1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

SBNation: The case for James Harden as NBA MVP

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Shaq2Yao, Mar 10, 2019.

  1. Shaq2Yao

    Shaq2Yao Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2006
    Messages:
    8,520
    Likes Received:
    16,942
    https://www.sbnation.com/nba/2019/3...019-giannis-antetokounmpo-and-paul-george-too

    The case for James Harden as NBA MVP
    BY PAUL FLANNERY MAR 10, 2019, 8:00AM EDT

    The Most Valuable Player award is an argument between a hundred people who love to argue. Many of the arguments have merit, the occasional one does not, but I take it at face value that everyone argues in good faith when they cast their ballot.

    When I was young and foolish, and before I had a vote, I used to think that choosing the MVP would be an easy choice. Just pick the best player regardless of exterior circumstances. Simple. As the game has evolved, and my understanding of it grown, I now realize that winning is a lot harder than it looks, and in some years it’s not a simple choice at all.

    Rarely is there one unified argument about that year’s MVP and those races tend to be over by March. It’s now March and the MVP race is still simmering. There are three main contenders: Giannis Antetokounmpo, James Harden, and Paul George. There are many, many other players worthy of consideration, but that’s the top three by general consensus.

    When choosing an MVP in a crowded field like this, context matters more than ever and even that can be a subjective exercise. Narrative is a loaded word, but we all construct stories of what we’re watching, whether it’s with numbers, observation, emotion, or elements of all three.

    The stories we tell inform our choices and in some cases confirm our biases. That’s neither good nor bad, it’s just the nature of the award. It’s also what makes this an interesting exercise.

    In the broadest terms, my criteria includes weighing individual achievement along with team success. When all else fails I fall back on the player who defined the season, an admittedly sketchy position. That led me to choose Russell Westbrook over James Harden two years ago. I have no regrets.

    When I voted for Harden last season, it was a far easier case to make. He was the best player in the league by most objective measures leading the best team. To choose Harden again this season would require using the same subjective reasoning that elevated Russ over him two years ago. Life is funny.

    Harden is having an even better campaign this his MVP season and he’s taken over the league with his combination of skill and intelligence producing overwhelming numbers. By perfecting the art of shooting 3’s off the dribble with a series of step-backs and side-steps that are virtually unguardable, Harden has become the most unstoppable offensive force in the game.

    “It just gives me more opportunity and more space to get my shot off,” Harden said of his shotmaking repertoire following a 42-point performance in Boston. “As defenders if you try to close the gap I’m able to get by you, so you’ve got to pick and choose.”

    The problem, of course, is there is no right choice. Play up on him and he’ll drive to the basket where he can finish or find teammates for dunks and open shots. Lay back and he’ll take the three right in your face. Get caught in the middle and Harden is a magnet for foul calls.

    Harden’s stat lines offer a study in beautiful symmetry, none better than his 58-point outburst against the Heat in late February when he went 8-for-16 from two, 8-for-18 from three, and 18-for-18 from the free throw line. Harden has a 61-point game, five in the 50s, and 18 more in the 40’s. He’s not just an offense unto himself, he’s the whole freaking universe.



    What’s remarkable is that he hasn’t slowed down. Pick a stretch, any stretch, and you can find examples of Harden’s dominance. He was named Western Conference Player of the Month by the NBA in both December and January. He’s been just as productive in February and March, all the while carrying an absurdly heavy load.

    “It’s special,” Rockets coach Mike D’Antoni said. “I don’t know if there’s enough words. He is born to play, he loves to play. I can’t take him out of practice. You can’t keep him off the floor. That’s special in itself, knowing that 75-80 games a year he’s going to play for you and play at a high level.”

    Because he plays so much in isolation, there’s a question of aesthetics with Harden. Those who identify with the struggle of the individual revel in his exploits, while those who prefer an egalitarian style of ball prefer the more balanced approach of Antetokounmpo’s Bucks.

    My personal taste runs toward the latter, but both players are doing what’s been asked by their respective systems. Harden’s ball-dominant game isn’t selfish so much as it’s necessary. That’s an important distinction.

    “He works with what what we want to do,” D’Antoni said. “That’s shoot 3’s, layups, and fouls. With what I like to do, it’s a perfect match.”

    The Rockets have needed every bit of Harden’s determined brilliance this season. After a dreadful start that had many wondering if they would actually miss the playoffs entirely, Harden led a Rockets team that was besieged by injuries out of the wilderness back into contention for top-3 seed in the loaded Western Conference.

    While he won’t make any All-Defensive teams, Harden’s work on that end of the floor has also been sturdier than in the past. D’Antoni pointed to Harden’s post defense as a particularly valuable component of Houston’s half-court defense, with its emphasis on switching.

    Still, for Harden to overtake Antetokounmpo, as well as George, you’d have to argue that his offensive production is simply too great to ignore. Ultimately, his case comes back the idea that Harden’s play has defined the season, which it has. With its emphasis on offensive firepower fueled by efficient production, no one plays the modern game better than Harden.

    Is that enough?

    The best player on the best team designation now belongs to Antetokounmpo. His Bucks are in first place, his numbers are historic, and he’s played at a consistent level of excellence all season. Giannis gets bonus points for being an absolute terror on both ends of the floor.

    PG’s argument takes a little longer to connect. He’s also having a brilliant offensive season, and he might be better defensively than Giannis. But while his Thunder are having a strong season, they haven’t risen to the same heights at Antetokounmpo’s Bucks. A side-by side comparison is close, but also tends to favor Giannis.

    The wild card in the equation is Harden. While we still have a month left to play, and no decision has been made, my feeling is that the MVP is still Antetokounmpo’s to lose more than it’s Harden’s to win. Either way, it makes for a hell of an argument.
     
    cbs1507, s3ts, hakeem94 and 3 others like this.
  2. Roc Paint

    Roc Paint Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2001
    Messages:
    22,329
    Likes Received:
    12,438
    Too bad the case is still open for so many
     
    D-rock and saleem like this.
  3. Nook

    Nook Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2008
    Messages:
    54,169
    Likes Received:
    112,802
    Harden is the one having an historic season.... nice attempt to shift the narrative.
     
    Sajan, joshuaao, adw and 12 others like this.
  4. Deuce

    Deuce Context & Nuance

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2001
    Messages:
    26,577
    Likes Received:
    35,648
    Pretty good criteria. "Individual achievement, coupled with team success" is also the same thing Howard Beck uses as criteria.

    The final test of "player who defined the season" is also good.

    When people look back at this regular season in terms of the MVP it will be defined by 1) Harden's step back and 2) Harden's 32 game 30+ ppg streak.
     
  5. Roc Paint

    Roc Paint Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2001
    Messages:
    22,329
    Likes Received:
    12,438
    Don’t go digging in the dirt Nook
     
  6. MD_in_Training

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2008
    Messages:
    4,104
    Likes Received:
    1,832
    When was this written? For all intents and purposes, Paul George should no longer be in the conversation given their recent struggles.
     
    Sajan, adw, Mr. Dominant and 5 others like this.
  7. Juxtaposed Jolt

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2010
    Messages:
    20,802
    Likes Received:
    16,590
    Bucks are only 10 games ahead of the Rockets, in a much easier conference, and Middleton / Bledsoe / Lopez / Brogdon have all been relatively healthy iirc.

    CP3 / Capela / Gordon / Faried have all been hit with the injury bug.

    Honestly, if the Rockets roster stayed as healthy as the Bucks roster all season, I'm of the opinion that Harden's stats would be tamer (instead of 36.5/6.5/7.5, maybe it'd be closer to 30/6/9) but we'd have a better record. Hell, we might even have the best record in the WC today.

    The ability to be better on offense this year than last, and the much-improved defense all while carrying the burden of dragging NBA players with G-League play for a long stretch, should mean Harden wins MVP. And easily, at that.
     
    bballjunkie, jcf and slothy420 like this.
  8. pippendagimp

    pippendagimp Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2000
    Messages:
    27,030
    Likes Received:
    21,257
    if we hadn't downsized this season we'd probably be in the 1st seed right now and then the harden despisers would quiet AF
     
  9. Reeko

    Reeko Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    45,757
    Likes Received:
    127,744
    Why is PG being brought up? He’s not a legitimate candidate to actually win the award anymore. He can enjoy his 3rd place finish.

    People still talk about Kobe’s 05-06 season over a decade later...this season from Harden will be the same

    what Giannis is doing won’t even be talked about a year or 2 from now...sh*t, it barely gets talked about now...u never see the media talking about what Giannis did last night unless it’s a 10 second clip of some dunk they’ll talk about for 30 seconds while doing last night’s top 10 plays...Harden is getting entire segments devoted to what he’s doing on the basketball court every other day

    Harden’s season is a lot more impressive and has far more historical significance...and unlike Russ, the Rockets are closing in on the 2nd seed in the West
     
    RichieBanks, s3ts, lilbird20 and 2 others like this.
  10. Deuce

    Deuce Context & Nuance

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2001
    Messages:
    26,577
    Likes Received:
    35,648
    I think at this point the talk shows just like to have a group to argue about. Like last year, it was OBVIOUS Harden was the MVP, but to have a "debate" you need choices. So they just brought it LeBron....just cause.

    One sided debates don't drive discussion or ratings.
     
    lilbird20 likes this.
  11. Deuce

    Deuce Context & Nuance

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2001
    Messages:
    26,577
    Likes Received:
    35,648
    Yup, and that's why I included that parameter from Flannery's article.

    *player who defined the season*

    This is the James Harden season.
     
    Reeko likes this.
  12. Samiam1234

    Samiam1234 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2013
    Messages:
    438
    Likes Received:
    631
    Hardens rockets will be well over 50 games win base... and in a legit race Harden would have this in a lock, but the media hates Harden and H-town.. factor this with the fact that Giannis is having a legit MVP type season with 27 and 13 and his team is on pace to win 62 games or so... it won't be a bad pick, and I wouldn't call this a screw job unlike what they did with Westbrook loser couple years ago..
     
  13. mike2k132

    mike2k132 Member

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2009
    Messages:
    4,060
    Likes Received:
    3,550
    If harden gets that 3 seed its gonna ne super close...now of he gets that second its harden's without a doubt n people would riot if he doesnt get it then
     
    Sajan likes this.
  14. sirbaihu

    sirbaihu Member

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2006
    Messages:
    8,517
    Likes Received:
    2,851
    "His numbers are historic" LOL. Should say "His number is historic: #2 in win shares." See the link.

    Meanwhile, the only MVP ever (i.e. since 1956) to play fewer minutes than Giannis is 2015 Steph Curry.
    Giannis must be pretty damn incredible in those 33.0 mpg. . . . Not buying it.
     
  15. SF3isBack!!

    SF3isBack!! Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2007
    Messages:
    10,163
    Likes Received:
    1,879
    blah blah blah its clearly Harden's MVP but Harden has alway had to do more to get what he's earned.
     
    RichieBanks, D-rock and BigM like this.
  16. Severe Rockets Fan

    Severe Rockets Fan Takin it one stage at a time...

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2001
    Messages:
    5,923
    Likes Received:
    1,490
    I looked at that link they provided and it shows them comparing him and Oscar Robertson...the numbers aren't really close (points and rebounds, yeah, assists and WS were much different)...not sure what they were trying to accomplish there.

    Such a Strange Title too: "The case for James Harden as NBA MVP"...but we choose Giannis...
     
    D-rock and kevcai like this.
  17. BigM

    BigM Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2001
    Messages:
    17,997
    Likes Received:
    13,174
    Not having Ariza is a bigger difference in our team record than having multiple key players out at seperate times with injury? I don’t see it. We didn’t get last years Chris Paul back until a few weeks ago.

    If this team was relatively healthy, we’re comfortably a 2 seed or higher.
     
  18. Roc Paint

    Roc Paint Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2001
    Messages:
    22,329
    Likes Received:
    12,438
    Replace Harden with Houston, and we’re still straight
     
  19. pippendagimp

    pippendagimp Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2000
    Messages:
    27,030
    Likes Received:
    21,257
    i think just retaining house would have added 3-5 wins. we don't lose that BKN game at home, for instance
     
    J Sizzle likes this.
  20. MystikArkitect

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2006
    Messages:
    10,642
    Likes Received:
    15,995
    What’s historic about Giannis season?

    Why is PG even in this conversation?
     
    D-rock and Nook like this.

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now