1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

[Official] Astros Off Season

Discussion in 'Houston Astros' started by Castor27, Oct 4, 2010.

  1. The Situation

    The Situation Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2010
    Messages:
    2,070
    Likes Received:
    71
  2. cardpire

    cardpire Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2008
    Messages:
    10,634
    Likes Received:
    573
    "annoying" has 2 'n's, and there should be a comma inserted in between "see" and "and".

    it entirely depends on the context. in his case, he clearly stated his motive for correcting the guy, and it certainly wasn't to be helpful.
     
    1 person likes this.
  3. Scolalist

    Scolalist Member

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2010
    Messages:
    3,590
    Likes Received:
    57
    I really do like the Astros pitching going into next year. We should us the bulk of the free agent money to sign Okajima making it possible to deal two relievers for Jason Bartlett.

    Wandy Rodriguez
    Brett Myers
    JA Happ
    Bud Norris
    Aneury Rodriguez/Ryan Rowland-Smith/Jordan Lyles

    Brandon Lyon
    Matt Lindstrom
    Fernando Abad
    Mark Melancon
    Wilton Lopez
    Nelson Figueroa
    Casey Pendleton/Jeff Fulchino/Wes Wright


    pretty solid group
     
  4. leroy

    leroy Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2002
    Messages:
    23,360
    Likes Received:
    4,405
  5. Buck Turgidson

    Buck Turgidson Mineshaft Enthusiast

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2002
    Messages:
    47,683
    Likes Received:
    28,356
    Yep, I'd love to upgrade at short, but dealing anything that could possibly get us young talent is a bad move, imo. Bartlett would be a stopgap, just like Barmes/Sanchez/whatever other scrub is around.

    The team is at least 1-2 years away from seriously competing & all moves should be made with that in mind.

    And Bartlett, outside of 1 year, just doesn't seem that good. Fluke year? Or was he injured some last year? I dunno, I'm not a scout & haven't watched him enough to know.
     
  6. rockets934life

    rockets934life Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2007
    Messages:
    15,312
    Likes Received:
    249
    What scares me is Bill Hall, as a utility guy then I'm all for it but as a regular at 2B not so much. Bartlett would at least give you solid "D" and some pop out of SS and while Hall will give you pop but also tons of strikeouts and is a defensive liability.
     
  7. T-Slack

    T-Slack Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2009
    Messages:
    2,893
    Likes Received:
    81
  8. rockets934life

    rockets934life Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2007
    Messages:
    15,312
    Likes Received:
    249
    That, my friend, is the issue...there are none. Albert Cartwright is the closest middle IF prospect we have and he barely made it to AA. Angel and Tommy aren't prospect and in fact stopgaps themselves. Bartlett would at least give you above average play from your SS at a reasonable price.
     
  9. Ottomaton

    Ottomaton Contributing Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2000
    Messages:
    14,376
    Likes Received:
    4,931
    I'd rather keep young pitchers and commit to the rebuilding instead of pretending you are competitive and half-assing it. Pay minimum wage to your stopgap, and redirect that extra $4.5 million you'd be rolling the dice on with some stopgap with a name (and not much else) to actual player scouting and development. Embrace the low times. Like John Lucas wandering around downtown in a coked-out daze at five AM, you have to hit rock bottom before you can see your problem.

    They're already going to be overpaying for Barmes. They don't need to start a collection of mediocre overpaid middle infield stopgaps. Don't double down on a mistake. At the very least, if we are going to overpay for a loser, at least Barmes is so bad that he won't get people hallucinating that the team is one overpriced midseason pitcher acquisition away from going to the World Series.
     
    #609 Ottomaton, Dec 11, 2010
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2010
  10. rockets934life

    rockets934life Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2007
    Messages:
    15,312
    Likes Received:
    249
    Relief pitching is a dime a dozen, young pitching is nice but unless your a closer most organizations don't really value middle relievers much. If there was a prospect like Wallace, Johnson or Castro waiting at AAA, very much in agreement but I rather see competitive above average play then mediocre veterans.
     
    #610 rockets934life, Dec 11, 2010
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2010
  11. xcrunner51

    xcrunner51 Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2002
    Messages:
    4,463
    Likes Received:
    777
    At some point, it makes financial sense for Drayton (or whoever the new owner is) to make sure the product on the field is at least watchable.

    Not even putting up the illusion of attempting to challenge for a playoff spot in a traditionally weak division is Busch league Pirates-type ownership. I can already guarantee gate attendance and ticket sales will be down again this year. Starting a middle infield of Barmes and Keppinger is a quick way to drop gate attendance further.

    There's no question the rebuild is important, but a few relievers likely won't change much now or later. As was previously stated, a cheap rebuild's fine if you got young talented players trying to establish themselves in the bigs. But if its just mediocre talent its unappealing to watch.

    We already have plenty of young guys, having a few decent and stable veterans interspersed is a good idea. Jason Bartlett is much less of a question than Barmes. Only two positions have solid major league quality starters: CF and RF. Adding Bartlett would make that 3. That would take more pressure off the young guys to perform.
     
  12. J.R.

    J.R. Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2008
    Messages:
    77,680
    Likes Received:
    73,626
    Astros in a tough spot. They're not contenders imo(2-3 years away?) so no big signings and I would tend to agree with the no stop gap solution plan. Though on the other hand, they dont have a good farm system or deep one at that or rather just guys who are ready for the majors. Yeah you got Wallace and Lyles ready to compete for their respective jobs/positions but...not sure what else is there or who else might be ready. Anyhow...
     
  13. RocketMania1991

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2009
    Messages:
    2,996
    Likes Received:
    124
    I'm sure attendance will be drastically down this year now with the departure of Berkman/Oswalt. Our only two headliners.

    I think it is a good point that every franchise should have its face and star. So in a way I think it makes sense (maybe not this off-season), but in the possible upcoming ones to attempt to make a major signing. Someone that can be identified with the franchise and serve as a recognizable player. Even if we still are somewhat in rebuilding mode.
     
  14. Scolalist

    Scolalist Member

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2010
    Messages:
    3,590
    Likes Received:
    57
    Isn't that what Hunter Pence and Carlos Lee are?

    I'd rather have a strong farm that can simply call someone up and remain as strong as before than spend 100+ million on another FA like Carlos.
     
  15. OremLK

    OremLK Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2010
    Messages:
    10,300
    Likes Received:
    584
    The farm system actually does have a fair amount of depth.

    There are a bunch of guys in the system who aren't viewed as top 100 guys right now but could quickly raise their stock to that point next year.

    Look at Kansas City for how quickly a farm system can turn around... they were kind of average, meh-worthy the year before last, then a few guys had big breakout seasons and suddenly they have the best farm system in baseball (Hosmer, Moustakas, and Myers being three of the top 20 prospects in baseball).
     
  16. xcrunner51

    xcrunner51 Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2002
    Messages:
    4,463
    Likes Received:
    777
    If Lee is the face of the franchise, no one is buying tickets. He represents everything wrong with the team. He's old, overpaid, and sucks.

    Right, that's a fair comparison. Hosmer and Moustakas were top 10 picks and Myers was rated first round talent before sliding to the 3rd round. We don't have 1st rounders sitting around waiting to bloom like a lot of perennially bad teams.

    I just don't see why people are being so stingy over a potential move that
    a) everyone admits would upgrade the position
    b) salary wise costs as much as we've paid Pedro Feliz
    c) trade wise could cost two relievers, players that statistically will have less than 20% (150 combined innings) of the impact that Bartlett or Hardy would. :confused:

    Everyone gets that its a rebuild. But the owner has to put up a reasonable product on the field for fans to come. Barmes/Keppinger at the middle infield positions ain't getting that done. A new owner's not thinking "I can absorb two years of low gate attendance because my team is rebuilding". It's as much a financial move as a baseball move.
     
  17. rockets934life

    rockets934life Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2007
    Messages:
    15,312
    Likes Received:
    249
    Rumor mill going crazy that Lee is going to stay with Rangers...stay tuned.
     
  18. MadMax

    MadMax Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 1999
    Messages:
    66,321
    Likes Received:
    4,921
    seeing that on twitter.
     
  19. RocketMania1991

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2009
    Messages:
    2,996
    Likes Received:
    124
    Will be disappointing if Lee stays with the Rangers. Hopefully that massive contract will come back to haunt them.

    I don't see him playing that out in Texas.
     
  20. No Worries

    No Worries Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 1999
    Messages:
    22,720
    Likes Received:
    5,095
    The depth has yet to make it to AAA. And in that regard we do not know if the depth the Astros have obtained from the draft over the last three years will ever translate into MLB talent. I am optimistic ... but ... until the recent drafts pay off at the MLB level I am not over confident that the cavalry is on the way.
     
Loading...

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now