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So the Astros 2017 title is tainted

Discussion in 'Houston Astros' started by rockets13champs, Nov 12, 2019.

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  1. arkoe

    arkoe (ง'̀-'́)ง
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    Bregman traditionally starts the season slow.
     
  2. punkoholic

    punkoholic Member

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    Would be funny if he did and we retaliate and injure their star player.
     
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  3. Icehouse

    Icehouse Contributing Member

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    I wish Beltrán would just spill all the beans on other teams
     
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  4. Nook

    Nook Member

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    Jesus I now can understand why Cole absolutely hated Bauer. Ever since Bauer was in college I heard people in the game smile when Bauer’s name came up... “Dude is different”.... or when I would ask what they meant I had several people literally laugh in my face. I never understood.

    It took Charlie Brewer flat out saying “He is a ******* asshole. Imagine the biggest dick you have ever met and triple it.”

    After reading more of the comments I can see why none of Bauer’s teammates wanted anything to do with him.

    I used to think it was weak of Cole to not want to even be in the same locker room as him.... but not now. The level of self control Cole and others showed is amazing to me. Yes I can be a hot head but man... if there has ever been someone that is trolling for an ass beating it is Bauer.
     
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  5. phasors28

    phasors28 Member

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  6. Surfguy

    Surfguy Contributing Member

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    I can’t wait for the movie. Brad Pitt as AJ Hinch? Altuve will be Fez from That 70s Show. Who else? Bregman is Aaron Paul.
     
    #2126 Surfguy, Feb 14, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2020
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  7. SS0101

    SS0101 Member

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    I want to believe this so bad. And there are so many leads. But, wouldnt it be a bigger story if someone else got caught? Why would the media cover it up or not peruse leads on another team?
     
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  8. cmoak1982

    cmoak1982 Member

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    Easy answer is Taubman, he put the media massively against us. Not to mention the overall arrogant nature of the previous regime.
    The real answer is coastal media and coastal elites will always be protected from media, the easiest way to do that it scream loudly at the mid market team that was “caught”.
    There won’t be more people to come out because it’s really against the “code” and they get to witness first hand what the vitriol can be. Don’t think many players right or wrong want to be a part of that.
     
  9. SS0101

    SS0101 Member

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    Trust me I was in this boat too. I believed/still believe it too. BUT, what is disheartening, what took it out of me today is how people affiliated with all of the other teams who have been mentioned hes and there have had some harsh things to say. Cashman of the Yankees, obviously bellinger, rizzo from Washington, choo from the rangers. I find it really hard to believe that they would talk the way they are talking if there was something on them that they were hiding. Maybe it really is collusion between MLB and the rest of them, and maybe they have been assured they are safe. But man, what a wild theory that is. If that could ever be proven it would be the biggest thing to ever happen in sports. The rumors about boston coming out today also got me down. Multiple reporters have said they arent expecting anything as famning as the Astros (which we should have known when the original article had already said..."what the Astros did is cheating-cheating while boston only cheated.").
     
  10. Handles

    Handles Member

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    The worst thing for the MLB is more teams being implicated. These players know they are safe. There will be no more investigations and they can say whatever they want. What better way to stay under the radar than pointing the finger and yelling loudly at someone else? Keeps focus off your own team and it's reinforced by media.

    Red Sox will get off without much punishment, it will be low key. In a best case scenario the MLB doesn't face this situation at all. But now that they're facing it, the second best case is the damage is contained to a single scapegoat. Honestly, it works out for MLB. I bet their ratings will increase this year.
     
  11. alethios

    alethios Member

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    George Clooney would make a better Hinch.
     
  12. Nook

    Nook Member

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    How many players do you need to come forward and say cheating happens often in baseball? How many times does it have to be brought forward? From the Bobby Thompson homer, to the Jack McDowell story on Tony LaRussa... to the Yankees and Red Sox being caught using video to steal signs... the Red Sox using an Apple Watch.... players used greenies for 50 years without it leaking out... players shot each other up with steroids for years and it wasn’t broken as a story because of other players... Mike Scott scuffed baseballs and won a CyYoung... Mike Fiers used foreign substances when he threw a no hitter... the Cards Jeff Supan used a foreign substance to win a World Series game.... Pettitte and Clemens won World Series while using HGH.... there are many other examples.

    Don’t you find it odd that the league did nothing until Fiers came forward? Why is that? Because it happens in baseball... do you think that Beltran didn’t cheat when he was a Yankee? Met? Ranger?..... what makes sense to you? Do you find it interesting that the Yankees were so fast to snap Beltran up after retiring? That Cora was quickly hired by the Red Sox??? The two masterminds were snapped up by opposing teams so quickly.

    Don’t you find it self serving that these players said NOTHING when they were on the Astros. They all kept their rings, they all participated or said nothing. They all kept quiet after leaving too except Fiers.

    Do you think the league wants to find industry level cheating? A league that only really came down on the Astros after Fiers spoke. Prior to that they cleared the Astros.

    Was every team setting up elaborate systems like the Astros? No but a large number of teams were cheating in one way or another... be it trying to steal signs through electronic means or doctoring the baseball or really any means possible. The Brewers had a centerfield camera or someone relaying information to the hitter. There is a certain ex Marlin hitter in Milwaukee that was receiving help. Ask Darvish about it.

    I remember when the steroid story first broke, people believed it was only a few guys on a few teams.

    Do you believe the White Sox were the only team to take money to throw games?
     
  13. SS0101

    SS0101 Member

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    The other thing that bugs me, is our own guy/fan, the tony Adams guy on twitter, went and rewatched every home game and tracked every "bang." I appreciate what he did, and I think one of his primary objectives was to exonerate altuve (which backfired bc of the whole buzzer conspiracy, obviously), but I really wish he spent that time going after boston.

    According to the article on Boston, they supposedly only did it with runners on 1st or 2nd. Is it plausible to go watch ABs with runners on 1st or 2nd and watch eyes dart back and forth? I think you could at least see eyes darting to runner on first. Guy on second (maybe I'm grasping at straws), but while it would be harder to notice the eyes of the hitter focusing on a runner at 2nd, the runner on second is almost always in the camera shot. I wonder how easy it would be to pick up any correlations such hands on knees is offspeed and standing straight up is fastball or something along those lines. We need another tony adams to get on that lol.
     
    #2133 SS0101, Feb 14, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2020
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  14. jtexan

    jtexan Member

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    Every once in a while I'd watch the highlights of that epic game 5 in 2017. We were down so many times in that game and always came up with the huge hit at just the right time to tie it up...the Gurriel HR, the Altuve HR, the Springer HR, the Bregman game winner in extras. The joy of those moments can't be put into words, and now I can't even bring myself to watch it. I still love my 'stros, and I'll still watch every game, but those incredible memories are definitely scarred.
     
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  15. SS0101

    SS0101 Member

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    I definitely agree with all of this. I may have just entered a mode where I'm so down on it that I'm looking for these types of posts to snap me out if it lol.

    It is just amazing to me and I dont even know what part amazes me the most. I guess it is the media that I'm in most disbelief about. Just bc they are supposed to be on our (the fans) side. They should be scratching and clawing for the truth.
     
  16. Nook

    Nook Member

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    Ask yourself this.... how did Astros players and even the manager and front office react when they were initially accused of cheating? They laughed and mocked the accuser and were very arrogant..... people do not always react rationally or what is in their real best interest. Cashman signed players and played players he knew were using steroids and HGH and did nothing because they helped the Yankees win and it was an issue across baseball.

    The Astros have Osuna who beat the mother of his wife so bad she had to go to the hospital... the Dodgers have a known wife beater on their roster.... the Yankees have a man that shot a gun at his girlfriend. Why??? Because it is about winning and making money... there is talk of the moral high ground but who can really claim it?

    I am not saying the Astros shouldn’t have been punished but I am saying the idea that the Astros were the only team willing to do anything to win is absurd and that includes cheating.
     
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  17. The Real Shady

    The Real Shady Contributing Member

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    Not a bad discussion. No real Astros bashing and more how they are going to have to deal with this season.

    Hard to see your favorite lifetime team become the most historically hated in baseball.

     
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  18. Nook

    Nook Member

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    The sports writers are a fraternity. They stick together for the most part.

    Consider this. The Astros traded for Osuna and there were negative stories but it didn’t blow up until it involved humiliating two sports reporters and suddenly it was an enormous story and the topic wasn’t that Osuna beat a woman it was Taubman and the Astros response.

    The Dodgers have a young pitcher that beat a woman in the last year and very very little sports writer coverage. Why? The Dodgers are media friendly and they didn’t do anything to the media.

    Why was the decision to hire Baker met with so much praise? He has said things about women and race before that would normally be blasted... because the sports writers like him, he gives them access.
     
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  19. cmoak1982

    cmoak1982 Member

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    When the media comes out and flat out says we control the narrative and not the Astros, that’s a problem.
    This is why majority of people are growing more and more disgusted and not trusting of the media. It’s opinion pieces meant to sway and guide easily manipulated minds.
    These sanctimonious, pompous sports writers control who is loved and who isn’t. They control HOF entry, they control which market is covered.
    That is way too much power for a group of really, nobodies. Normal people that don’t particularly know more about sports than average fans, they don’t have some higher moral code than normal people. It’s a joke
     
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  20. mikol13

    mikol13 Protector of the Realm
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    Oh man I hope the team is taking this personally. Feeling bad and apologizing for the scandal is over. Time to shut the whole world up.
     
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