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Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Coach E, Jun 5, 2018.

  1. Bobbythegreat

    Bobbythegreat Member
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    I always hear about what amazing lure LA has....yet I haven't seen it actually happen in well over a decade.....it seems to be nothing but BS propaganda from LA people.

    What are the biggest FA's that have chosen to leave where they were for the Lakers in the last 20 years? It legitimately could be Ron Artest and Derek Fisher could be 2nd on the list....there simply isn't a history of good players choosing to play in LA in the last 2 decades.
     
    Hakeemtheking and Bobsputin like this.
  2. ApacheWarrior

    ApacheWarrior Member

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    Money is the issue. It was the issue in Miami, it was the issue in Cleveland this year with a 141 mil tab. If you have Harden salary plus LeBrons $35 mil salary plus CP3 $30 plus mil salary plus Capella salary equals what ya got? Each will make $40 mil per year by year 3. You say no big deal because you aren't paying the bill. Miami owner said enough was enough. Dan Gilbert after 16/17 season has been saying why am I paying so much with only one championship to show for it. Just do the math.
     
  3. ApacheWarrior

    ApacheWarrior Member

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    We will see. The Lakers dynasty took a hit because Kobe was a ball hog. Shaq,Mailman,Payton,Nash, D12. took a lot out of that franchise. Dr Buss passed away and has been poorly run. Now that the brother is out and Magic is running the show. They look primed. If they get 2 stars....they will be back. Count on LeBron and PG13 being the 2 that start the wave again. They can get down to $17 mil or $10 mil depending on Deng. LeBron will have has good a tram as any when done adding pieces.
     
  4. Bobbythegreat

    Bobbythegreat Member
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    Yeah but that's a huge "IF" given that it's been over 20 years since a star player decided to sign with the Lakers. Also, you would be suggesting that Lebron would choose to play for less in LA while having no chance to win another championship than to make more money in Houston and win the next 2 or 3 championships....I just don't see it.

    Every year LA gets hyped, every year they strike out. Maybe they'll get Paul Geroge this year, but I just don't see Lebron throwing the rest of his career away just to live in LA like Melo did in NY.
     
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  5. ApacheWarrior

    ApacheWarrior Member

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    Yeah., you’re not getting it. There are big “IF’s” with Houston as well. You can’t guarantee me the Rockets will sign CP3 to the contract he demands. You can’t guarantee me the Rockets will have the shooters LeBron covets: where will Gerald Green be? Eric Gordon? Will he be traded to make room for LeBron? Ariza is leaking reports he might take a pay cut to join the Warriors as a way to leverage the Rockets to pay him the MLE instead of Luc MaM or others. If Ariza won’t except $3 mil or so then the others might not take less.....this all falls apart. Where will Luc MaM go?

    So don’t talk to me about winning a championship in Houston if the team disbands. No shooters.....no room in the paint to operate. Clutchfans want the 3rd star......if not LeBron then Paul George. What if I tell you both want to play together. And both have been dreaming about playing for the Lakers for years now. They join up as Lakers. You are going to tell me that the Great LeBron that gets to the finals every year won’t have NBA players waning to take pay cuts to play for him.
    Coupled with the star of Paul George’s caliber playing on the same team. Tripled by the fact that it will be in L.A.
    Quadrupled by the fact that they will have om for the 3rd star.

    Houston-Harden-CP3 fighting for 3rd star (let’s say CP3 signs max deal).
    Vs
    Lakers-LeBron-Paul George fighting for 3rd star.

    Kawhi hasn’t said he wants t play for Houston. His group has said Lakers. There is an outside possibility Kawhi heads there via trade. Kawhi group is pushing it. They may have to give up Kuzma/Josh Hart/Ingram/Lonzo Ball.....but so be it.

    Capela blocks DeAndre Jordan in Houston, but not with Lakers. What if it’s LeBron/PG13/ DeAndre Jordan?
    Free agents will go there. Like Capela, the Lakers will strive in the regular season with Jordan as Center....but like
    Houston and Capela......the paint will be congested vs the Warriors offensively. Rockets have that problem too unless Capela starts shooting for distance.

    It not the same ol’ same ol’ Lakers. Jeanie Buss got her brother out of there. Kupchak got the boot.
    Magic has been setting them straight again....so don’t lump Magic in with the decade old problems thevLakers
    have faced. He just got there last season. Don’t get mad at me either. It’s the Cavs that took Nance jr. and Clarkson
    that has allowed the Lakers this opportunity to climb out of the cellar and join the elites.

    The point is: LeBron and Paul George can attract the remaining 3rd star available because it’s also L.A.
    Don’t tell me what owners or GM’s say about matching or keeping a player no matter what. I saw the Rockets say they won’t let Parsons go......they will match whatever offer comes Parsons way......and then they didn’t match and didn’t keep Parsons. Will Capela turn out the same way?
     
  6. justtxyank

    justtxyank We are all Kosh
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    I accept your general point that no guarantees with Houston but you make a lot of factual mistakes.

    Ariza doesn’t need the mle from us, we have his bird rights. Just one example
     
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  7. ApacheWarrior

    ApacheWarrior Member

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    Explain why Ariza report came out, if not because he feels he is going to be squeezed?
     
  8. justtxyank

    justtxyank We are all Kosh
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    I’m not saying he will or won’t I’m saying we don’t have to worry about paying him the mle. We can literally pay him as much as we want up to his max.
     
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  9. ApacheWarrior

    ApacheWarrior Member

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    Yeah, well I’m saying someone is going to get squeezed.
    https://en.hispanosnba.com/salaries/houston-rockets

    Player............................18/19............19/20..............20/21..........21/22.......22/23
    Harden salary..............$30.4 mil......$37.8 mil........$40.8..........$43.8
    CP3 ?..............................$35.3 mil...........?......................?..................?..............?
    LeBron ?.........................$35.6 mil...........?
    Capela CF’s think...........$25 mil..............?...................?..................?
    _________________________________
    .................................. = $126.3 mil. (4 players)

    Yeah Tilman can pay everyone top dollar......but it’s not feasible. Some players are getting squeezed
    eventually. Starting this season.
     
    #109 ApacheWarrior, Jun 9, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2018
  10. Bobbythegreat

    Bobbythegreat Member
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    It's not that I'm not "getting" what you are saying, it's that I'm not buying it.

    I expect Gerald Green to be pretty easy to keep, this is his home town and the Rockets are the ONLY reason he's not retired right now. If the Rockets want to keep him, he'll stay.

    I expect Gordon to be gone, but Lebron for Gordon is a massive upgrade.

    The Rockets have Ariza's Bird rights, he might be leaking interest elsewhere, but that's just to ensure a better payday here when they finally get around to giving him a new deal very similar to what Iggy did with Golden State last year.

    "The fact it's LA" means literally nothing to me, and if the last 20 years of NBA free agency mean anything, it means nothing to NBA players either.

    The thing you can't get around is that a team of

    Capela
    Tucker
    Lebron
    Paul
    Harden

    is hands down better than anything that could be put together in LA and that's a very likely scenario if Lebron wants to come to Houston to play alongside his best friend in the league.

    The one thing the Rockets can say that no other team can say is that they beat this current Warriors team in 3 out of 5 playoff games before Chris Paul got hurt and derailed the off-season....in short this current Rockets team is better than the Warriors are now, if Lebron chose to come here he'd get a ton of credit when the Rockets crush the Warriors next season and it would be easy next to Chris Paul and James Harden. No longer would Lebron have to shoulder the load of carrying the team every night like he's had to in Cleveland. There's essentially no downside to joining Chris Paul in Houston. In LA, he'd have to face Houston AND Golden State in the playoffs every season on a team that likely couldn't beat either.

    Every year the media hypes up the Lakers, but I'm just not buying it.
     
  11. Bobbythegreat

    Bobbythegreat Member
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    Why is it not feasible? His cousins turned a nearly worthless UFC into a 4 billion dollar payday by dumping countless millions into it, do you really think that he'd balk at dumping a ton of money into the Rockets to essentially guarantee 3 or 4 NBA championships? We're talking about a billionaire here who has nearly doubled his net worth over the last 4 years, given the opportunity to essentially buy multiple NBA championships, I don't see him passing that up over the price tag.
     
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  12. Corrosion

    Corrosion Member

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    I don't disagree with the tax being an issue down the line ….. but Harden Cp3 , Capela and LBJ is at least a couple championships. Lebron would probably sign another contract similar to those he has in the past - 2 years with the second being a player option. That gives ownership an out and allows them to recoup some assets themselves in an opt in situation in that 3rd year with LBJ going where he wants again.

    CP3 …. that's the contract that gives me pause. I'd do 3 but seriously question going 5 due to health and age. I'd only do it if that was the only way he would stay but we'd pay for it down the line.

    Capela's max is $25.25m for what its worth - 25% of the cap as a player with 0-6 years in the league, the cap is $101m next season.
     
  13. Coach E

    Coach E Member

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    Odds holding at +200 LA, +220 Houston
     
  14. ApacheWarrior

    ApacheWarrior Member

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    What you are telling me is that, if you have been working in Cleveland and have a house in Los Angeles, and have been offered a job in both Houston or Los Angeles......your wife has told you she wants to move to LA full time a summer ago.......you would move to the city you have never lived in.

    You are probably one of the many men who lives by saying yes dear, anything you want dear. Happy wife means happy life dear. Wives tend to have major input on most of the biggest decisions of a marriage. DWade went to Cavs and his wife was miserable......Wade begs to go back to Miami.....does...she is thrilled and Wade looks happy again.

    Recently a report LeBron talked about going from Miami back to Cleveland........he said his wife’s response was, “F - that”.
    LeBrons mom supposedly said the same, “F - that!”

    I repeat LeBron likes the Lakers franchise, loves LA, will try to convince CP3 to come back to LA, *wants to have his own team (not Hardens), has PG13 begging him to go to Lakers, wife wants to be in LA, LeBron respects Magic Johnson,
    good chance free agents will swarm to the same team because LeBron has been to the last 7 or 8 finals, Kawhi wants
    to go to LA, DeAndre Jordan would play for less than $20 mil if CP3 doesn’t go to Lakers.

    You conveniently only claim Gordon being removed from the team. I’m seeing it as more than just Ryan and Gordon.
    Codman is worried Nene will also get the walking papers. You are being disingenuous.

    Lakers will be going after Rockets free agents and Warriors free agents this summer. GG might stay with Houston, but
    don’t be surprised if Ariza goes home to LA....possibly Luc.MaM. We will see how this plays out.....it could be interesting
    to see how players view LeBron and PG13 with Lakers......and the creative salary deals that will be presented as players
    migrate to LA. I hate the Lakers, but players love LA. They just needed the team aimed in the right direction. It appears to be that now.
     
  15. Bobbythegreat

    Bobbythegreat Member
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    It really sounds like you want the idea of Lebron to LA to be true....so much so that it is clearly clouding your judgement.

    In your mind you think it's reasonable for CP3 and Lebron to take pay cuts to go to LA on a team that likely has no chance to contend for a championship simply because "Lebron likes LA" or "Lebron's wife likes LA".....that's just not rational.

    When it comes to Ariza, the Rockets have his Bird rights, if they want to keep him, he's not going anywhere to make less money.

    The most money is in Houston, the ONLY realistic chance to win is in Houston....LA is in LA. I'm not sure how you look at that and think LA is the favorite unless you just fully buy the BS they sell every single season and yet they never land any top FA's.
     
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  16. ApacheWarrior

    ApacheWarrior Member

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    I’m Houston true and true......but you have to be crazy if you are LeBron and you don’t try to get to the Lakers where
    Kawhi Leonard has been trying to get traded to (LA) for the bettter part of a season. Can you imagine being seen as the number 1 player in the world.....possibly pairing up with Kawhi who many see as one of the top 3 players in the league......plus Paul George. You may burn a first season, but then having 2 of the best
    3 players in the league on the same team. Then get the help to topple the likes of a Warriors team that will take a hit financially this summer because of giving Durant his money. Losing depth.

    Take off your Homer glasses for a while.

    If I’m the Lakers I would give up Kuzma/Josh Hart/Lonzo Ball/Ingram/ 1st rd picks/ force Spurs to take Deng
    for Kawhi. Then build the roster around LeBron/PG13/Kawhi.....build it and they (FA’s) will come.
     
    #116 ApacheWarrior, Jun 9, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2018
  17. zcarenow

    zcarenow Member

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  18. Bobbythegreat

    Bobbythegreat Member
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    I would argue that he'd be crazy to seriously consider going to the Lakers only to have to get past the Warriors and Rockets in the playoffs every year.....and not being on a team there that would have much of a chance to make it past either team.

    Every convoluted scenario you invent for LA just seems like a more difficult way of creating an inferior product to what he could form in Houston.....and he'd be paid less in LA to be on that weaker team. Also, you are discounting CP3's influence. Would he want to go maybe put something together with Paul George and a maybe healthy Kawhi, or would he want to team up with his best friend in the league on a team that would easily dominate the rest of the league? I like thinking outside the box, but it seems like you are getting WAY too far outside the box in order to justify the LA narrative.

    If he goes to the West, it'll be with the Rockets sorry to kill your idea of LA's drawing power. There's a much better chance something works out with Boston or Philly than LA.....but of course the media will push the idea of LA, it just doesn't seem likely.
     
  19. Reeko

    Reeko Member

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    I’m not gonna discount what @ApacheWarrior is saying regarding the Lakers...I would not be shocked if Lebron did indeed go there to team up with Paul George, and they do have some young pieces that they could package together in order to try and trade for another star such as Kawhi

    Bron has a lot of respect for Paul George’s game after battling against him in the EC for so many years, and Magic Johnson does have some pull with players...he’s a legend and is very charismatic

    the Lakers have been turning around their rep, and if they do indeed get Bron and PG to sign, then players will be flocking there to try and be on a contender in LA

    just not gonna discount the LA possibility
     
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  20. PatBev

    PatBev Member

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    I think it comes down to rings vs family

    If he is slowing down and thinking about his kids and wife I would choose LA easily

    If they support him getting rings then it’s Houston
     
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