If LAC worked an Odom trade with us, could we still work out something with Orlando?

Sherlock, I like your analysis but IMHO I see some fundamental problems.

1. The base trade (Houston getting Odom, Kandi and this years pick from LAC for Drew, Williams and Cato) seems too one sided. Thats 3 top 5 picks that LAC would be giving up. If LAC do that deal it's no surprise the franchise sux. (I acknowledge that you are using Popeye's info)
2. I don't see Chicago settling for so many rookies - they have been gearing towards landing a big free agent and I don't think they are patient enough to go with a core consisting of all those young guys. I'm guessing that any movements they make will be trading picks for marquee players.

Thats some serious work you put into that deal.

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That's great but it seems very unlikely.
Also, that pushes Mobley out the door because Odom would start at the 3, Swift at the 4, Dream at the 5, Shandon at the 2, and Franchise at point. Also, can Francis, Odom, Swift, and the best center next year(maybe Woods or Haywood who wouldn't be problems if they didn't develop great offensive games but they're still solid) share the ball?

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[This message has been edited by DaFranchise (edited May 12, 2000).]

 

I'm guessing that our lotto pick this year would go LAC as part of the original deal. I also have trouble buying Chicago's interest in this deal. Way to think big though. I can't even begin to think like that on a Friday afternoon.

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interesting. But I don't see Vancouver giving up their pick for next year. However, what if you substitute that, for the pick the Rockets owe them, and the Rockets no longer owe them a pick?

I can nearly guarantee the Clippers won't trade Kandi, Odom, and their pick for Walt, KT, Drew, our pick, and Cato. Unless Odom demands a trade, but still, plenty of people would be after him. Maybe if we added the rights to the Detroit pick, and the Orlando pick, and our pick next year, but still, it'd be a long shot.

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Swift, 2 high lotto picks, Odom, and Olowokandi for Drew, Walt, and Cato. That sounds fair. I count 5 potential franchise cornerstones, for one 3rd-stringer (on a lottery team) and 2 borderline starters (on a lottery team). Basically five top 5 picks, in exchange for three role players (that's being nice). Where do I sign?!

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I didn't even think about the salaries until now but it doesn't work. Kandi probably makes 4 mil, Odom 3, that makes 7. Cato makes 5.5(but base year makes it 2.75), Walt makes 4.5, Drew makes 1.5, and KT makes 1.1. That makes 9.85. I don't think the exception works the other way around but if it does the deal works. Other than that it's impossible.

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This deal is WAY lopsided in our favor. I'd be happy to do it.

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Why would LA give Odom away under the new CBA? He is signed for 5 years I believe.

Odom is a pipe-dream.

Forget about it.

 

The chances of landing Lamar Odom are slim, but not a pipedream. Odom becomes a free agent in 2002, the same time as Steve Francis (although by then I'm sure he'll have signed an extension). Also getting Odom would allow versitality at the three since he is 6'10". If the Rockets were to offer the Clippers Bryce Drew, this year's first round pick, Walt Williams, and cash considerations, it could possibly happen.

As for the chances of the trade topic proposed, I doubt that would happen, the deal just seems a little one-sided for the Rockets.

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The deal does work salary wise for the fact the Clippers are under the cap. No 15% rule.

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"Bryce Drew, this year's first round pick, Walt Williams, and cash considerations, it could possibly happen." (FOR LAMAR ODOM?!!!)

The clippers can certainly get a lot more than that. That is just pathetic. Sure, we'll take your scrubs for a future superstar. If they clippers even gave so much as an inclination that they were going to give him up, other teams would be offering some gems which would make that deal pale in comparison.

I guarantee they are going to keep odom for the long haul even though they are the clips.

Pipedream.

 

To clarify:

Sherlock Wrote:"... Popeye mentioned that he has hopes we could land Odom and Kandi and their first round pick for Drew, Williams, and Cato (and maybe KT)..."

Davo Wrote: "... I acknowledge that you are using Popeye's info ...."

Please keep in mind that the "hopes" of Cato, Walt, Drew, KT and picks for Odom in a previous thread was pure fantasy on another posters' part and related to a previous post in that thread. I agreed that I would love/hope for that to happen.

The only real basis for that hope was posted by me in a couple of seperate threads when I mentioned that I knew their was contact between Houston and LAC. And, that the target in those talks was around Odom and Kandiman's availability.

Nikestrad wrote: ".... I can nearly guarantee the Clippers won't trade Kandi, Odom, and their pick for Walt, KT, Drew, our pick, and Cato....." This is very close to my opinion also, except I would maybe give a little more weight to the remote possibility than my friend Nike maybe indicates. This is the Clips afterall. And, Odom has indeed voiced his frustration this past year. And, the clips are rebuilding. Sometimes that has meant demolishing. LOL

Cheers.



[This message has been edited by popeye (edited May 14, 2000).]

 

Pops, lurking around alone on the BBS, early this AM?

Sherlock: It may not seem a big deal, but I would be weary of more than 2 stars on the team. The Dream/Barkley/Drexler[Pippen] era proved that too many ego's can get in the way, and even more so with a younger team. Francis is our first star. We need one more, and then we can go about filling in the holes and building chemistry. Let's remember, Mobley may not be a star, but he still needs star shots (15) to be effective. Shandon Anderson is another player capable of 20+ if he feels his team needs it. A lineup of Anderson,Mobley,Swift,Odom,Francis may seem enticing, but for the above reasons it would never work. However, I would take my chances with Star1-Francis, Star2-Odom, Half-Star-Mobley, CapableRolePlayers-Anderson,Thomas.

Popeye: I don't really understand the notion that the Clippers are stupid. Their problem is that they do not make an attempt to resign their players. Other than that fatal problem (and the idiotic McDyess draft day trade), they have made some good moves. Lamond Murray for Derek Anderson was nice. They even managed to fetch 2 first rounders for Lorenzon Wright, a player they knew they couldn't resign.

Cato+#9+Drew=>Odom ?

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Hmmm.....

Drew+Cato+#9=Olowakandi+#1?

I think we can say Cato is an improvement over Olowakandi (let's take into consideration Shaq dropped 61 on him.) Those picks would likely turn into for #1, either KMart, or Swift, and the #9 would be either Moiso, Johnson, Alexander or Miller.

cabbage-the way things are looking, since Taylor and DA are gone, they have capable starters at: Center (sort of; Olowakandi) and SF (Odom). Now, they could turn that into a capable PG (Drew), capable SF (WW), capable PF (KT), and a capable center (Cato), and with the draft deep in SGs, quite possibly COURTNEY ALEXANDER at the #9 pick, the just created a starting lineup with all guys young, except for Walt who isn't quite old yet.

Looking at it in that light is interesting....hmm. I think if they took out their pick, and we took out ours it MIGHT have a chance of going down.

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[This message has been edited by NIKEstrad (edited May 14, 2000).]

 

Hey cab!

Well the stupid tag may be of the " too harsh a description" variety but it is not yet ready to be placed in the "erroneous urban legend" stack either.

They perrenially fail to make any inroads that are obvious.

I mean to say, look all their efforts at improving, all the first round picks they "earn", all the opportunities to resign credible players .... and yet, they are still nowhere.

Dallas is another team that is not quite as bad, but they seemingly have squandered opportunities also. But even they have made more headway than the Clips and they haven't had as many picks.(Dallas just makes so many ill-advised picks... like the Wei Wa Whatever, the Chinese athlete that everyone knew was not going to be allowed to play in America.)

In my opinion Clip's biggest problem is the owner. He is the Hollywood type who "plays" at being a sports mogul in LaLaLand.

In my opinion Dallas' biggest problem is the coach and general manager. The best thing, however, is that the new owner will likely oust both of those guys and Dallas will begin to live up to it's potential.

NIKEstrad

Don't lose sight of the coachability of both players when comparing them. Cato, in my opinion anyway, is not coachable. He is instinctive, and emotional. As an example: he has thwarted (thwarted????dang!) the offer and opportunity to be assisted/helped/coached by Hakeem this whole season. Kandi man is begging to be coached and Hakeem would be the most ideal teacher in that role. It would also add some zip to Hakeem's final season.

[This message has been edited by popeye (edited May 14, 2000).]

 

Clutch

Reasons:

1. You must trade something to get something, and Odom is the best something they have.

2. Odom likely would enjoy being on a team that attempts to win, once in a while. They had talent this year. This roster was not as unskilled as the stats project.

3. Because they can. There is a certain irony and yes, even savoir faire, to trading away yet another building block to the future. Ask any artsy-fartsy LA sports mogul. LOL

 

But, maybe that's what the Clippers wants. Cato's emotion gives them IDENTITY. And, no more times Shaq drops 61 on them, as Cato did prove effective against Shaq.

Also, remember, we happen to have Odom's best friend in Mobley, and he and Francis seem to get along too. Odom could very easily say to them, I want to play with Cuttino. Either bring Cuttino to me (Cuttino would never sign with the Clippers), or send me to Cuttino.

Kandi and Hakeem would be great. I believe Kandi is also Nigerian, right?

Their lineup next year, assuming the #1 pick, will look like this:
Olowakandi
Martin
Odom
SCRUB #1
SCRUB #2

If they made a trade with us, that could become:
Cato (+)
Thomas (-)
Williams (-)
Courtney Alexander (+)
Drew (+)

That's 3 improvements to 2 degrades. Courtney Alexander is a bona fide scorer. KT can rebound. Drew is a great passer, and hits the open shots. Easy comparison to this? Philadelphia. The role of Iverson is Courtney Alexander, Eric Snow is Bryce Drew, Theo Ratliff is Kelvin Cato, etc. etc.

Cato is locked up long term, so they won't lose him. Bryce, KT, and Walt are not very vocal, and wouldn't have any problems with the Clippers.

The Rockets go from:
Cato
Thomas
Williams
S. Anderson
Francis

to

Olowakandi (-)
Martin (+)
Odom (+)
S. Anderson (no change)
Francis (no change)

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Nike--

Players usually don't end up where they want when they're under contract, because their share of the decision making is VERY little under those circumstances. I find it highly unlikely that Odom wants to play with Cuttino so badly he could force a trade and have even the Clippers take Walt, Cato, and Thomas. They still aren't getting equal value. I'm thinking if he was disgruntled, they'd look for a better trade to get what they WANT, and then force THAT Team to handle the problem. =)

btw, the remark on Bryce not being very vocal was amusing...but don't forget he's a virtual clone of an N'Sync/backstreet boy.

elie17

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