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COVID-19 (coronavirus disease)/SARS-CoV-2 virus

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout' started by tinman, Jan 22, 2020.

  1. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    Well said. We’ve been in self-isolation for a month now and we haven’t left the house and the front and back yards. Everything we’ve had delivered from four different sources. With HEB, the wait is as long as two weeks. Others, not as long. Every outlet uses a different system, even those owned by the same company. Different rules. Different things they will and won’t let you do, in other words. We got a delivery yesterday, two today, and we’re getting one tomorrow. We’re getting 2 on consecutive days about 10 days after the one tomorrow.

    I think we’re pretty well stocked. Lots of Pacifico, Negra Modelo, Heineken for her, Pinot Grigio (support Italy!), various reds on the dry side. The usual harder stuff if the latest 2 hour “briefing” was particularly awful. I watch them because it’s important to be informed. The Ensign might consider watching Idiot’s briefings on several consecutive days. He would learn something he clearly hasn’t learned yet, but I digress. I often do that. It doesn’t bother the dog, thank god.

    Lots of steaks, veggies, the freezer stuffed. Can’t seem to get Turbo Dog and really miss the Cajun place. At first, a four day wait seemed like forever. You worried about getting toilet paper, paper towels. Now I worry about if we’ll run out of ketchup I use for the BBQ sauce, charcoal for the grill, Diet Cokes that I drink far too many of. I think I’m addicted. Maybe it’s the caffeine. I consume a lot of caffeine these days.

    I’ve figured out that I have to keep copies of what I order, check things off when it arrives, or I might order something I already have in the pipeline. Everything delivered is handled wearing surgical gloves and I never open the door until they’ve driven away. It’s all wiped down with the Clorox spray cleaner with bleach. Smells awful, but that dissipates. We wipe down everything, even the doorbell.

    Talk to the kids by phone or text. One lives in Austin across town. She’s a successful Dev able to work from home, the other lives in Dallas with his partner. It’s all so freakin’ weird. At least we have a house, a nice yard, it’s paid for, and a big female Labradoodle that’s probably saving us from going crazy. The kids both live in apartments. I feel for them. I grill a hell of a lot. I mentioned that somewhere. My S.O. Is a vegetarian. I also mentioned that. It’s weird, but I’m used to it. She likes her veggie burgers grilled and some of the veggies, and I’m careful to move my steaks, etc., away from her stuff. Grilling gets me outside. It’s been raining recently in Austin. Good for the grass and the Oaks. I hate it. Can’t grill.

    For those who get out, I wouldn’t do it. You can work around having to do so if you try. As @Houstunna so eloquently illustrated, you can be as careful as possible, and the ignorant and/or stupid with come within contagion distance. To be fair, some may have just not gotten used to what should be routine. They better if we’re ever going to get over this. I would never, ever go into a store. We’ve yet to do curbside pickup, although at some point, not yet, I might consider it.

    There’s no time benefit from my experience. The wait is just as long, and we can afford what I consider a reasonable delivery fee. HEB, for example, includes a tip for the driver making the delivery on the bill. I think they aren’t getting paid enough, so we add to it. You can do that from all the sources. We only use the delivery provided by the stores, including Amazon/Whole Foods The local Whole Foods you purchase through Amazon, but they deliver it themselves, with the stuff coming straight from the store 10-15 minutes from where we live. Sadly, they don’t sell Cokes, but both sell booze. Right now, HEB doesn’t, but that’ll eventually change, I think. They provide the Cokes.

    Thought I’d share some of that. Like I said, it’s all freakin’ weird.
     
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  2. Kim

    Kim Contributing Member

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    https://home.treasury.gov/policy-issues/top-priorities/cares-act/assistance-for-small-businesses
    ^going through this myself. Fortunately, I have a small office, we're like a family, and the salaries I support are more like supplemental incomes for their families. I'm not expecting to see the program money anytime soon, but I'm okay for now.

    Also, restaurant (or any business) curbside advice: when they tell you to roll your window down to talk, barely crack that thing bc some of these people don't understand the whole point of the system - they're getting right up to the driver side window and talking into the car, smh.
     
  3. Nook

    Nook Member

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    You all are the same people that thought it was just a flu.... that then were upset when it was declared an emergency... that supported governors not issuing stay at home orders.... that thought everything should be opened up by Easter.... and you all are the same people that fail to realize that the shutdowns and quarantine have largely kept the death rate low.

    So no... educated people do not take you all serious. I wouldn’t care, except it directly impacts innocent people.
     
  4. robbie380

    robbie380 ლ(▀̿Ĺ̯▀̿ ̿ლ)
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    https://covidtracking.com/data/us-daily

    https://covidtracking.com/data

    The hospitalization data is tricky because it isn't published from each state. Also, yes I am assuming they are referring to hospitalization due to covid.
     
    heypartner likes this.
  5. CCity Zero

    CCity Zero Member

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    Thanks so much for the info, I absolutely agree with your thoughts on all of this. I think I'll try to get one more order in (sooner than later) and then do the same thing with avoiding leaving the house/ordering more for a while.

    We've been staying home etc. but I did go out to the grocery store last week later in the day - fortunately not many people but definitely would prefer to not go in again.
     
  6. sammy

    sammy Contributing Member

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    I'm pissed off that churches were open today. FML.. throw away all of the sporting events until a vaccine is out. SMH
     
  7. mogrod

    mogrod Contributing Member

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    I ordered Panera Bread bagels on Friday morning online. The whole website promoted their curbside pickup and even had a place to enter your car info so they can “see you park and bring your order to you”. I park and they have a sign saying to either call the number to order or, if you’ve already ordered, they’ll bring it out to your car. Not one employee brought anything out. The front doors were just left open and people just walked in. Literally people just parked and walked in like it was normal. The couple of us waiting in our cars had to get out and go in to get our orders.

    Wife and I went to Target yesterday and, not many people were there, but it was surprising how many had masks on. But it was amazing the few people who acted like they were either oblivious or didn’t care about the virus or any social distancing and would just walk right up to or close by us. Even the intercom had announcements reminding everyone to keep 6 feet apart but some employees acted like they didn’t care. One guy/employee (with no gloves or mask) was flat out just walking right up next to or reaching around customers.
     
  8. robbie380

    robbie380 ლ(▀̿Ĺ̯▀̿ ̿ლ)
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    I agree the CDC and WHO were a major problem to start. WHO is squarely to blame for a good chunk of this pandemic. The CDC currently looks stupid for this reverse course on masks as well. Also, I think those projected death numbers are extremely high.

    Can you show me the exact plans of these East Asian countries you are referring to? Japan tried to ignore the virus and they are getting ready to have to declare a national emergency. Are you referring to Taiwan? They had probably the best response in the world, but that was not possible for the US. The deaths would have been lessened if NY and NJ took similar steps to Cali. Also, if we banned all Euro travel much quicker that would have helped as well. It also probably would have helped the NYC subway wasn't a disease ridden shithole too. That said has there been any sort of indication exactly why NY/NJ got hammered so hard by this versus other major cities?

    Also, those states you are referring to never had major problems and they aren't exactly international hubs of trade and they are sparsely populated. Was there anything specific they did that you believe caused them to not be major infection hotspots? Do you think Alaska did something excellent or was it just an aspect of isolation and lack of population density?

    Lastly, and most importantly, were you actually for strict social controls like Taiwan instituted very early? I'm guessing you would have been highly opposed to them, but maybe I'm wrong.
     
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  9. Major

    Major Member

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    It's Commodore. This is the guy who gets all his news from twitter and just regurgitates things he finds on the internet. Also the guy who tries to sound smart by saying things like OpSec" because he read it somewhere on the web. I particularly enjoyed this post by heypartner pointing out his stupidity.
     
  10. robbie380

    robbie380 ლ(▀̿Ĺ̯▀̿ ̿ლ)
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    Not that it matters but I get the large majority of my news from twitter too lol

    He did bring up points worth discussion even if he isn't willing to discuss them. Fauci is not beyond criticism. I think the point he brings up about Fauci saying this is not a major threat to the US is fair to discuss. Fauci's comments were made back in mid-late Jan and it is important to acknowledge them as ultimately VERY wrong. He did qualify his statement by saying the virus was not a threat at that time, but he could have just as easily added that the virus could rapidly turn into a significant threat due to the nature of the traits it has.

    The British doctor John Campbell that I have been following from the beginning of this outbreak has been spot on and never pulled any punches about the threat level that this virus presented to the entire world. He has also been very critical of the WHO.

    All of this stated there is very likely zero percent chance that @Commodore would have wanted to abide by what Dr John Campbell was proposing very early or what various countries that did follow his recommendations actually did. I have been following this as long as anyone and I certainly just stupidly assumed that we would somehow be different for absolutely no good reason.
     
  11. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    One thing I think you should bear in mind. Dr Fauci has to be keenly aware that being able to do his job means keeping his job. trump has a long history of firing people at the drop of a hat, or sidelining them for some period while making it difficult or impossible to do their jobs, and then firing them later. He's done this numerous times. He did it yet again late Friday night to a gentleman guilty of, yes, doing his job. Dr Fauci likely was careful in what he said because he was told to be careful in what he said.

    Note that he said, "the virus is not a threat at this time." When he said it, trump was busy downplaying the threat himself, over and over again. Should Dr Fauci have openly contradicted the guy? Would he still have his position had he strongly disagreed with trump? It's a miracle Dr Fauci has lasted this long. We've been lucky that he's kept his job, being one of the few true experts in this field in the administration that have attempted to tell the truth about what's happening with Covid-19.

    I'll add that I wouldn't be at all surprised if, at the time, Dr Fauci also assumed that our response to this threat would be vastly better than the incredibly confusing words, indecision, and inaction that trump and his administration have provided America and moderated his language for that reason. So I give Dr Fauci a pass on the statement you referenced. I don't give trump a pass for the misleading, confusing, chaotic, and outright lying coming out of that fellow's mouth literally every day, however.

    I've watched most of trump's "briefings." It would be nice if trump's ardent supporters, and I'm not talking about you at all, did the same thing, instead of depending on twitter for their news. Watch trump's one and a half, two hour long "briefings" a few days in a row and you will understand just how misleading what you get on Twitter really is. Experience "trump unfettered and unedited." It's a real eye opener. It's also a very difficult thing to experience, but good luck. You owe it to yourself, in my opinion.
     
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  12. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Insider Newsletter™ 2X Diamond Member

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    ^His boss said he wanted to be cheerleader, even when he claims to have already known it be bad, very bad.

    I think peddling chloroquine is pulling the false hope angle again, and nixing Fauci's response is the similar thing (among other DnD like things that won't be mentioned).

    So yeah, no way Fauci would go off the reservation in late Jan, especially if no one in the West considered how bad it would be.

    /DnD off
     
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  13. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Easter Egg Hunter - Tell me why? نحن عائلة
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    Are we going there again?

    Hindsight but it's not clear if that was the origin or just an 'amplifying place', one of the clusters.

    (Some backed off from the Pangolin narrative too.......) Livestock anyone?



    https://www.grain.org/en/article/64...k-not-wet-markets-might-be-origin-of-covid-19

     
    #5573 daywalker02, Apr 6, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2020
  14. Buck Turgidson

    Buck Turgidson Mineshaft Enthusiast

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    daywalker02 likes this.
  15. malakas

    malakas Member

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    So what if the actual ground zero wasn't the wet market?
    It was still the most likely reason for the spillover event to happen.

    The spillover event happened between a wild animal and a human who handled it very closely in unhygienic conditions in Wuhan.

    Wuhan is a metropolitan modern city with millions of people.

    There aren't any jungles in the suburbs. There aren't wild tigers snooping behind the garbage cans.

    So it would be someone who raised this wild animal to sell it in the wet market. Or transferred a poached wild animal or took it from a nearby wild animal farm.

    So what kind of felines were sold in Wuhan? Leopards, tigers?
    We have to know what kind of wild animals a resident of Wuhan could have come in contact with.

    And trust me a pig isn't the intermediate species. Why?

    Very simply because it would be the first suspect.
    This article thinks that scientists around the world are dumbasses who wouldn't have first checked the most obvious suspect?

    And now we see that felidaes not only can get infected, they are symptomatic and can infect each other.
    While other animal species cannot.
     
  16. omgTHEpotential

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    I wonder how much progress from the quarantine / self-isolaton was undone by these church gatherings.
     
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  17. malakas

    malakas Member

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    https://www.research.ox.ac.uk/Article/2020-04-05-trouble-in-testing-land

    Terrible news.
    All antibody tests so far have very low sensitivity and the Germans who are developing their own sensitive kits believe they are three months away from getting these available and validated.

    Without reliable antibody tests there is no safe way to leave the lockdown. I hope the americans can have some real breakthrough.
     
  18. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Easter Egg Hunter - Tell me why? نحن عائلة
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    I am not saying anything.

    Even experts and scientists have different opinions.

    However, like most ppl I just evaluate new material as I go along.

    You just cannot be stuck with a theory and not include new materials.

    The Huanan market played a role but as opposed to people's saying, it was a wholesale market. Not retail therefore the common ppl was not welcome there.

    Livestock will continue to be shed a light on just because they are closer to us humans.

    Since the outbreak of SARS, the first suspects are wildlife, among them feral cats of any size.

    Just because it doesn't get reported right away, doesn't make them no prime suspects.
     
  19. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Easter Egg Hunter - Tell me why? نحن عائلة
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    Are you sure it didn't began like that?

    True though, have to watch it in its entirety.

    https://www.newsweek.com/entire-tow...ned-after-having-affair-woman-who-had-1493002
     
    #5579 daywalker02, Apr 6, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2020
    Houstunna and Buck Turgidson like this.
  20. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member

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    https://www.startribune.com/mayo-cl...m5RZVBHxkgkbP6_GNCbdgpzI82h5JZq3qHspTi_-7WLOU

    Mayo Clinic to lead national COVID-19 plasma trial
    Mayo is leading national initiative
    By Jeremy Olson Star Tribune

    Mayo Clinic announced Friday it is leading a national trial to use donated plasma from patients who have recovered from COVID-19 as a treatment for others infected by the novel coronavirus that causes the illness.

    The cooperative effort with 40 institutions in 20 states could verify a vital treatment, given that nobody has immunity against the coronavirus that has quickly spread across the globe.

    Administered in a handful of U.S. cases already, plasma from recovered COVID-19 patients could provide immune system boosts to others with the illness.

    “Theoretically, it gives them an antibody boost, which should help them clear the virus,” said Dr. Michael Joyner, the Mayo doctor leading the program.

    Joyner said hospitalized patients will be targeted for the therapy, but not just those with the worst symptoms in intensive care. Immune system overreactions could actually be hurting some of these patients, meaning that plasma therapy could be ineffective or even harmful in such cases.

    “Certainly in patients that are extremely ill in the ICU, this is a possibility,” Joyner said. “The thought is that historically this type of therapy [in other conditions] has been most effective when used relatively early in the course of disease as people are getting sicker and sicker.

    “We’re going to have people trying it for different indications, but I think that rescue therapy [for severe cases] is going to be an area where it’s probably going to be relatively less effective.”

    As of Friday afternoon, Minnesota reported 789 lab-confirmed COVID-19 cases, including 156 people needing hospital care and 62 needing intensive care.

    Given the rapid increase in hospitalized patients predicted throughout the country, interest in this experimental option could likely exceed availability, Joyner said.

    The U.S. Food and Drug Administration formally approved the program on Friday after giving initial approval March 24 for plasma therapy as a COVID-19 treatment.

    In a statement, Dr. Stephen Hahn, FDA commissioner, called this trial “an important area of research” and said his agency would expedite efforts to prove the therapy’s safety and effectiveness.

    Given projections that as many as 40% of Americans could be infected with the coronavirus over the course of this pandemic, the supply of donor plasma would appear inexhaustible.

    Finding donors could be complicated, though, at least at first.

    Joyner said donors must have initial coronavirus tests that confirm their infections, and then have follow-up tests that confirm that they have recovered and that their plasma is safe to use.

    Minnesota’s current case count includes more than 400 people who have recovered and are no longer subject to isolation restrictions to prevent them from spreading the virus.

    However, most of them were cleared due to their fevers and symptoms going away.

    Few, other than health care workers, have received second tests to confirm their ability to return to their jobs.

    Shortages of chemicals, swabs and other supplies have hampered the ability of the state public health lab and others to even conduct initial diagnostic tests, much less follow-up tests.

    Joyner said increases in COVID-19 testing capacity at Mayo and other institutions nationwide could help.

    HCMC in Minneapolis, for example, started conducting its own testing for the coronavirus this week.

    “I’m cautiously optimistic … but this is going to be a massive logistical pull,” Joyner said. “People have to understand that our ability to identify donors and collect the plasma is going to be a rate-limiting step for a matter of weeks.”

    Mayo also is days away from announcing a serological blood serum test that can check for antibodies in patients who have recovered from their infections.

    The antibody testing will become critical to the identification of good plasma donors, because the initial molecular diagnostic tests don’t measure antibody levels in their bloodstreams, said Dr. William Morice, president of Mayo Clinic Laboratories.

    “Without having the antibody testing, its very much guesswork,” he said, “because we’re not really measuring … the level of antibodies and how potent they might be.”

    Doctors treating COVID-19 cases at any hospital can register their patients at uscovidplasma.org for potential inclusion in the plasma trial.
     
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