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Giles has to go

Discussion in 'Houston Astros' started by RKREBORN, Sep 24, 2016.

  1. Hey Now!

    Hey Now! Contributing Member

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    Well, I don't remember the specifics of the conversation - but two things: 1) they added Gomez to their 2016 payroll, which, while not exorbitantly expensive, was, nonetheless, $9MM. That has to be accounted for; 2) they fist-forked their offseason by massively misreading the Rasmus situation. So their offseason was, more or less - at least financially - sunk before it really had a chance to even start because they added nearly $25MM to their OF before free agency began. BUT... they DID spend money... Gomez, Rasmus, Sipp, Fister - a big raise for Keuchel (nearly $7MM).

    In terms of your question, I don't know what tires they kicked; all I can do is react to what was done - and what they did, to me, anyway, seemed not to be a money issue, per se, but a priority issue. They had season-long issues with their everyday line-up and wound up dumping resources into one of the problems with that everyday line-up (Rasmus) and reconstructed a bullpen that, essentially, had a bad month (but was fairly exceptional, otherwise). Hindsight, on my part - but starting pitching should have been a priority, too.

    So, yeah - I think they'll spend money (it might not be massive amounts - they'll be smart; but they'll spend it). My hope is that this winter, they have a better handle on their team.
     
  2. jim1961

    jim1961 Member

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    Agreed. Maybe this year, instead of trying to plug perceived holes, especially in light of a weak FA market, just grab the best FA's available. We can shift some guys around if necessary.

    The thing that keeps coming up for me, looking at last year, is how far off ones perception of need can be. In addition, how expectations of the guys you did get can be far off as well.

    These things happened:

    1) We snuck up on some folks last year which wasn't going to happen this year.
    2) This team, Houston teams in general, always seem to perform best when expectation are low. Last year they were, this year, they were not.
    3) We had two 20 game winners last year, that was bound not to repeat, Rasmus went nuts in the playoffs, and a couple other guys over-performed as well. Some regression should have been expected, at least certain players.
    4) Somehow, the cold NY start took an entire month for us to thaw from. Some sort of mental thing pervaded the first month of play.
    5) A weak 2016 winter offseason led to too few reinforcements available when we faced some adversity with injuries.
     
  3. Nick

    Nick Contributing Member

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    But at the end of the day, they end up with a very similar record to last year... without those 2 20 game winners, without sneaking up on people, without any player performing significantly above their head, with real attached expectations.

    Things aren't as dire as many suspect. Also, this is baseball.... not the NBA or NFL where typically the best overall team is going to consistently be in the hunt. Things change on a decent spectrum from year to year. Cleveland was picked to win it all 2 years ago, struggled last year, and now have had a major rebound. Boston was awful last year. St. Louis and Pittsburgh are having down years but it wouldn't be surprising at all to see them bounce back next year.
     
  4. jim1961

    jim1961 Member

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    True. It seems to me you could read this as last year we were not as good as our record indicated or this year we may be better.

    I think this year exposed our team more true to what it really is than last year did. So what we see right now is clearer, not dire.
     
  5. the shark

    the shark Member

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    I hope you're right. I guess only time will tell.
     
  6. red

    red Contributing Member

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    I'm looking forward to that.
     
  7. vince

    vince Member

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    Giles might be more set up as an 8th inning guy. For at least another season. He just hasn't done too well in high leverage situations.

    And no I am not one who thinks he has to go, there is definitely something to work with, plus he is still a young pitcher.
     
  8. Snake Diggit

    Snake Diggit Member

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    I liked the position player roster entering this season, especially considering they planned on making a run at Gurriel. Their only major hole was at 1B, but I thought between White, Singleton, and Reed, that weakness would be adequately filled if not become a strength. None of those players panned out, and combining that with the collapse of Gomez and Rasmus left the offense a disappointment. I was also fine with their move to sign Sipp and trade for Giles, and I liked the bullpen going into the season. Between all the young arms looking to break in and the 5 returning late inning arms (Neshek, Sipp, Harris, Gregerson, Giles) I figured the pen would be good. And aside from a few untimely meltdowns, the pen has been a strength.

    The real problem I had with this past offseason was their failure to address the rotation. When the FO was unable to acquire Hamels (a huge setback that may ultimately be viewed as the moment Houstons long term WS hopes vanished), they needed to keep pace with the Rangers. Now of course we have no way of knowing what other teams asking prices were for ToR SP or what other free agents demands might've been to sign with Houston, but making Fister the only addition to the rotation was pitiful. I actually liked the Fister signing and thought he'd make a good BoR SP, I just knew that If it was the only move it would be far too little. I didn't predict Keuchel's down year or McCullers' injury, but even had those things not happened, Houston would be at a disadvantage in a playoff series.

    This offseason is the bell weather. Either they are going to go for it or they are going to be content to maintain their status as also-rans.

    I'm the biggest prospects lover there is. But **** it. Go get an ace. Stack the team. Beat the ****ing Rangers.

    P.S. To stay on topic, I do not think Giles needs to go and think he will make a fine closer, although if Houston wants to sign Chapman and put Giles in the8th, I'd be more than cool with that.
     
    Yaosthirdleg likes this.
  9. Nick

    Nick Contributing Member

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    That was pretty much the case with all the back of the bullpen pitchers last year. All of them performed much better in the setup role than the 9th inning.

    Like most have said, the team has other needs. Giles represents the best, as of now, of a bunch of mediocre options... and his K ability has been underrated as a weapon. Once they shore up other areas, if there's an elite/proven closer out there that can be had for the right price, they could explore that. As always, would prefer an in-house option amongst all the young/live arms they have in the system as not all of them are going to make it as starters.
     
  10. oelman44

    oelman44 Member

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    I agree he hasn't been a good closer, but I sure as hell think he has a good chance to be one of the league's best. 2.43 SIERA, 14.06 K/9! He had a .349 BABIP, so luck wasn't exactly on his side this year. Needs to curb the walks, but based on skill and investment I'd be very disappointed if Giles isn't the 2017 opening day closer.
     
    Yaosthirdleg likes this.

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