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Bill Maher Hypothetical: If Trump Refuses to leave . . .What will you do?

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Rocket River, Apr 7, 2020.

  1. Rocket River

    Rocket River Member

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    I understand.
    This is a slow moving glacier that is picking up steam
    and causing concern.
    I am more concerned now than I was a month ago

    Watching someone the blatant corruption
    and the people doing it not giving a damn if you see it or not

    Makes me feel like they would be bold enough to do even more.

    Rocket River
     
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  2. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Contributing Member

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    I've heard about this other method the Republicans might use to be able to steal the election in November.

    This is straight from our constitution (12th amendment):


    Basically this is laying out a possibility where if Trump and the Republicans can find a way to contest the election, the vote for selecting the President comes from the House, BUT... with only one vote per state, the Republican would easily win. Keep in mind the Democrats have the majority but not the majority of the STATES because of how many seats come from highly populated blue states.

    Anyways... I think there's alot more that needs to be investigated about how Trump and the Republicans could constitutionally offer a contest, and the role of the Speaker of the House to play along here.

    Still... interesting concept to think about IF the election is close like Bush V. Gore.
     
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  3. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

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    Just adding to the discussion.

    What could the Supreme court vote on to rule in favor of Trump to continue as president.

    The Supreme court in Bush vs Gore stopped a recount Bush was declared the winner of Florida and president before the Supreme Court got involved.
     
  4. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

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    In 2000 the court did not step in and decide the election, they just stopped a recount.

    I think this is a common misconception.

    Even if Trump declares himself the winner there are rules about his staying, he would be enacting a coup, do you think he has that kind of support by the military?
     
  5. Corrosion

    Corrosion Member

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    Absolutely Nothing.

    If Trump loses , he'll exit stage left .... the end.

    Recounts ? Possible .... Outside of that , he'll walk away should he lose. He has no choice. This is America , not Venezuela or some other sh!thole country.

    This thread is full of insanity.
     
  6. biina

    biina Member

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    and yet a blatant liar and self serving person is president. He has abused the office and pushed things beyond boundaries many would have deemed impossible a few years ago

    When you have persons that are willing to do whatever it takes to remain in power, and a politicized judiciary who have shown a willingness to serve as a vehicle for enabling political interests, it will be extremely naive to think that 'This is America' would suffice to protect democracy.
     
  7. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

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    Well it's a good thing we have more than This is America to protect us, right?
     
  8. biina

    biina Member

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    Unfortunately, those checks are being removed/ignored one by one
     
  9. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

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    Not gonna do it.
     
  10. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Contributing Member

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    Probably not. Im sure the generals mostly think he’s a blow hard and a crook. They won’t execute an illegal order unless the Courts weigh in to validate an executive order.

    As I said the other day, it’s not really up to us. It’s up to our institutions... namely the secret service, the generals, Republicans in the Senate, state officials, and the Supreme Court. Trump cannot be successful without full scale cooperation with those institutions.

    If it’s very close then all bets are off so the biggest takeaway is Biden needs to win big, and it won’t be an issue. Don’t let the SCOTUS and Republicans in the Senate/states in question use their power to complicate the process with recount decisions, or allowing the 12th amendment to be invoked during a contested election.
     
  11. Corrosion

    Corrosion Member

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    Trump lives rent free in the top floor penthouse of your brain.

    The fear of this is completely and totally unfounded in any reality.

    Bill Maher sold you on stupid.
     
  12. biina

    biina Member

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    Of course a Trump supporter doesnt see any danger to democracy from dear leader.
     
  13. B-Bob

    B-Bob "94-year-old self-described dreamer"

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    it is completely and totally founded on Trump’s life to date and particularly his deeds and words as a candidate and as POTUS. It is also founded in the supplication of what used to be the GOP.

    But yeah... Other than that, sure, dismiss people and say that for the first time in his ugly life, Trump will admit to facts that are negative for him.

    LOL. So basically, our legislature acts like a pathetic, developing world version. Our POTUS talks and acts like a 3rd rate dictator. We have the planet’s worst response to pandemic. We have states holding primaries with 90% of polling stations closed.

    But magically, we will revert to competence in a close November election. ... Okay! Hope you are right.
     
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  14. Corrosion

    Corrosion Member

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    I'm no Trump supporter .... I'll be voting for Biden , unless he picks Kamala for his VP and in that case I'll write in Richie Kotzen.


    Trump's history be damned - This is America , not some sh!thole country .... we have too many protections in place for that to be a remote possibility.

    If he put up any protest , he'd be escorted out in a tantrum like a 5 year old being drug away from the playground.

    About the worst that can happen is a close contest with recounts .... after which if he lost he'd have no choice but to vacate the premises.

    You know better than this .... leave this for the nutjobs and wacko's.
     
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  15. Nook

    Nook Member

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    This is how I have always felt my entire life.

    For the first time I am not overly confident... the fact that I genuinely believe it is even possible alarms me.
     
  16. B-Bob

    B-Bob "94-year-old self-described dreamer"

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    Yeah, I'm with you. I would have considered it a completely "nutjob" point of view in October of 2016. Even in 2017. But after watching what these crooks have been able to erode, what they've done to the federal bench, the constant denial of facts and laws, the kind of ludicrous people they put in key roles, and then McConnell just aiding and abetting the whole way... yeah, we look a lot like a "shithole country," to quote @Corrosion. It pains me incredibly to type that.

    I hope he is right, and I'll gladly be called a nutjob and even put it in my sig, if we have a simple and orderly transition of power in a close but clear election result. My hope is it won't even be that close.
     
  17. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    Correct but when they stopped the recount decided the election. Further they did when there was still time to complete the recount. What the court did was unprecedented and not supported Constitutionally. Rehnquist knew this which is why that case was written so unusually.

    Again I don't think Roberts is Rehnquist.

    I think Dobro is right that the generals and admirals think he's a buffoon my understanding is that he has a lot of support among the enlisted and probably rank and file officers There might also be a few flag officers who do support him. Also for military officers who have been trained to respect the chain of command it might be very hard for them to go against the Commander and Chief especially if there is some ambiguity. For that matter even after the election Trump is going to still be Commander and Chief for more than two months.

    One hope is that for all of Trump's flaws he doesn't appear to be a war monger. Other than the assassination of General Soleimani he hasn't show much inclination for actual bloodshed.

    I will repeat I hope that we never get to this. I agree with Corrosion that this is America and even though our institutions have been strained they have survived many crisis, including ones worse than now. That said we've never had a President that has been as venal and self-serving as this or who most likely already has sealed indictments waiting for when he leaves office.
     
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  18. Corrosion

    Corrosion Member

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    I think you know better .....There isn't a snowballs chance in hell that he doesn't voluntarily vacate if he loses the election , even if its a close one.

    American institutions are just too strong.

    Don't let this wave of stupid rub off on you.

    Really , some of you would benefit by turning off MSNBC & CNN and tuning to something less partisan like BBC. You've been inundated with a one sided account of every event over and over and over ..... and now you are willing to buy this kinda ignorance from Bill Maher who's only aim is drawing as much attention to himself as possible so which lines his pockets. Fk that guy for even the thought that America could be so damaged ....


    Again , this is America , we the people ..... the strongest nation in history , not some third world sh!thole. Our institutions can and will survive a bad president.
     
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  19. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    I hear you and I like to believe that. What makes our institutions stand is tradition and precedent. Trump isn't big on those and there has been so much that has happened that has been unprecedented. The scenario people are laying out isn't one where there is a landslide, both in the popular vote and electoral college. We're talking about a situation where it comes down to one or two states and only a few thousand votes. Trump is already laying the ground work for that by preemptively claiming voter fraud. With what we saw in WI this past week there certainly is the possibility of a lot of chaos at the polls.

    Trump wouldn't necessarily call out the military. Our elections even in the best of circumstances aren't perfect. In the 2008 MN Senate election that wasn't decided until a month after the election. Al Franken had the lead on election night but it was so close that it required several recounts and court challenges. During that time more ballots were found that hadn't previously been tabulated. As it turned out Franken expanded his lead from those ballots but it just shows that there are imperfections. Consider the 2000 Presidential election. As noted in my response to Jiggly the recount was stopped and never was completely. The truth is we don't actually know who won Florida. Trump could easily exploit uncertainty like that to argue for invalidation of votes, claim that there were actually many votes that weren't counted, or lean on the courts to stop recounts and prevent certifications. If enough of the institutions accepted Trump's argument then even if election night showed him losing he could still hang on.
     
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  20. Nook

    Nook Member

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    I seldom watch CNN and haven’t watched MSNBC in a decade or longer. I don’t really watch Fox either. I don’t really care for watch Bill Maher.

    My opinion is based on my experience as a former federal prosecutor, schooling and study of the US system and the history of the United States. My opinion is based on the comments of the President, the actions of the President and what he has gotten away with by the public, congress and the Supreme Court.

    Essentially what the President can and cannot get away with rests on the shoulders of a single person; Justice Roberts.

    In well over 200 years of US governance the only time we have seen anything similar to this was the lead up to and post civil war period.

    New normalities and precedents have been set. Both parties have learned there is no consequences to blindly supporting and toeing the party line. Just muddy the waters and have the votes in Congress and the Supreme Court and there are no checks and balances.

    The politicians are watching. Blatant criminal behavior is being tolerated from Senators committing insider trading, to consistently lying to the American people because there is no consequence.

    So no, while I shared your optimism years ago, I do not now. I am not saying this President will refuse to step aside; but for the first time I sadly have to admit it isn’t an entirely foolish concern.
     

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