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Patience

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Caesar, May 25, 2016.

  1. Caesar

    Caesar Member

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    Some people now want to copy the Thunder, but we can't do that without drafting. We'd need another superstar and all star(Ibaka) and tons of great role players. Their stars having been growing together since 2009. I believe we have some very good role players that need to come off the bench, but it is our starting lineup that needs a complete overhaul.

    Right now the Rockets can't be afraid to give either a rookie or young player a starting role and allow Ariza and Bev to be bench players. Look at Andre Robersons terrible stats in the regular season and tell me KJ McDaniels can't do that while bringing intangibles or even Harrell? Hell, Dekker might turn out to be a solid 3 and D player. This whole notion that you need old veterans is BS. The Rockets started a rookie in Robert Horry. Also rookie Sam Cassell played major minutes in our run. The Thunder start Roberson and even Adams. Tell me how Capela can't play 25 mpg and get you 8 and 8 and a measly block per game? Their career averages are nearly identical right now with Cap obviously playing less.

    The combination of Les pushing this whole win now window every era and teaching our fans impatience and the game going global and seeing foreign fans coming in and not wanting to stick with the team through the downs are what's setting us back constantly over the past 20 years. Blame it on injuries. I blame it on not having the patience to let a team grow together. Perhaps that is why we draft poorly, because our management doesn't care knowing they won't even play much anyway or they will be traded in the future for old vets.

    This summer, there is no superstar to get. Only all star level guys like Horford, Conley, Whiteside, Ryno. These are the guys you DRAFT. Not pay max money to have. This is not the way to build. Were going to get ourselves into 4th seed at best territory and be a pretender that "no one want's to face in the playoffs." I envisioned Biyombo and Batum signings being the smarter route, but i have to think are they really worth what they are going to make this summer and is that going to push us into true contender status? Not at all. Those are guys you get before they blow up and earn max money. I don't want to see us go out and use up all of our cap in locking us into some overpaid pretender roster.

    I've been a Rockets fan all of my life and i will be a Rockets fan til the day i die. If the Rockets choose to not spend their money and opt to let Capela, KJ, Harrell develop on the floor with Harden and instead sign guys like Jared Dudley, and/or resign DMO and also get a young Head Coach. I'm okay with this because it tells me they are being patient and have the foresight to see that nothing outside of signing Kevin Durant will put us into true championship contender status.

    Let the young players play and develop and have fun. We will have fun watching it too especially after this miserable and unbearable to watch season. Harden has proven that he can carry a team on his back to the playoffs. Why not let him carry young guys who could end up surprising us and develop into our very own all stars on cheap contracts?

    (I can accept going after those all star level guys with max money if it's only 2 year contracts. If we pay for a team that only has a 2 year window to align with Harden's free agency year in 2018, i understand this and find it to be a smart route to take. Just as long as we don't lock ourselves into 5 year deals with those guys and then Harden becomes a free agent and has to decide on leaving or resigning with a bunch of guys who make a ton of money and aren't helping the Rockets be true contenders.)
     
  2. DaDakota

    DaDakota Contributing Member

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    The difference is in Ibaka - Daryl Morey would never pay that much for what he considers a role player, yet OKC recognizes how valuable a role he plays and paid him the market rate.

    That is one of the biggest flaws in our system, we don't pay people like Parsons and as such we get a tiny bit worse by bringing in Ariza.

    When we start recognizing the value of role players that we develop, we will be much better off....

    DD
     
  3. LongTimeFan

    LongTimeFan Contributing Member

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    While you may have a point, this is a bad example. We did not get worse going from Parsons to Ariza. Chandler woud've missed significant portions of the last two seasons, including both playoffs.

    Also -- shout out to Caesar for sounding like Morey.

     
  4. Caesar

    Caesar Member

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    I understand that, but how much of that is also on Les seeing it a better option to star chase? The proof is there long before Morey. Chasing Drexler, Barkley, Pippen, T-Mac. Obviously Drexler and T-Mac were no brainers. But, Barkley and Pippen were unnecessary had we kept Horry and Cassell.

    I know it's not pretty but eyeing players like Pau Gasol, Rajon Rondo, Loul Deng, Derron Williams type of guys on 2 year deals might be the best course to take. They are all guys that can still allow the young backups to play heavier minutes.

    I'd also like to see the Rockets experiment with giving Harden less minutes so that he can spend more energy on defense. Harden has the tools to be a good defender. He just needs discipline to not ball watch anymore and to fix his defensive stance. It's as easy as drilling it into his head to not stay flat footed in his stance.
     
  5. Caesar

    Caesar Member

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    I don't agree with that quote if he means letting them go after they are worth more money. You keep the players you develop that everyone wants to pay big money to. But, i think he just means you draft those guys to have on your roster and not pay big money to steal from other teams.
     
  6. aelliott

    aelliott Contributing Member

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    We just paid Ty Lawson $12M last season but we wouldn't have paid Ibaka $12M? Really? Why?

    We resigned Brewer for over $8M but we wouldn't have given Ibaka $12M?
     
  7. LongTimeFan

    LongTimeFan Contributing Member

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    The quote -- to me -- means that the teams that succeed are the ones who are able to identify and draft talent in the drafts, not the ones who overspend in FA to acquire them.

    Which is... exactly the premise of your thread.

    The obvious question then becomes -- why is it OK to overspend to keep guys that were on your team but not OK to overspend to acquire them in free agency?

    For example, in your argument I believe you are supportive of the Thunder re-signing Ibaka to a big contract. But you would be against the Thunder signing Ibaka for the same contract if he played for the Raptors rather than the Thunder.
     
  8. FTW Rockets FTW

    FTW Rockets FTW Contributing Member

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    Ibaka was drafted at 18. There are very good players in the positions Mauri drafts that can be retained and used as a cornerstone or one of your 3 best players. Similarly Butler, DJ, Draymond Green etc

    Problem is Mauri is a very mediocre drafter and his picks in those positions are often busts like White or Dekker or players like TJ.

    How many of Mauri's picks have been retained past their rookie contract?
     
  9. hongxingli

    hongxingli Contributing Member

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    Nah, DD, you know the difference we did not suck enough to draft Durant or Westbrook.

     
  10. hongxingli

    hongxingli Contributing Member

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    They did not win because of Ibaka though, we need to get into the position to draft Durant and Westbrook.

     
  11. TruthBeTold

    TruthBeTold Member

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    Eh, it's too early to call Dekker a bust at this point. He spent last year recovering from back surgery, so next season we'll get a chance to see what he can really do when he's 100%. It sure seems like people want Dekker to fail for some reason...
     
  12. Caesar

    Caesar Member

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    That's a good point, but Conley and Horford are about to be 30. So i'd say age is the bigger factor for me. Resigning your own Conley or Horford when they are 23,24,25 years old is a no brainer. A guy like Whiteside has too many question marks. What kind of effort and what kind of attitude is he going to bring after he gets his max contract?

    I made no mention of Ibaka other than he's an all star, i believe it's DaDa that brought him up. They resigned him at 24 years old. He's going to be 27 next season. I have no problem with signing free agents at 24 years old. I still am high on Biyombo who is 23 years old.
     
  13. Caesar

    Caesar Member

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    Yeah, that is weird. It really does feel like everyone is rooting against him just to prove Morey sucks at drafting. I'll be rooting for him in summer league simply because he's a Rocket and he seems like a good kid.
     
  14. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    Ibaka is the MVP of the Thunders.

    Not broken foot guy or inefficient chucker.
     
  15. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    Last year, no one wanted to copy OKC.

    Let's wait and see who wins the championship next year before deciding who to copy.
     
  16. RudyTBag

    RudyTBag Contributing Member

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    Ibaka is light ears more valuable than Parsons, and Daryl would give an arm and a leg to have him.
     
  17. DaDakota

    DaDakota Contributing Member

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    Look at Kanter, let's see how the org treats DMo and compare it to Kanter who is worse than Dmo.

    THIS is one of the biggest flaws in Morey's dynamic.

    DD
     
  18. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    Does anyone realize or care that Ibaka really wasnt that good this year?
     
  19. LongTimeFan

    LongTimeFan Contributing Member

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    So how do you rationalize the above with the below?

    So you're fine with [overpaying] young players you draft and develop but against [overpaying] them if they come via FA?
     
  20. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    Kanter is FAR better than DMO.

    He averages 21 points per 36 minutes on very good efficiency and is a much better rebounder.

    DMO is better at boxing out, i'll give you that
     
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