1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

Harden needs to be better

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by justtxyank, Feb 27, 2017.

  1. Stormy1234

    Stormy1234 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2015
    Messages:
    1,991
    Likes Received:
    5,854
  2. justtxyank

    justtxyank Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2005
    Messages:
    42,732
    Likes Received:
    39,396
    We are in agreement!

    His obsession with the pull up 3 is maddening
     
    jeevinesh, hakeem94 and Stormy1234 like this.
  3. J Sizzle

    J Sizzle Member

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2012
    Messages:
    43,505
    Likes Received:
    29,554
    It's almost like....turnovers don't matter nearly as much as more important aspects of the game?

    Somebody get Holic on the phone!
     
    hakeem94 and Stormy1234 like this.
  4. b2bizchina

    b2bizchina Member

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2003
    Messages:
    2,579
    Likes Received:
    183
    Harden cannt win MVP
     
    Stormy1234 likes this.
  5. SF3isBack!!

    SF3isBack!! Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2007
    Messages:
    10,163
    Likes Received:
    1,879
    Rockets fans need to be better. You guys suck, Toyota Center always empty, you guys arent even good fans what do you expect from the team? Always whining...
     
    Mr Chuck Norris and Stormy1234 like this.
  6. Tha_Dude

    Tha_Dude Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2016
    Messages:
    3,465
    Likes Received:
    6,628
    Carrying a team as the lone superstar isn't an easy thing, either. Lebron couldn't do it. Kobe never made it out of the first round without all-star help. Harden has a tough task ahead of him regardless of how many minutes he plays. If Ariza, Gordon, Anderson and Bev aren't making 3's the Rockets will not go very far.
     
  7. justtxyank

    justtxyank Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2005
    Messages:
    42,732
    Likes Received:
    39,396
    Very fair point.
     
    Mr Chuck Norris and Stormy1234 like this.
  8. SF3isBack!!

    SF3isBack!! Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2007
    Messages:
    10,163
    Likes Received:
    1,879
    I say this constantly but no one cares. They are not trying to hear this. Even Jordan had Pippen and later Rodman but their expectations for Harden are a bit ridiculous and I think that is what happens when nerds watch basketball but can't actually play on any level.
     
    #28 SF3isBack!!, Feb 28, 2017
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2017
    Mr Chuck Norris and Stormy1234 like this.
  9. basketballholic

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2013
    Messages:
    17,516
    Likes Received:
    4,170
    Harden had a superstar playing with him. He didn't like it. Here we are.
     
  10. justtxyank

    justtxyank Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2005
    Messages:
    42,732
    Likes Received:
    39,396
    Eh not sure what you are taking about. The vast majority of us are very supportive of harden and are well aware that he is the Lin star on this team.

    That doesn't mean he can be immune of criticism when it's warranted. If this devolved into bashing him like some others have done in the past, then your defensiveness of him would be warranted. The first two posts pointed out his deficiencies of late but also said he's still the league MVP. That seems like a high level of praise still for harden.

    Don't get so defensive. It's a message board and fans will kick around thoughts to sort through them. Hay doesn't mean anyone is bashing him.
     
  11. snowconeman22

    snowconeman22 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2008
    Messages:
    14,059
    Likes Received:
    16,011
    Yes . And the thing that is crucial to understand is that harden is largely responsible for the quality of those guys 3's .

    If James sets up bev and trev for the corner 3 then I feel good about them making it . The same goes for Ryan from the wing . Gordon is a bit different (especially since he's been in chucker mode for a while now)

    It really is all on James . We need him destroying other defenses. That being said , of course our guys have to knock down shots .

    What we (as a team ) need to do for James is find a way to produce good quality looks when he's not on the floor and provide him with a lineup (when he's in ) that he can work with .

    I like the starters . I think if rested they can hold up . James with EJ and nene I'm less sure about . James with bev and EJ was pretty good earlier on , but EJ (I feel)has been slipping for a while.

    So far Williams and Gordon with James has been atrocious and I think we've compounded that by playing nene at center and Ariza at PF .

    So some things will have to change for me to feel good about our chances . And I think it starts with the lineups and then leads to production and execution which then leads to rest and maybe a couple games off . I think seedlings are pretty set regardless .
     
    Stormy1234 likes this.
  12. EffTheJazz!!!

    EffTheJazz!!! Member

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2010
    Messages:
    701
    Likes Received:
    139
    I think this throw it to the wing and lets the shooters jack it up thing is making him complacent. And he's jacking up 3's himself.

    Instead of surrounding a post player with shooters and playing inside out we're surrounding a wing with wings and playing outside-out....

    I think he needs to get to the basket more. Especially when 3's aren't falling, and even when they are.

    He's the difference maker. we already have the shooters, we don't need him going 1-9. I'd rather of 5 of those shots being mid range stepbacks or drives. Those are either open looks or fouls.

    Can we have a analytics offense where everyone jacks up 3's with harden being the exception? They'll get more open looks and he'll be the difference, playing however he wants including the lethal stepback.

    Our offense and complacency (his complacency too) is starting to neutralize him to some extent. He and our offense looked much better earlier in the year.
     
  13. brewer's goat

    brewer's goat Member

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2016
    Messages:
    576
    Likes Received:
    398
    Very good analysis. Completely agree.
     
  14. SF3isBack!!

    SF3isBack!! Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2007
    Messages:
    10,163
    Likes Received:
    1,879
    This is BS, Dwight quit and was not a superstar, he hasnt made all star and has not put up all star numbers in years. When Harden had reall superstars with him he went to the finals.
     
  15. justtxyank

    justtxyank Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2005
    Messages:
    42,732
    Likes Received:
    39,396
    Agree that post is rubbish
     
  16. Tha_Dude

    Tha_Dude Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2016
    Messages:
    3,465
    Likes Received:
    6,628
    I think that's a bit unfair considering the fact that Dwight has been a clown for every team he's ever played for. Even Kobe called him out numerous times for this. Dwight was the veteran player when he came here, he should have been a better leader but he didn't want that role. He was more interested in pouting when he wasn't getting his way, and it showed on the court especially last season. Dwight is a mental midget and you can't blame that 100% on Harden.
     
    TEXNIFICENT and SF3isBack!! like this.
  17. basketballholic

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2013
    Messages:
    17,516
    Likes Received:
    4,170
    Call BS all you want. Rockets recruited him as a superstar, and paid him as a superstar. Harden even said himself, "Me and Dwight are the cornerstones. The rest of the guys are role players." So, deny ll that evidence. Harden decided halfway into Dwight's contract that he didn't want tho play with him anymore.

    Here we are.
     
    hakeem94 likes this.
  18. brewer's goat

    brewer's goat Member

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2016
    Messages:
    576
    Likes Received:
    398
    Remember when Harden was a lethal one-on-one player? Remember when Harden was the step back king? What happened to that Harden? He's playing like Rubio without the defense right now. Harden thinks he's a better passer and worse scorer than he actually is. That's a problem.

    Given his high turnover rate, Harden can't afford to be a pass first player all game long. He needs to get buckets - that's his main strength no matter what.
     
    BigM and Stormy1234 like this.
  19. basketballholic

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2013
    Messages:
    17,516
    Likes Received:
    4,170
    Oh? If he was a clown everywhere then why did we sign him to a max deal, call him a superstar, and treat him like superstar until James decided he didn't want him?

    Can't have it both ways. Harden is directly responsible for this roster. He had approved every acquisition and every player he didn't want to play with was moved out.
     
  20. Tha_Dude

    Tha_Dude Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2016
    Messages:
    3,465
    Likes Received:
    6,628
    Harden definitely needs to drive more rather than settle for 3's. But, if you're expecting more mid range shots I wouldn't hold your breath on that. Morey and MDA have basically gone all in on the 3 ball concept and have doubled down on it with the Williams deal. It's here to stay.
     
    Stormy1234 likes this.

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now