All time saves: Frank DiPino ( 283rd ) Todd Jones ( 19th ), Doug Jones ( 25th ), Bill Dawley ( 559th ) Jose Valverde ( 29th ) Joe Sambito ( 186th ) Luke Gregerson ( 241st ) Ken Forsch ( 320th ) Ken Giles ( 349th ) Mitch Williams ( 51st ) Dave Veres ( 161st) Doug Henry ( 195th ) Fred Gladding ( 131st ) Chad Qualls ( 217th ) Brad Lidge ( 40th) , Billy Wagner( 6th ) Octavio Dotel ( 131st ) Aurelio Lopez ( 166th ) Dave Smith ( 43rd )
I never hold it against a reliever when he fails in the 8th or in a non close situation. I put that on the manager for improper use. But even for hardliner usage like myself it is hard to look past the horrendous era. That's not pretty. Everything is relative tho and you have to ask yourself where does he rate amongst all closers in the league, and on the team, and decide from there. Harris was a failure in his go. Gregerson was shaky. Giles is the best option. So I'd say given him another 40 games and if it continues to look like last night then go out and get another closer with arm speed.
I don't think mediocre is accurate. Its hard for me to label anyone with an 100 MPH fastball and a killer slider mediocre, and he's put together flashes of brilliance. The problem is he is wildly inconsistent, and has put together some horrible stretches as well.
I'm with you on another 40 games at least. But you gotta use something besides ERA for evaluating any RP across a season, much less 23 innings
Don't forget Giles took the L too. He could easily be argued as f***** up the game. His road situations have featured lower leverage IIRC.... but another respected poster said he didn't care about meaningless runs surrendered, so why should anyone else care about his splits evening out? Sounds like you don't need to be evaluating closers. Hinch did nothing ludicrous last night. Giles simply f***** it off. Is Ken still the best in-house option going forward? Yeah, probably
No, he has been mediocre as a closer for the Astros. Look at the closers around the major leagues and Giles is an average closer at best. He is a middling closer that happens to be on an elite team.
well I'm thinkin Devinksi very well might be the best option to close...heck he can pitch 8th and 9th..ice in his veins...always an option if things get out of hand with Giles as the season marches on in my opinion
One of the big stories and the thing that the Astros love about Devo is his versatility and his ability to thrive without a consistent role - something many pitchers struggle with. Part of the big reason for our success is having a guy like that. Giles can more easily be replaced as closer by someone else than Devo can in his weird role.
He's definitely been a mediocre pitcher during his Astros tenure... but he has been one of the better guys at securing saves this year (if you even value saves... which can be overrated at times). He's still one of the better arms in a very good bullpen. I've been far more dissapointed in Gregerson than Giles. Neshek would probably be better in the Gregerson role.
True, but Gregerson has *never* pitched this poorly over the course of a season. I'd rather bet on him to course-correct than hypothetically trade him for Neshek's 85 mph FB
Something is not right with him. Fastball isn't moving. Slider is all over the place. I'd be more comforted if it was simply a loss of confidence... but I think this goes beyond just mental stuff. If he's hurting, needs to be shelved till healthy. 2 pitch pitchers can't afford to lose even the slightest bit of "stuff" due to injury.
I've heard a lot of people talk about the Astros needing another elite starting pitcher for the playoffs. But, I'm more concerned about our closer. We gave up a lot for Giles, and his numbers looked great with the Phillies. But, he hasn't performed to the level I was hoping for. I guess maybe we've been spoiled a little bit with closers like Dave Smith, Wagner, and Lidge. But, we really do need someone that we can depend on.
Well certainly, his struggles have not gone unnoticed. With 4 pitchers on the DL already, it would be a tough time to add a 5th. But ignoring circumstance, I agree with you.
Even if this bullpen was flawless (no bullpen is)... its not going to survive if 3/5th's of the rotation can't pitch consistently more than 5 innings. They need more out of the starters. They may still add a bullpen guy, but not at the expense of adding a starter as well.
You can't have a closer who is wild in the strike zone no matter how hard he throws. It would be a shame to lose a playoff series because of it.
In the playoffs, the top 3 SP's are crucial to a successful run. Right now, there isnt anyone in the organization id trust as that #3 guy. Id give an outside chance to McHugh or Morton. But im afraid that is just wishful thinking on my part.
True I def agree...and he's proven as of late he can close "just in case" if needed come the playoffs....luxury all around
To everyone who has complained about Giles in the past, or worried about him even when he was pitching relatively well by saying "well, he had that cold streak" or "I just don't trust him".. Look at what's happened to Chapman. And Holland. And Osuna. These are all guys that people would've claimed to be the elite closers and more trusted than Giles over the first 3 months of the season. My point isn't that they suck because of this recent streak. It's to say that even the guy that you always want to point to as "elite" go through rough patches. But when you're not a fan of that team, you can brush it off as a cold streak. Just because we watch our guys every day doesn't mean we have to be overly reactionary.
