation for a team rebound.

ball gets stuck on the rim for a jump ball. does a team rebound get credited to the team who wins the jump?

 

I always thought that the guy who finally grabs it is credited with the rebound. I might be wrong.

Was Horry credited with an offensive rebound for that last second shot after Divac batted the ball out?

Also, if a pass gets tipped by opposing player A and ends up in player B's hand, who gets the steal?

 

Some guys can deliver only in limited time (Cato?) while some need to get into the flow.

Rebounds and blocks seem to be the most disproportionate of the 48 minute stats IMO.

 

Easy,

The person who tips the pass gets the steal. While looking that up, I found this:

A team rebound is awarded for a missed technical foul. seriously. *every* missed shot must have an associated rebound. Straight from an article written by the Milw Bucks and Marquette's Official Scorer.

 

Thanks, HP.

Another situation for team rebound is a missed shot at the buzzer. And I assume that a missed fragrant foul shot is an OFFENSIVE team rebound, right?

 

the Milwaukee Bucks scorekeeper said this:

"For every missed shot attempt a rebound is necessary, even when tipped out of bounds or a free throw is missed from a technical foul."

If the game ends (or quarter) at the point of the ball missing, then I could see no rebound be awarded since time has expired, and certainly the offensive team coming up with a put back after time expires would not get a rebound. But then again, who would have figured a missed technical registers a rebound, albeit the ball not being in play.

 

Can u give a link to the article?
I don't know if that interpretation is correct.

The only thing I found so far:
http://www.nba.com/analysis/00422972.html
"A team rebound is recorded when a team gains possession as a result of a missed shot but no one player gains control of the ball."
There is no gain or change of possesion after a technical foul shot.

 

I found this faq but I doubt its accuracy because it claims team reb is also credited after missed front end of 2 foul shots!

http://faqs.jmas.co.jp/FAQs/sports/basketball/pro-faq


E. What is a team rebound?

A team rebound is defined as any MISSED SHOT that does not fall into
possession of an active, inbound player. The team who takes the
ball next gets gredit for the team rebound.

Examples:
offense gets credit:
a missed front end of 2 free throws

whoever takes possession after gets credit:
a missed technical free throw
a missed field goal or last free throw deflected out-of-bounds
by any active player, too quickly to be a player rebound.
rebound action resulting in a loose ball foul or a jump ball.

defense gets credit:
a missed field goal or last free throw that hits the guy wire
or bounces over the top of the backboard
a missed field goal or last free throw bouncing out-of-bounds
untouched by any active player
a missed field goal that was in the air at the buzzer

 

ragingfire,

you seem to have found a link agreeing with the Milwaukee Bucks official scorer. I don't see the purpose in refuting it.

here's my link:

http://www.gdsassociates.com/news/transactions/vol203.pdf

check the second page.

The guy is a professional NBA and NCAA statistician and he flat out says a team rebound is awarded after a missed technical foul.