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Dems moved too far left

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by dachuda86, Sep 22, 2019.

  1. Aleron

    Aleron Contributing Member

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    This far left wing of the democrats, they don't seem interested in winning the next election, sure they might say it, but their actions run contrary to that.

    But i suspect there's method to this, as they are looking at primarying more and more moderates, they'd rather lose the election than a moderate win, so when they manage to shunt the party left, eventually they'll win. it's a 2 horse race after all, and then they'll have control of the party to finally pursue their agenda.

    A moderate democrat who won't pursue their agenda is worse for them than a republican in the white house, as the democrat grants power of the party to said wing.
     
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  2. Nolen

    Nolen Contributing Member
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    A couple of things here. First, I refer you to my first post on page one of this thread.
    - Public option healthcare is mainstream
    - Taxing the rich is mainstream
    - Gun control is mainstream
    These issues all poll over 70% and a majority of republicans. Seventy percent and a majority of republicans.

    Just ten years ago this wasn't true, and I can understand why some who haven't been following would believe that these issues are too extreme, but that's just not true anymore. The democratic party supporting these policies because the American people support them.

    Now if a hypothetical candidate Warren wins the nomination and still pushes Medicare for All, that's worth worrying about, it's polling between 40 and 50. It could really hurt her chances. But we cannot overlook: a literal government takeover of healthcare is polling over 40. That's how far left the country has shifted in ten years.

    Secondly, and this deserves its own thread, the currently accepted wisdom that candidates must pivot to the middle in order to win isn't true in the current political climate. There are newer models that more accurately predict demographics and outcomes based on "negative partisanship."
    https://www.salon.com/2019/08/17/th...d-the-2018-blue-wave-heres-her-2020-forecast/
    https://www.salon.com/2019/06/02/th...-c90jzcgRbQwyVTi-gIfV7XlAgVE2MyxEe-n3tCv4-zXw

    This also explains Trumps' victory. People on the left and right are tired of status quo, and they want populist solutions (I'm not saying that a great thing, but it's true). Middle of the road candidates who represent status quo will actually suppress turnout.
     
  3. Aleron

    Aleron Contributing Member

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    Actually its still not true, the way the questions are asked are designed to be leading and produce the result people want. Which is why when the question is asked in alternative framing, it produces drastically different results.

    But then when politics happens, it works more like, candidate 1 frames their argument in their narrative, candidate 2 frames their argument in their narrative (simple example is undocumented migrant and illegal immigrant are the same thing framed differently) and the public then essentially believes the one they prefer, this is why for example they don't want to answer the "will your taxes go up" question.

    You can see the poll here, where they essentially do the multiple framing part in a series of questions

    [​IMG]
     
    #43 Aleron, Sep 23, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2019
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  4. Nolen

    Nolen Contributing Member
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    Agreed. Thanks for including the poll, I've seen it before. In the case of this poll, I was wrong to say that when phrased as a government takeover M4A polls over 40, instead here it's 37. But even 37 is a miracle compared to where opinions were 10 years ago.

    Public option polls extremely well, also with republicans.
     
  5. No Worries

    No Worries Contributing Member

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    We all are becoming god hating communies.
     
  6. Rocket River

    Rocket River Member

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    I think they may have moved so far Right . .. that the Extreme Left is what was the old Right

    Rocket River
     
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  7. FranchiseBlade

    FranchiseBlade Contributing Member
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    That chart also leaves out certain facts. Private Health insurance companies being gone wouldn't get near the negative if it pointed out that Americans would be able to choose the doctors and specialists that they liked and not confined to the ones their insurance covered.

    The chart mentions that Americans would be required to pay more taxes but would still spend less of their own money. If the question pointed out that it was an overall savings, much of the negative would be erased from that question. If you buy sandwiches every week and they raise the price of bread by $4 but lower the price of sandwich meat by $10 you still save $6 even though they raised the price of bread.
     

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  8. dachuda86

    dachuda86 Member

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    Go take a political compass test from 10 or 15 years ago and tell me how that goes for you...
     
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  9. cml750

    cml750 Contributing Member

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    Most of their candidates are openly embracing socialism and they say we have moved too far to the right? My political beliefs are the same as the were 32 + years ago when I was first eligible to vote.
     
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  10. Carl Herrera

    Carl Herrera Contributing Member

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    For you people, Democrats are always too far left.
     
  11. dachuda86

    dachuda86 Member

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    What do you mean.. you people?
     
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  12. adoo

    adoo Member

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    for the education of jcm750

    Trump's bailout to the farmers is the textbook case of socialism
     
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  13. Trader_Jorge

    Trader_Jorge King of the D&D, The Legend, #1 Ranking
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    [Premium Post]
    If the Democrats' #1 goal is the removal of President Donald J Trump from office, then it's stunning that the Democrats are lurching so far to the left. Simple logic would suggest that they should stake out policy positions that appeal to 50% of electoral college votes. But one of the reasons that liberals are liberal is because they have very poor impulse control, and they also don't think things through past step 1. In this way, their minds work like that of a dog. Greed will do them in as a candidate like Warren or Bernie do not have policy positions that can win over Independents. Biden is fatally flawed due to corruption and declining mental faculties, and the rest of the candidates all have major problems.

    GOOD DAY
     
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  14. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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  15. No Worries

    No Worries Contributing Member

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    Most of all candidates support socialism, especially Social Security and Medicare.

    Some Republicans do want "entitlement reform", but the electorate is ignorant of what that means or they would be tossed out.
     
  16. JayGoogle

    JayGoogle Member

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    People keep saying a Moderate democrat would win...when a Moderate democrat lost.

    A moderate democrat in America is still center right almost anywhere else in the developed world, so what is really happening is that you are finally seeing actual left wing politics return to America.

    Seriously, compare FDR to Obama and say with a straight face that the democratic party has moved too far to the left.
     
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  17. Carl Herrera

    Carl Herrera Contributing Member

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    People who would not pass an entrance exam for citizenship if they were not legacy admits.
     
  18. ROXTXIA

    ROXTXIA Contributing Member

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    Looks like we have a Cave Troll.
     
  19. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

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    Obama straight up legitimized illegal aliens trough theh dream act giving a path to citizenship.

    The DREAM act, despite having bipartisan support, and despite the fact that it's core priniciples are overwhelmingly popular, was never able to clear Moscow Mitch's filibuster in any of the years it was introduced, so President Obama never had the chance to sign it.

    The statement above then fails. The facts you proudly cite are thus the garbled rantings of a talk radio shitbird, they should f-k off back down the AM dial from whence they came.
     
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  20. dachuda86

    dachuda86 Member

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    Clinton ran a bad campaign... then the dems are pushing Biden who is showing early onset symptoms... lol Yeah run a healthy younger moderate dem and you'll see the DNC clutch victory from Trump. Far left socialism will not win in the US as it is.
     
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