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[OFFICIAL] Bernie Sanders for President thread

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Os Trigonum, Feb 19, 2019.

  1. Nook

    Nook Member

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    Sanders doesn’t get a pass for this type of behavior.

    Sanders is proposing some rather radical reform and calls out corporations routinely for their pay.... yet he cannot even properly pay his own employees?

    Sanders deserves to be hammered over it.... Trump deserves to be hammered on a lot of things but what is good for goose is good for the gander.
     
    biff17 and TheresTheDagger like this.
  2. glynch

    glynch Contributing Member

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    Come on, Major. I think you are being disingenuous. As I noted before your hatred of Sanders has really disoriented your usual cautious approach to posting. Sanders will resolve this soon. The union demands, they negotiate, they reach an agreement. Just to compare the Sander's campaign issue with Walmart and Amazon.
     
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  3. dachuda86

    dachuda86 Member

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    Your obsession with Sanders is blinding you to his lack of scruples.

    Also how does this guy have a political avatar? Isn't that against guidelines?
     
  4. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost not wrong
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    You seriously think Sanders vs. Employees is a proper analog to Amazon/Walmart vs. Employees?

    Comparing a political campaign to some of the richest, most powerful companies in the history of the world...?

    That seems woefully off target.
     
    #424 DonnyMost, Jul 22, 2019
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2019
  5. Nook

    Nook Member

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    I think when you take a strong stand that the minimum wage should be $15.00 an hour and it is a strong part of your political platform, you sure as hell better make sure you are paying your employees at least $15.00 an hour.

    It has nothing to do with Amazon or WalMart and I am not saying Sanders is off base to criticize those corporations... however you lose credibility when you aren’t doing what you ask others to do.

    Sanders has the right to explain the situation but it is fair to criticize him and point out the hypocrisy.
     
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  6. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost not wrong
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    It's a hollow criticism IMO.

    The Yang campaign wants to give $1000 a month to every citizen.

    Is Yang a hypocrite for not giving his entire campaign staff an extra $1000 a month?

    The Inslee campaign is running on a platform primarily around combating climate change.

    Is Inslee a hypocrite if he doesn't have some "carbon footprint" purity test for his campaign staffers?

    The Warren campaign supports government subsidized childcare.

    Is Warren a hypocrite for not providing free daycare services to her entire campaign staff?

    The Harris campaign supports tuition-free public college (at least for now, lulz).

    Is Harris a hypocrite for not providing 100% tuition assistance to her entire campaign staff?

    The Booker campaign supports universal healthcare.

    Is Booker a hypocrite for not providing free medical care to his entire campaign staff?

    _____

    I support Sanders' campaign staff fighting for as much compensation as they can get, but saying that this makes Sanders a hypocrite is either lazy or disingenuous.
     
    #426 DonnyMost, Jul 22, 2019
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2019
    glynch likes this.
  7. glynch

    glynch Contributing Member

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    Sanders does not get a pass for his behavior nor should Warren or anybody else. Once an issue is pointed out, what happens next is what is important.

    Well according to Newsweek in a story yesterday 07/21/19 it has already been cleared up.
     
    #427 glynch, Jul 22, 2019
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2019
    RayRay10 likes this.
  8. Air Langhi

    Air Langhi Contributing Member

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    How has it been cleared up. Nothing has really changed. He just told them to stop working more than 40 hours. He still pays his guys less than his competition.
     
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  9. Air Langhi

    Air Langhi Contributing Member

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    He is paying his staff 36k which based 2080 hours is over 15 dollars an hour. The issue is they were working 60 hours.
     
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  10. Nook

    Nook Member

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    Yeah .... so they aren’t making $15.00 an hour.
     
  11. dachuda86

    dachuda86 Member

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    Valid concern... if a hamburger flipper should make 15, everyone else has the right to ask for a raise. Salaries should reflect this too. This isn't communism.
     
  12. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost not wrong
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    Having worked on campaigns before... I was kind of shocked to hear that they are paid that much and also get healthcare coverage.

    The fact Sanders supported his campaign to unionize was also revolutionary.
     
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  13. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost not wrong
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    I'd be interested to see more data on this.
     
  14. BruceAndre

    BruceAndre Member

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    I'll reiterate: how did we get to the position that we assume that a political campaign job should be treated and thought of as a full time job?

    That's the main problem here -- the paradigm shift, and no one is noting or commenting on that.
     
  15. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost not wrong
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    What are you talking about?

    Paradigm shift...?

    This has been the case since any of us have been alive.

    This isn't student body president. These elections have major, life-altering consequences.

    With the stakes so high, of course there will be enough resources put into the campaigns to create many full-time positions.
     
  16. BruceAndre

    BruceAndre Member

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    And, this shows a limited perspective. I think in terms of centuries or more. You know, the big picture.

    It used to be that people participated in campaigns because they believed in the cause; not because they were trying to make a career out of being a political campaign staffer.

    It's not too far off the person who says: "I don't understand why I can't get a living wage working full time at McDonald's."

    It's because the market doesn't value that job, to that degree.
     
  17. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost not wrong
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    You aren't making a coherent point.

    People still volunteer for campaigns, the only difference is now we have more full-time political jobs.

    Winning a federal or state office is a big deal, and therefore the market will support jobs aimed at winning those offices.

    The fact that there is an industry around politics shouldn't surprise anyone, there always has been one.

    Was that industry smaller back when life expectancy was 50 and most people lived on a dollar a day?

    Of course it was. So was every other industry.
     
  18. BruceAndre

    BruceAndre Member

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    Huh. Isn't the problem here that the market --is not-- paying these people (Sanders workers) enough? Methinks you're the one not making a coherent argument.
     
  19. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost not wrong
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    Um, dude, you're the one who started the discussion you and I are currently having.

    I answered your question (at least what I could decipher to be a question) then you just pivoted wildly off of your post and back onto Sanders (which is something I've already addressed).

    Are you just upset because you don't think politics should be important enough to support full time jobs?

    That's fine, but explained to you why the jobs exist. You're free to continue to be upset about that, but that seems like a waste of time. No matter how much you reduce the power of the state(s), we're never going to get to a point where running for office won't support a multitude of full-time positions.
     
  20. glynch

    glynch Contributing Member

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    It was cleared up. It is really more capitalist to drive your employees to work 60 hrs, which deprives others of jobs. Even if you pay overtime, which I am sure Sanders would do, there are others who need the jobs as well as the insurance benefits that are needed from employers in capitalist America.
    In addition studies have shown that when workers put in 60 hrs they tend to be less productive per hr.
     

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