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2020 Presidential Election

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Sweet Lou 4 2, Mar 26, 2020.

  1. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

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    Why would any of that bump up Trump?

    Who would change there vote for him based on a vaccine he had nothing to do with or war he probably started?

    I really don't understand why you think there are a vast amount of voters who will switch from Biden to Trump no matter what he does.
     
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  2. durvasa

    durvasa Contributing Member

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    That's essentially what I meant. But the time given to each candidate needs to be controlled by someone, and that is the job of a moderator. If we're not going to allow a moderator to properly "moderate" the debate, then the whole thing is a pointless exercise.

    Honestly, neither of these candidates appear to be particularly sharp, and one of them has no respect whatsoever for facts or logic, and so a "debate" between these two is likely destined to be a depressing waste of time and money.
     
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  3. durvasa

    durvasa Contributing Member

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    A war against China would help Trump overall, I think. A lot of war-mongering conservatives will be swayed to vote for him if he's pushing for a military confrontation while the Dems are opposed to it.
     
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  4. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

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    Fact check: Stephen Miller carries water for Trump in promoting mail-in voting conspiracies
    In an attempt to bolster President Donald Trump's false narrative against mail-in ballots, senior White House policy adviser Stephen Miller continued spreading erroneous claims on Friday about voting by mail.

    In an interview on Fox News, Miller falsely suggested there are no checks on mail-in ballots, claiming that non-citizens can easily vote in presidential election. "Nobody who mails in a ballot has their identity confirmed," Miller said on Fox News. "Nobody checks to see if they're even a US citizen. Think about that."

    Facts First: Miller is wrong. Non-citizens are explicitly not permitted to register to vote in federal elections and all mail-in ballots are authenticated in several ways.

    In response to Miller's comments, Rick Hasen, a University of California-Irvine, professor and one of the nation's top experts in election law, told CNN, "This is false. To begin with, everyone who registers to vote swears under penalty of perjury that they are a US citizen."

    Here's a look at our recent fact checks.
    • Five states already use mail-in ballots as their primary method of voting and 28 states allow voters the option of voting by mail without having to provide a reason, according to the Brennan Center for Justice, a nonpartisan, liberal-leaning think tank. In both 2016 and 2018, approximately 25% of US voters cast mail-in ballots.
    • The Brennan Center notes "[n]one of the five states that hold their elections primarily by mail has had any voter fraud scandals since making that change" and that fraud from mail-in ballots as a whole is "infinitesimally small."
    • All states allow absentee voting, some under certain conditions. These ballots are also mailed in.
    • In all the above cases, the identity of the voter is confirmed in some manner.
    • Hasen told CNN that "identity is absolutely confirmed via things like signature matches, use of driver's license numbers, witness requirements or otherwise."
    • One of the primary ways voter ID is verified is through the ballot envelope. Most ballot envelopes also have a bar code that lets voters confirm that their ballots have been received and allows states to easily eliminate any duplicate ballots because a unique code is assigned to each voter.
    The Brennan Center also says that, in the ballot, "voters must include personal identifying information (such as address, birthday, and driver's license number or last four digits of a Social Security number)," which are used to prevent voter fraud.

    About a third of states verify signatures as well and match voter information from ballots to existing voter registration records.
    Miller also claimed that the House Democrats' recent stimulus package included a section that barred voter identification. The HEROES Act would change voter ID law around federal elections, permitting a voter to "make a sworn written statement attesting to their identity to fulfill the identification requirement." This would not apply to certain first-time voters "who submitted their voter registration by mail."

    Justin Levitt, a professor at the Loyola Law School, Los Angeles, reviewed US elections from 2000 to 2014 and found 31 incidents of voter fraud from that time, during which more than a billion total votes were cast.

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/31/poli...fication-stephen-miller-fact-check/index.html
     
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  5. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    A lot of people don't pay nearly as much attention to politics as D&D Denizens. Any good news that happens under a President they will consider the Presidency to somehow responsible for it. This is why Presidents get outsized benefit or blame regarding the economy.

    With any sort of military confrontation there is a natural rally around the flag tendency.
     
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  6. deb4rockets

    deb4rockets Contributing Member
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    So 31 incidents in 4 years of fraud. That is nothing compared to the fraud Trump could be accused of in a couple months.
     
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  7. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

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    Ok, are those conservatives not going to vote for Trump anyway?

    Why would they vote for Biden in the 1st place?
     
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  8. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    I think there is value to the debates. It's one of the few possible, only instances, to see them on the same stage. Even if they just give canned answers or go off tangent it still allows a side by side comparison of how they deal with an opponent. I further think not having an audience will also force them to be more substantive since they can't play for applause lines.
     
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  9. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

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    Those people are probably not voting anyway and the numbers far less because of covid when everybody is home and consuming more media.

    This election is far from natural and most voters have no appetite at all for a new war and would blame it on Trump.

    Trump has been touting his ability to bring troops home and calling everybody else stupid for spending money on wars, now he is gonna switch voters because of it?

    Sorry, it does not make sense.
     
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  10. durvasa

    durvasa Contributing Member

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    While I grant that some aspects of their behavior/psychology can be gleaned from their presence on stage alongside a political opponent, we know enough about the personality of Trump and Biden at this stage that I think this adds minimum extra value. And I think it would distract attention from the actual substance of their answers.
     
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  11. durvasa

    durvasa Contributing Member

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    I think many of them wouldn't vote for Trump otherwise, perceiving a lack of toughness against our traditional geopolitical foes.
     
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  12. tallanvor

    tallanvor Contributing Member

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    Why would u need a human to run a clock and mute button? What year do u think this is?
     
  13. durvasa

    durvasa Contributing Member

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    I suppose it depends on the format of the debate. In most presidential debates, the moderator will ask follow up questions, or ask a candidate to quickly response to a particular point that was made by the other candidate. How do you automate time for that?
     
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  14. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    Because of COVID-19 though many are very desperate for good news and whether fair or not as the President he will get credit. Especially if a vaccine is developed from the Warp Speed project.

    GW Bush wasn't elected as a war monger and himself was critical of the Clinton Administrations use of the military in places like Kosovo. That said he won reelection in 2004 largely on the basis of being a wartime president.
     
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  15. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

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    So those people are just gonna forget about him rolling over for Russia or the fact that he is trying to get out of Afghanistan?

    I think those voters are voting for more than who will start a new war.
     
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  16. durvasa

    durvasa Contributing Member

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    People have short memories. I'm not suggesting these people are perfectly rational.
     
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  17. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

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    Bush did far more to reach out to Hispanics and Blacks than Trump has done and he had 911 most of the U.S. was against the Iraq war in 2004.

    So people are so desperate for good news that they will forget everything else about Trump and vote for him because of a vaccine?

    Really?

    The Vaccine will still be there if Biden is elected.

    I have no idea why some keep thinking Trump has magical powers to make everybody forget the previous terrible 3.5 years.

    Remember he barley won in the 1st place.
     
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  18. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

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    And how many of these people do you think there are do they offset him losing votes in the suburbs or the elderly.

    How many voters does he lose because he went to war?
     
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  19. deb4rockets

    deb4rockets Contributing Member
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    No vaccine will bring back all the deaths from an incompetent President's handling of the virus. Even today he acts like things are good. His perception of reality is twisted beyond comparison. His lack of empathy speaks volumes. No vaccine will change the fact that he is a lying Putin loving self-serving man, who puts himself first at all costs. I think most Americans would vote for anyone over Trump at this point. (Excluding his Trumpateers obviously).
     
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  20. Commodore

    Commodore Contributing Member

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    my issue is with a moderator that chooses to insert themselves by interrupting and "fact checking"
     

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