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Can't believe I'm admitting this, but.....

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Pole, Aug 21, 2019.

  1. Nook

    Nook Member

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    I am a supporter of the 14th Amendment and believe it has overall been a large positive for America. Bringing in grateful and mentally motivated people is an overwhelming positive.

    On a side note I will say though, that a lot of crooked and wealthy foreigners come here with the specific purpose of having a child anchor baby. A lot of top drug cartel members have done this. Chapo Guzman is one such example, his children (at least some) were born in the USA and live off of drug proceeds in well off areas.

    I’m sorry but I just really do not think overall it is an issue though.
     
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  2. Carl Herrera

    Carl Herrera Contributing Member

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    We can agree that drug dealing is bad-- anyone who break U.S. laws should face the consequences and criminals wanted by foreign governments can be extradited. On the other hand, the typical wealthy immigrant coming to the U.S. are not violent criminals. I work with a number of families who run businesses in China. To what extent they engage in corruption back there I have no idea, wouldn't be surprise if there is at least a little bit of corruption given the business culture in China. But I am not aware of anyone ever ordering a mob hit or such.

    As for El Chapo's kids, as long as they are not in the family business. Having them here does not seem to be a negative.
     
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  3. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    This was adjudicated in the Wong Ark Kim case that established that birthright citizenship was a right. The argument by the government was that although Wong was born in the US him and his parents were subjects of the Emperor of China and therefore not under jurisdiction of the US. That argument was rejected by the USSC. The reason why the jurisdiction language was in the 14th Amendment was to deny native Americans citizenship under the argument that tribal members were not subject to US jurisdiction. This argument was overturned by the USSC in Elk v. Wilkins.

    If the USSC were to take up this argument again there are many implications beyond that birthright citizenship. If the argument is that foreigners, illegal or not, are not subject to US jurisdiction the logical extension is that they are not subject to US laws and effectively have diplomatic immunity. In the Wong case this was specifically brought up that the children of diplomats do not have birthright citizenship given as official representatives of foreign governments they actually are acting under the jurisdiction of their home countries. Also the question of country's jurisdiction isn't just about diplomats and birthright but has implications regarding the application of other laws and Constitutional protections. The Bush 43 Administration argued that GITMO wasn't under US jurisdiction therefore Constitutional protections and US treaties regarding the treatment of prisoners didn't apply. Once we start arguing about if people within US territory are not subject to US territory that opens up a whole Pandora's box about how the government can treat people.
     
  4. bongman

    bongman Member

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    Pole be carepol as you might pole into the swimming pole
     
  5. Buck Turgidson

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    In a town in southernmost Sicily
    Lived a family too proud to be poor
    In the year that fever took father away
    They hastened for American shores
    Now a mother and her son are standing in line
    It's a cold day on Ellis Isle
    And they look to the Statue of Liberty
    For the boy we have American life
    Ong is a Laotian refugee
    He works in the audio trade
    The smoke from flux is filling his lungs
    He's earning minimum wage
    Spending spare time down on
    San Pablo ave
    Once a week gets a woman for the night
    And he writes home tales of prosperity
    For the boy we have American life
    Bob is an unemployed veteran
    Born and bred in the South Bronx
    He's living off the streets down in east L.A.
    Residing in a cardboard box
    Now he plays a little guit and he has a small dog
    Searching for aluminum cans
    And he hold on tight to his dignity
    He was born into American life
     
  6. CometsWin

    CometsWin Breaker Breaker One Nine

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    Except illegal aliens who not only break immigration law but commit document fraud on a regular basis and can't be deported because they've had a bunch of kids here which makes them above the law.

    As an aside, every day I drive around Houston I see these crappy pick up trucks full of latinos with ladders and tools in the back driving with paper plates that they print out at home. Honestly, why the hell do I need to have insurance and get my car inspected when these clowns actively subvert the law this way.
     
    #46 CometsWin, Aug 23, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2019
  7. Sanctity

    Sanctity Member

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    American citizens are diverse and come with a diverse work ethic. The problem is the the proper and fair pay for the menial work that is available. Most people wash and fold their own crisp sheets and do their own fine house work in every part of the world. It is not about the tediousness of the work but the proper pay.



     
  8. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Contributing Member

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    Pay has always been about what one will tolerate before demanding changes. Artificially adjusting this process will not work long term. Our species, on a macro scale, rejects socialism. The higher intelligent and more driven individuals will always find a way to manipulate control over the lower intelligent and less driven people. Therefore class systems will always exist. What is important is ensuring a caste or class system doesnt creep into our society and to allow equality of opportunity.

    In other words, if all one aspires to do is flip burgers for a living, don't expect to live middle class.
     

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