Astros trade for Brian McCann

Discussion in 'Houston Astros' started by rocketpower2, Nov 17, 2016.

  1. CometsWin

    CometsWin Contributing Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2000
    Messages:
    21,369
    Likes Received:
    2,870
    Yes, the Hinch nice guy parade is fearsome. Have Jeff Bannister's grip marks on Hinch's neck disappeared yet? o_O
     
  2. kaleidosky

    kaleidosky Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2002
    Messages:
    14,797
    Likes Received:
    1,134
    solid deal, esp w/the Yanks picking up $11M. Didn't give up a ton, and wouldn't expect to.

    -as some have said above, minor upgrade from Castro is still an upgrade
    -I think he'll be more consistent vs. what seemed like very high variance from Castro to end up where he did
    -he also won't be as much of an auto-out when he has to hit LHP like Castro was
    -leadership intangibles--possible. I can't say for sure, but the rep is there.

    @htownbball if the question above is real and not somehow rhetorical, yeah I prefer this to Wieters for 4 yrs/60. His injury history is long and varied--I'd be very wary about him for 4 years vs. McCann's age for 2. The consistency, as noted above, is valuable when you're talking about a catcher who's going to likely be in the bottom 3 hitters of the lineup either way
     
  3. zeeshan2

    zeeshan2 Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2013
    Messages:
    24,128
    Likes Received:
    9,385
  4. Major

    Major Member

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 1999
    Messages:
    33,286
    Likes Received:
    1,818
    This is where WAR confuses me. His stats in 2015 and 2016 are virtually identical to each other. What makes his WAR so different between the two years? Why would 2015 McCann (320/437/757) be worth 3 times the 2016 McCann (335/413/748)?
     
    LonghornFan likes this.
  5. tellitlikeitis

    tellitlikeitis Contributing Member

    Joined:
    May 7, 2009
    Messages:
    16,197
    Likes Received:
    2,358
    I imagine that he regressed on defense.
     
  6. J.R.

    J.R. Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2008
    Messages:
    55,658
    Likes Received:
    18,339
    http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/astros-acquire-veteran-game-caller-brian-mccann/

    ...

    Sending McCann away saves the team $17 million this year and next year. It does cost them their only lefty power bat other than the returning Bird, but with $17 million and a catcher already in place, the team may be able to find a better lefty bat without any defensive ability. Adam Lind, for example, is a lefty bat projected to hit better than McCann. He’ll cost a fraction.

    Acquiring McCann may seem strange for a team already rocking at least league-average production from the catcher position in the form of Evan Gattis. But the Astros have been more comfortable with an every-day designated hitter in the past, and Gattis should probably be that DH.

    Gattis was 27th or 29th best at framing last year by Baseball Prospectus’ framing runs last year (Sanchez was right there with him, but the Yankees have traded away top framers again and again, so they may not value that skill as much as others. I digress.) His best season in that regard was in 2013, when he was around league average for a starting catcher, and at 30, he’s probably not headed back in that direction.

    Brian McCann Framing Runs by Year
    Year Framing Runs
    2010 22.3
    2011 34.9
    2012 27.4
    2013 10.2
    2014 9.7
    2015 -3.9
    2016 9.6

    Even as McCann’s framing has fallen off, he remains a much better receiver behind the plate than the incumbent. He was eighth in framing runs (16th in called strike above average), and Gattis’ best year was worse than McCann’s second-worst year in that department. Harry Pavlidis also found that McCann was top ten in catcher calling runs saved from 2012-2014.

    Given that we just saw Dallas Keuchel fall off at least partially due to getting fewer calls low in the zone, we’ve already seen how better receiving could impact this team in particular. With 2016’s third-best framing catcher, Jason Castro, out of town, these pitchers were all facing a drastic drop in called strikes.

    With the framing and calling added in to his offense — projected to be league average compared to Castro’s 19% worse than league average — McCann is probably worth a win, win and a half at least next year. Move Gattis’ similar production to DH, and you’ve probably gained your team a win on the offensive side.

    But this trade may have been as much about improving the pitching staff as it is about the offensive side of the ball. For the Astros — and their pitching staff — the hope is that McCann can still frame and call a good game as his offense falls off. It looks like that calling plus offense, on a two-year deal, was enough for them to move on to a new starting catcher.


     
  7. boozle222

    boozle222 Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2009
    Messages:
    2,234
    Likes Received:
    155
    I am really struggling to see how people are acting like this is a marginal upgrade over Castro. In Castro's best season, he put up 18 HRs, 56 RBI and a .276/.350/.485. McCann put up 20 HRs, 58 RBI, and .242/.345/.413 in what may be his worst season last year.

    Guys, it's okay to have nice things. The Astros got one. Be happy. This lineup is contender worthy and is a SP1 away from being an AL favorite.
     
  8. E-Man

    E-Man Member

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2009
    Messages:
    963
    Likes Received:
    121
    I say this is good. I'd prefer McCann over Castro. I still would like to see Gattis catch though.

    See ya Castro!
     
  9. E-Man

    E-Man Member

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2009
    Messages:
    963
    Likes Received:
    121
    Right but Castro had just "1" good season. Since then he has stinked stats wise. McCann probably hits and has better stats then Castro over the last 3 years.
     
  10. LonghornFan

    LonghornFan Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2002
    Messages:
    14,873
    Likes Received:
    1,360
    He has pop around him now. He was surrounded by rookies and Crap with the Yankees last year. I like it.
     
  11. Major

    Major Member

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 1999
    Messages:
    33,286
    Likes Received:
    1,818
    I don't have a problem with the move, but the alternative on the offensive side was to just put Gattis back there and go get another DH. It wasn't really about Castro - getting McCann's production from a DH would be pretty cheap. The benefits to me are whatever value he brings defensively and then also injury-protection. If one of them gets injured, you still have a legitimate offensive threat in a starting catcher, so you don't have any dropoff there.
     
  12. juicystream

    juicystream Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2001
    Messages:
    25,432
    Likes Received:
    1,289
    Because McCann's numbers have been trending downward? And maybe his worst season? He's twice finished with an OPS below .700.
     
  13. toycannon

    toycannon Member

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2016
    Messages:
    390
    Likes Received:
    93
    I like this Trade. McCann is bounced back to have a season more like his career average. 20-25 HRs 85-95 Rbis .280 Avg. A great club house guy and a solid catcher when he's not the DH.
     
  14. RocketFan007

    RocketFan007 Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2001
    Messages:
    5,052
    Likes Received:
    64
    He's hit above .250 once since 2011, and that was .256. He's not hitting .280.
     
  15. kaleidosky

    kaleidosky Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2002
    Messages:
    14,797
    Likes Received:
    1,134
    I see it as "worst case, but also more likely than I want to admit" that McCann is on his way down, and last year's slash line is the beginning of it. He's a catcher, he's older, he's caught a ton of innings...it's not unexpected. EVEN if that's true, he's still a marginal upgrade over Castro. That's how I saw it when I wrote that earlier
     
  16. boozle222

    boozle222 Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2009
    Messages:
    2,234
    Likes Received:
    155
    You're right. My mistake. Going off of OPS alone, he had some worse seasons. Although, I would consider 20HR/67RBI and 23HR/75RBI in those two years as successes. Also, these are catchers. Can we hold them in comparison to other catchers in the league as opposed to league averages?

    His two worst seasons:
    In 2012, the .698 OPS season for McCann, he was 16th out of 25 in WAR for catchers with at least 350 ABs.
    In 2014, the .692 OPS season for McCann, he was 12th out of 27 in WAR for catchers with at least 350 ABs (Castro was 19th).

    Now I get that he was 15th out of 20 in WAR with 350 ABs last season, and just a spot of ahead of Castro. Still... he has produced a better war than Castro in each of the past three seasons. We have improved at the position by having McCann. That is what matters. Trending downward or not, it is better than overpaying an overrated Castro or taking a flier on Ramos.
     
    thaGREATwall likes this.
  17. boozle222

    boozle222 Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2009
    Messages:
    2,234
    Likes Received:
    155
    Fair point! And I get that. Thanks for clarifying, and I wasn't just calling you out but rather all the posts and comments I have seen knocking this trade. I just think that one bad year for an older catcher doesn't mean regression. And even last year, his .751 OPS in starts as a catcher is hardly regression in my opinion. I just like the move.
     
  18. oelman44

    oelman44 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2012
    Messages:
    4,491
    Likes Received:
    594
    Mainly because framing. Castro is one of the best framing pitchers in baseball, and depending on how much you buy into that analytic you could argue Castro is saving more runs from being scored than McCann is creating on offense. I still see McCann is an upgrade, but not a huge one.
     
  19. Buck Turgidson

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2002
    Messages:
    27,877
    Likes Received:
    6,650
    He's always been an asshole, now he's our asshole.

    AKA the Clemens Conundrum
     
  20. Buck Turgidson

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2002
    Messages:
    27,877
    Likes Received:
    6,650
    This is not directed at you whatsoever...

    The most infuriatingly ****ing overused ****ing word in baseball is "framing". Average Fan didn't have a ****ing clue what it actually meant 3 years ago (and he really still doesn't), but it's now all the buzz and gets thrown around. If you need a ****ing computer to tell you if and how a catcher can catch then you suck at watching baseball.

    Sorry. Rant over.
     
    RocketFan007 likes this.
Loading...

Share This Page