Ive tried answering these questions to my relatives who challenge me before with studies facts and details and called a snob, elitist, or f*****. Im done answering to people who want to claim the moral high ground while drowning under a sea of hypocrisy
Yea when people are asking about illegals in the 80% of those questions and then turn around and defend a corrupt politician because economy is good, you kinda put 2 and 2 together. This FB poster that OP quotes seems to be unhappy and therefore complain in mostly irrational and/or hypocritical way. I might even use a racist card but people will accuse me of a cheap shot. You see it on this board just as you see it in real life and most fretfully in the congress: There is very little engagement going on on issues' details. People on two isles just want to share feelings of vindicafion/pride or frustration/ridicule for the most part and there is no end in sight unless we moderate our politics and just get to a happier place on average in our personal lives and then there will be more people like RayRay10 and rocketjudoka still willing to seriously engage. They are pretty cool in my book for doing so.
Did I miss the post where the OPs questions were addressed in with rational answers? Most of the responses were either insults or 'what about Trump' kind of answers. There are some obvious no brainers that are easily explainable but the OP put them here and stated the guy on FB usually posts thoughtful posts and wanted to see what kind of answers this forum would give. He also stated he had his own and would post later. My suggestion: Take or it or not. Come up with a respectful, factual response to each and the OP can go back post back in the FB thread. If you just insult the guy or call him dumb, the whole 'left looking down on the right' stereotype plays itself out. And I'm actually curious to what a respectful response might look like.
No... the questions were appropriately ridiculed, as was the source (facebook). No wonder so many trumplicans rely on facebook for their news (and talking points). The OP and his facebook "friend" are not looking for "respectful" or "thoughtful" responses... if they were, they wouldn't post to a facebook trump supporter page, and they wouldn't be using crudely crafted talking points in the form of questions. I'd guess *if* there was a facebook discussion from far left wing people they would pose a question like this: "Do republicans truly want reasonable gun crime laws, or do they simply prefer children being shot up in schools"? These topics have been discussed on D&D. For example, I have posted my thoughts on improving border security and immigration on numerous threads, including on the topic (surprisingly) on how to improve immigration.
It may seem like shouting into the void to engage with people so steeped in ignorance and misinformation, but I will give anyone credit for at least having the curiosity to ask questions and (seemingly) seek out challenges to their conclusions. Most MAGA cult members don't even make it this far.
That's exactly right. You aren't going to change their mind because it's something else that is driving them. Supporting Trump is an identity issue, not a logical one. Logical arguments will not work. Until they can become aware of the destructiveness he will cause and see the truth of what he is, they will not have their minds changed. Trump will literally have to lead America to a catastrophic defeat for people to wake up.
What I find funny is that when Obama was turning around the economy (after the gop ****ed it up to historical records ) all we heard from the right was the deficit. Even when Obama reduced the deficit to 500 billion we heard the republicans b**** why it wasn’t reduced further. Even though at the same time Obama was growing the economy. Now that trumps in office all we hear from the right is why don’t we give Trump credit. Trump’s deficit now stands at almost twice Obama’s was in 2015. This is utter bullshiit on the right
regarding # 6... trumps main campaign promise was that mexico was going to pay for his wall. that was not only an unkept promise, but a total lie. he also said he would eliminate the debt in 8 years and he has now taken it to record levels. and candidate trump said that once he got elected he would start to act presidential, but he has actually became a bigger jackass than he already was. this kind of reminds me of this gem that my trump-supporting uncle recently put up on facebook... and the social security administration debunked... https://www.ssa.gov/history/Interne...9WYrfiwzGanCm1sG2nAQeQHCJPyy-3HR69727INtI31ZI
That's the problem - they believe in lies. Total insane lies. And their questions are based on lies. You can not debate them because they are unwilling to believe in any kind of truth. Look at the posters here. @Commodore trusts Russia more than our own intelligence agencies. How do you overcome that? You can't. He's damaged beyond repair.
The guy on FB usually posts stuff like "ILHAN OMAR WAS IN AN AL QAEDA TRAINING CAMP IN 1979!" what I posted from him is about the most thoughtful political thing he's posted. That said I understand ridiculing Facebook and I will not vouch for the authenticity of most of this guy's post I've pointed out to him on average he posts one demonstrably false thing a day usually forwarded from site with a name like "Right Wing Patriots" That said he is a real person who is a Judo instructor in ex-urban Minnesota. He's a firefighter and rescue diver with a specialty in under ice rescues. He's also a vet. I've known him for more than 20 years and he's always treated me good even though he stormed out of a Judo tournament with his team once when I beat his younger brother in about 5 seconds. My point in posting this was two fold. I am curious to see what people's responses to this are. I fully admit I am a Never Trumper but I do worry about being in a bubble of self-reinforcing and selective views. We can mock and ridicule what our political opponents think but consider they feel the same way about us. I do think we need to understand what the other side thinks. To quote Sun Tzu, if you know yourself and your enemy you need not fear a 100 battles. Frankly this was one of the biggest mistakes of the Hillary Clinton campaign. They never really understood what they were facing. If they had they would've campaigned in WI. The other part about understanding what motivates these people is that these are our fellow Americans. I talk about the electoral map and how I think it is important to win in purple and red districts rather than just rely upon a base election turning out the vote in deep blue areas. That isn't just about winning the election. We can all agree that this country is very divided and at the moment we are getting more divided. We still have to live with these people. Many of us literally live with these people. For people like my friend yes there are times I think this guy is ignorant, xenophobic an probably racist at some level but he's also been supportive of me as Judo player and coach, and I know he's risked his life to save people regardless of what they believe politically. Are we going to just completely dismiss those people? These questions are rhetorical questions and as other posters meant less to get rational answers than to push a point of view. They are questions though I think if we want to try to reach these people we as political opponents should at least try to answer.
I reread the original post and I can away with the impression that the FB Trump supporter was genuine in getting a response to those questions. And there’s been several answers that cover the questions in a way that is clear and respectful. As someone on the right who is looking for alternatives it’s frustrating when I ask an honest question and I get attacked. My feeling don’t get hurt. I pass it off as ‘that’s what these people have become’... spiteful, angry and intolerant. Now I’m not saying that’s what I think about each of you guys. I’m saying it’s a feeling that I’m left with after sometimes engaging. And God Yes, I KNOW it goes both ways and as stated above you guys are sick and tired of dishonest Trumpers looking for an argument. And before I’m called a liar about seeking an alternative, I’ll explain my position. I do agree with some of the things Trump has done. I don’t think the Ukraine impeachment fiasco was a proper use of the impeachment process. And because I’d heard nothing but impeachment from day one it all looked and still looks ‘cooked up’ and the Dems used a ticky tack incident to impeach him on. I’m not here to argue this.....we’ve done it already. I’m explaining my position. The political maneuver soured me on the Dem leadership in a way that is hard for me to get past. But I’m at a point where I don’t believe in the person leading the Rep. party. He’s polarized a nation and the global community. I think 4 years was just enough to clean up and expose the internal (hate to say this..) deep state (makes me feel like an idiot). I’d like a better term. I’ll stand behind what’s been exposed - FBI, former DOJ, CIA, State.. etc. But I need a new guy. And I need a party that has the best values of both, not the extreme. And there isn’t anything available to me. Mayor Pete has been the guy least likely to ***** anything up in my opinion. I’d honestly consider it, but would probably still vote republican on most other things. So, my long winded post is intended to make you guys or the OP think about responding to the FB Trump guy in a way that may make him think and question what he’s been led to believe. I think we all should question what we’ve been led to believe.
I bet this was an older gentleman posting this. Maybe not quite as social media savvy as a lot of us. There are folks like this on every side but this is a great post to make him look bad while trying to say it was a good attempt. We are just divided right now. Hopefully whoever wins the election wins by a good margin and the country can come together just a little bit. An electoral victory by the candidate who loses the popular vote will lead to more unrest.
First, I neither attacked the OP or even the "FB friend". Second, I can make it lot easier for you... ask yourself if things trump has said and done bother you. You may like a republican position he has taken (eg. cut taxes), but ANY republican that may have won the presidency will have tried a tax cut of some sort (and probably a more fair tax cut). Any other republican would have favored stronger border and immigration, but most likely in a better approach. So as you wrestle with who you'd vote for... ask yourself if you truly like trump... if he truly is good for Americans. I know how *I* would answer that question, and I doubt you need to ask a question to know my answer. The important question is what you think, and you won't find that answer here, or on facebook. If all trump has said and done, you still want to vote for him, nothing me or anyone else here (or on facebook) can say will make a difference. The answer you see is inside you.
Props to actually taking time to acknowledge the question and the concern instead of instantly criticizing the questions as irrational babbling words of a Republican. A couple of thoughts: You defended the answer by downplaying the impact of abortion. The initial crux of the question is why the Mother (why are we using the word Mother in the first place? Its a fetus, right?) gets to define whether its a living being or just a piece of tissue. Ive always been fascinated about the abortion debate completely ignoring the nuances of rights and responsibilities of the 'gray' area. I believe the point of this question is not about assassinating military leaders of sovereign nations, but about entities operating outside the rules of engagement. In other words, there is an acknowledgement that the US is occupying a territory outside of its sovereign borders, so therefore there is an expected risk against known and unknown enemies. However anyone engaging outside their sovereign territory in combat in this same territory against our occupational forces and allies should also expected the same.
