Morey said peak CP3 is the best PG of all time

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by KiwiRoxFan, Dec 4, 2017.

  1. KiwiRoxFan

    KiwiRoxFan Member

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    I just dug up him saying this 5 years ago in a Reddit AMA. The only way he wouldn't still believe this is if he thinks peak Steph Curry surpassed him.

    For those interested, his [all-time starting 5 with players at their peaks] are:
    Chris Paul
    Michael Jordan
    Lebron James
    Tim Duncan
    Olajuwon

    Can't rule out him flattering CP3 for recruitment purposes.

    Link to his comment:
     
  2. Chamillionaire

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    Magic > CP3
     
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  3. Robert Kogut

    Robert Kogut Member

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    CP overshadows Magic statistically in almost every aspect of the game. Chris is better defender, better 3P shooter, better midrange shooter, better in steals, better in avoiding turnovers, better in assist to turnover ratio, better in PER, better in offensive ratings, better in wins shares and many others. CP3 statistically even better perform in playoffs.

    And CP played his whole career in lottery teams without any HOF player at all. Magic was more fancy, more mesmeriseable, he shined more.and get religious status.

    CP is obviously better in every rational discussion when we don't talk about religion, AIDS, hype, appreciation and number of rings (because in that case Luc Longley and Zaza are among best centers of all time)
     
  4. pgabriel

    pgabriel Contributing Member

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    Magic has five rings a lot of assists and had a triple double stepping in at center for Kareem to seal his first championship

    Arguably greatest of all time player
     
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  5. Robert Kogut

    Robert Kogut Member

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    Number of rings are not indi
    1. Number of rings are not individual performance. I understand players who had rings may say that but it's obviously not true. MJ had zero rings in 83,84,85,86,87,88,89,90 and he would continue this streak if not Scottie, Rodman, Phil Jackson and others.

    2. You can have 15 assists and 7 turnovers and it is much worst (for the team) than for example 9 assists and 1 turnover - but people will respect you more because almost no one looks at turnovers.

    3. You can have a lot of rebounds because you don't play defense and you can just stay and rest around the paint.

    4. You can have a lot of points being extremely inefficient 30-40-80 club (like Russel) instead of more like 40-50-90.

    you can do everything wrong and have triple doubles - depends on usage rate. Raw numbers are illusion.
     
  6. pgabriel

    pgabriel Contributing Member

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    Magic averaged 19-11-7 for a career. Nothing about his career is a fluke
     
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  7. Wylo

    Wylo Member

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    Morey was just being Morey, and based his argument purely on (advanced) stats. I'm sure Morey is aware that career achievement wise Magic is way farther ahead.
     
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  8. omgTHEpotential

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    Both CP3 and Magic are great players. They might both be point guards, but they're very unlike each other and helped their teams in different ways in two completely different eras. Hard to compare.
     
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  9. Swapshop

    Swapshop Member

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    Tired of Steph Curry being brought up as some great PG. I wouldn't even say he is top 10 in NBA.
     
  10. Swiss Roll

    Swiss Roll Member

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    Name me ten players better than him
     
  11. TheRealAllpro

    TheRealAllpro Member

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    He had the The Dream in there so we aren't fighting
     
  12. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Member

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    Advanced stats aside, you got to pass the advanced eye test as well. CP3 is great for sure.

    I still doubt Morey did watch much of Magic, Isiah, Oscar R. or even Stockton.

    CP3 is playing in an era full of shooting and combo guards, of course he is going to shine as one of the only real PGs who can also defend. (Probably the only guy in a long time)
     
  13. heypartner

    heypartner Contributing Member

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    People call guys like Paul the ultimate leaders because they are like coaches on the court. He does achieve a lot with that style. Larry Bird was better ,though, at that style.

    But the epitome of team leader is Magic Johnson. no one comes close. he brought a thrill to the game that brought best out of everyone...and stay alert! Guys trained harder for him, etc. As anecdote, the first Dream Team might never have happened without him. He is the best leader basketball has ever seen, and I think by a long shot. He was the Leader of Leaders.

    And besides that, his total stats are still better imo, and he's by far the better passer against the best of the best defense because he had the unfair advantage of being 9" taller than CP3. Sry Chris. If you were 6'9 and didn't need to whip players as much, you'd be Magic, too...with rings by now.
     
    #13 heypartner, Dec 4, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2017
  14. Houstunna

    Houstunna Contributing Member

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    Both are similarly skilled players and leaders, but Magic is better due to size. History says, it's difficult to win championships with your best player < 6'6''.

    Man @heypartner , you added the height factor while I was typing. Lol.

    I skimmed everyone's post seeing if Size was mentioned, because it's the first thing I thought when reading the title. Huge difference between 6'0'' and 6'9''.
     
    #14 Houstunna, Dec 4, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2017
  15. hakeemthagreat

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    These type of arguments are the same ones that allow Lebron to creep in the top 5 category where he doesn't belong. Yes CP's statistically a more efficient PG, but Magic Johnson is still the greatest PG in the history of basketball. The game was played different then. There were lower possessions, it was more physical & the overrall game was more competitive. Not saying CP isn't one of the GOAT pg's. But guys in this day in age benefit from the NBA being looser & less physical than before. So what you have is guys who can get 60-70% of their points from open court layups and foul shots. That gives a ill informed fan the APPEARANCE that guys in this era are better based of individual stats. But it's really a combination of rule changes that have made the game score friendly


    The post is not a reflection of CP's game, more so guys like Lebron who put up great numbers off mostly open court dunks & foul shots
     
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  16. Robert Kogut

    Robert Kogut Member

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    Today players are bigger, are stronger ... are better. 30-40 years ago there were 30-40 really amazing players and rest were semi-professionals midgets comparing to current NBA standards.

     
    #16 Robert Kogut, Dec 4, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2017
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  17. photojoe

    photojoe Member

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    Is CP3 even the best PG on his own team?
     
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  18. Mathloom

    Mathloom Contributing Member

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    CP3 with 1 ring > Magic with 5 rings

    Folklore gets built up after wins. Everyone has the same story about Magic. They will have stories about Paul soon!
     
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  19. tmacfor35

    tmacfor35 Contributing Member

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    No doubt Magic was great but he played with hall of fame caliber players his whole career.
     
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  20. Clown Baby

    Clown Baby Member

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    Magic's size created matchup problems that go beyond the box-score. His post-up game was nasty, an older Magic dominated MJ/Pippen in the post during the Finals.

    CP3 has always had issues with bigger PGs. Deron Williams outplaying him head-to-head was the main reason that #1 PG debate existed despite CP3's superior numbers. I also remember Billups giving CP3 hell at times.

    CP3 is the most well-rounded great PG ever. But Magic's offensive impact was superior because his size simply allowed him to do more things.
     
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