With all the discussion about Yao's shortcomings and everything else, I've decided to try and look past personal criticism of Yao's performances and instead concentrate on the larger picture, the larger goal, what we all have been promised by the Rockets' coaches, players, owner, and staff: a team built to win the championship. Whether we admit it or not, this team was built following the 'Shaq-Kobe blueprint' of a dominant dynamic duo: a backcourt guard (the best in the league at the time) and the most dominant big man of our era. The Lakers didn't have much 'talent' per se surrounding them, but they had the 'right fit' players in Horry, Fisher, and players like Glen Rice and Rick Fox; those guys weren't anything special, but they perfectly fit around the two superstars. In case you're wondering where I am going with what I said above, it's simple really: we ain't got that type of 'right fit' players on this team. Another major conclusion I have come to a while back really -- not merely due to Yao's performance tonight -- is that while we're a team built around two superstar-caliber players, in reality we only have ONE superstar, and a solid 2nd option in Yao Ming who gives you more than an adequate inside presence. However, the one thing people here must understand and come to peace with is that while we may have our Kobe (talent-wise, skill-wise, ability-wise), we don't have a Shaq, which is the biggest reason why the Lakers won those rings. More dismaying to me is the fact that the league is only getting tougher to win in, because of the abundance/fusion of talent into this league. The league is also getting younger, and just in our own division we have teams like the Spurs and the Mavs, who're all well-built, incredibly talented and versatile teams. The question I think we all should be asking is this: What are we ALL in this for? What were we promised by the organization? Is it another playoff appearance or is it the championship? The only goal we're shooting for is the championship, and I just don't see it with a team that still struggles to find the right pieces and has two max paid-like-superstars players that leaves little cash left over for improvement on other team deficiencies. Yao has reached his potential as far as his physical abilities will allow him to, and his problems will ALWAYS remain the same and only get worse with age/injuries and the such. It's not due to Yao's own shortcomings, but rather something he has little control over -- I have said from day one that Yao's size will be a hinderance and not a plus, and now I am more convinced that ever of that. So if we're not really a two-superstar-cornerstone team, then do you guys still believe that with the little cash we have left over after Yao and McGrady's contracts we can build a team that will compete and can beat the likes of San Antonio head-to-head? Do you think that a team of Yao and McGrady will be sufficient enough to beat teams loaded with talent (more evened out talent like in Detroit, Miami, or Dallas for example) in a 7-game playoff series? I guess what I am saying is that I believe the ONLY goal we should be shooting for every year is the championship, and if it doesn't look like it, then changes have to be made IF the ultimate goal is to win it all. If we're not going to win it all, then what's exactly the point of Yao and McGrady combo? Is it merely to tease the fans and create hype, or a legitimate attempt to win it all? I thought I would just throw in my two cents on this, so what say you?
The chemistry is just not there. Ask yourself, is Spurs really head and shoulders above other teams? They just have a good system and great chemistry. At the end of last year we were also very good because of our chemistry rather than talent.
I don't see how you can say that when the team is 3-1 with T-Mac playing at full strength. The jury is still out on T-Mac's supporting cast because he hasn't been there for them to support. T-Mac at best makes everyone around him better and at worst makes opposing defenses concentrate on stopping him which opens up more opportunities for everyone else. The whole offense is centered around T-Mac, so of course it's going to struggle when he's not in there. Look, I'm tired of losing too and I'm not trying to make excuses. But we're just not going to win a lot of games over good teams like Dallas, Detroit, Indiana, and San Antonio without T-Mac in the lineup. It's as simple as that.
Good post tigermission. Its still too early to figure out if the pieces we have around Yao and T-mac will fit in like the piecies that the Lakers had during their Championship run. DA and Head have looked good for the past few games and i still think that Swift and Alston will eventually come around sometime this season. As for Yao I totally agree with you. Now more than ever before, i am convinced that he is never going to become that dominant center that many expect him to become. He just doesn't have that "IT" that the superstars have. However, even with 1 superstar and 1 all-star caliber player, i still believe the the Rockets can eventually win a championship in the Yao-Tmac era. As long as they can keep on attracting free agents with the MLE and make some smart draft picks (like Head) they can and will build a champion.
We reconstructed when half of our chemistry was formed in last two years. I think Jvg should be more paitent about M James and let Yao play at his best minints with full attack energy.
Point taken, but you have missed my point. I am not arguing at all about any short-term accomplishments (i.e. winning games now or losing them), I am simply wondering out loud as to whether or not our the "Shaq/Kobe blueprint" is the right way to go for us, since we clearly will never have the "Shaq" part. I fully agree btw that San Antonio is as good as they are due more to certain intangibles they possess rather than pure talent; same thing with Detroit. But those teams are very well-balanced, and if you remember, Detroit destroyed a Shaq/Kobe led Lakers team in the playoffs few years ago. So, do you think that the approach we've taken to building this team is the right one? Is it better to have a more balanced team at every position (alas Detroit) -- possibly with one superstar player alas the Spurs -- or is it the right fit for the Rockets to pursue a 'two-superstar tandom' system that clearly lacks a second superstar? Is Yao the "other" superstar we need to win it all? Isn't this a 'kink' in our team if we're truly built on that particular foundation? Or do you believe that in the current NBA you can in fact win without a two-superstar team, even if you don't have a supporting cast that's nearly as solid as other teams' supporting cast (i.e. Detroit, San Antonio). Look, I am not worried about Miami at all, or even Dallas. But San Antonio and Detroit are probably two teams that are here to stay for a few years down the line, and I just don't see us 'hanging' with them in a 7 game series with the cast we have now. I know it's still early and these pieces we have now are by no means the same ones we'll end up having. But consider this: Barry and DW are gone after this season, Deke is pretty much done, and Sura is likely done, while DA won't be around for long. In other words, we will have zero stability on this team when we're forced to go out and continually acquire players to fit around T-Mac and Yao. While we do that, teams like San Antonio and Detroit aren't changing much, they have stable lineups and make minor 'tweaks' every year, having built a nice, dependable core of young players that will be around for years to come. The Rockets, on the other hand, just will never develop that type of 'killer' chemistry that Detroit or the Spurs have. For one thing, we will have entirely rebuilt our backcourt in the next season or two, and will still have to go through another 'reshuffling' of role players, and every season we'll keep going through 'adjustment' periods and never really have an semblance of stability or core foundation to build a championship-caliber team on.
I say that we can indeed win a championship with the Tracy/Yao combination. What I've said since last season ended is we are missing a 3rd option on offense that can torch defenses who overcommit to stopping the other two. Yao is no Shaq, so YES YES YES we need a viable 3rd option on offense, not the player by committee. If we had upgraded our PG or SG during the summer instead of getting Stro, we could have filled this gap. I didn't bother even reading the thread recently titled "It's a Guard's League and ours Stink" but that says a lot. Perimeter play must be decent in order to free up a low post operator like Yao. A PF like Stro does nothing to address this need. To repeat something else already said before the season: Our team will live and die with it's guard play. That's the way it is when you have Tracy and Yao on the front line. We can win a championship with the building blocks we have. Depending on what kind of player Luther develops into, he needs a backcourt running mate at PG or SG. We don't need much scoring creativity at PF, just someone who can rebound, play good defense and hit wide open jump shots (think Horace Grant with the Bulls). I believe Tracy is a great player who can elevate his game into the stratosphere when needed, and if we get close enough, he can carry us over teams like Dallas, Miami and Detroit. But even T-Mac can only overcome so much. We may not have enough horses on this team to be a contender right now, but another great draft choice, trade or free agent signing could put us over the top. To salvage the season, Rafer and Stro must play better and contribute. If those two don't, we can toss this year in the can. tigermission1, no championship model is superior to another. A two pronged Shaq/Kobe model is no better than the supremely balanced Pistons model which is no better than the Spurs model. In a given year, any of them can win the title. Over a longer period of time, the Lakers model may be easier to keep at a championship level, especially if the two stars like each other. Most of you will disagree, but I see our team resembling the Spurs model more than Shaq/Kobe.
like apostolic3 said, we just need a reliable 3rd option. DA could be that option or even Head could be that option. A guy that can chip in 15-16 points a night alongside Tmac/Yao would do wonders.
A healthy tmac makes a night and day difference to this team, just give it time. I'm still optimistic.
The two star system is easier for the GM to assemble other talent around as he has the continuity year to year for his 2 star players. It is difficult to assemble new talent every 2 years-especiallly with old beat down players like Wesley and Anderson. IMHO the Detroit model has a longer continuity, but is more difficult for the GM to assemble less expensive complimentary parts. Props to Dumars for this. The San Antonio model may be the best by example in 1 superstar -big man in Duncan with 2 near stars in Ginobili and to a lesser extent Parker with less expensive players around him. What the Rockets have now is the easiest model to assemble year in and year out. I expected more from Swift, Anderson and Alston. I think it was the right move at the time to acquire Swift instead of Rahim or Walker - they were more money. I do not think it realistic now to expect the Rockets to be a top 4 team in the West now or next year, unless we are more successful in getting more complimentary talent-I doubt JVG and CD can do this-though I hope they can as a fan. Last season may represent a fluke in Rockets history and may be as good as we get. We will be left wondering what we did wrong when we had so much talent in Tracy and Yao, but coulkd not rise to an elite level--remaining only better than average - top 5 team in the West. Unfortunate....
tigermission, do you really think 1 full year and 11 games into the T-mac/Yao era is the best time to question the construction of the team? Shaq and Kobe didn't work right off the bat either if I remember correctly. It's way too early to say that the plan is flawed. If this were 3 or 4 years into it and we did fairly well in the regular season and only made it 1 or 2 rounds into the playoffs every year, then maybe I would agree with you, at this point I don't think a fair deterimation can be made. Besides, if T-mac were heathly and we hadn't had the horrible start, would you have brought this up?
I think that time can help us out a great deal. Fact 1 - our schedule has been incredibly difficult - lots of road games and lots of top tier teams teams from both conferences. Fact 2 - our best player has missed most of the season. In a lot of the games we've lost we had leads in the fourth quarter and lost them. This is T-mac's time of game. He has repeatedly shown that he can carry us through the fourth quarter. Given our team, a good game plan may be to hammer the ball with Yao in the first half, then get Tmac going in the second. Fact 3 - JVG is a "system" coach and it seems to me that our new guys are thinking too much about where to be on the court and what they are supposed to be doing. As they learn the system this will give way to playing without thinking which will lead to more free and easy play. The players will seem quicker, we will get better shots from understanding how the play will unfold etc.... I am as frustrated as everyone else, but it is too early to make ANY judgements about how the season will go. I will guarantee if they do not start playing better, you will probably see some changes. JVG will not accept losing.
exactly. we all want to complain, but the truth is we haven't seen our team yet. complain all you want about this yao based, one scoring option, hard to watch team. i don't like it either. we all loved seeing yao and tmac play together so well last year. we made moves to help them. with tmac out it's a different story, and all complaints about our future should be stalled until you see tmac back in the lineup for about 10 games at the very least.
OK, I re-read your original post and I guess I did. You're talking about the bigger picture, not just this season. I get that now. My answer is still that I feel good about where this team is going in the long run. I don't think Yao is a superstar, so I don't think we're trying to model the Shaq and Kobe model. We have one superstar and his supporting cast. The way I see it, Yao is part of T-Mac's supporting cast. The main reason I feel good is because I truly believe that Les wants to win and he'll do anything we need to do to win. A lot of teams can't say that about their owner. He's made a big move almost every single offseason since he took over. If we don't win this year, he will do what he needs to do to fix whatever our weakness is during the offseason, if not before. Les has never been one to stand down and accept the status quo.
Good post tiger. The league as a whole has moved away from the kobe/shaq mentality and gone with all around players on their teams. The spurs have duncan/ginobli/parker with and excellent bench that rivals many starting lineups. Detroit has billups, rip, and the wallaces. These teams are very well built and it will probabaly take some time for us to be built like them. WE're slowly putting the pieces together, and believe as a whole that we can compete with the best with everyone healthy. It just sucks that we're even talking about this right now. I still beleive in this team and all OF's and Haters need to see the big picture instead of just pointing fingers. Winning will cure all, though it seems that is not enough for this board.
I keep thinking what happened last year will repeat this year: a trade or trades in December to right the listing ship. Without T-Mac, it's so tough to say what we have. But I wouldn't be surprised to see him shipped out in December (which is, I believe, when he'll be eligible to be traded) if such a trade nets us the player we need. I realize now that the use of the word "nets" was probably not accidental, although I know in my heart Les won't want to pay for Jason Kidd. If we could just find a guard who can make an entry pass into the post and also free T-Mac to play off the ball. And IF we only had T-Mac on the court at all.
You like the way the Magic are built? This thread is about constructing an NBA championship team. Get with the program
