You have lost all credibility if you think they were not major battles. Or you have no idea of the history of this board.
In the end, only one of the two can get a bucket by themselves... Thats the only relevant comparison that matters.
For me, it comes down to can CP3 / Westbrook generate points when Harden is unable to for whatever reason. 2017-18 CP3 was absolutely able to and every bit worth the contract he got. 2018-19 CP3 was absolutely UNABLE to and that was a big, big problem. If we are purely talking about fit, than yeah.. CP3 is a much better fit for us next to Harden as a complementary player. However, that is essentially making CP3 into a glorified role player. We are NOT looking for that sort of player. We are looking for a secondary star that can put the team on his back and run when Harden isn't. In that sense, WB can potentially be much better for the Rockets as he is more than capable of putting up a ton of points.
Paul is CLEARLY in a a very visible decline as a player. Russ ain't efficient, but he's several years younger and shouldn't drop off a cliff anytime soon.
More efficient doesn't mean better. Westbrook had a pretty clearly better regular season in 18-19 than Paul. Obviously the playoffs were a different story. But let's not forget Paul had his fair share of early playoff exits as the #1 guy as well. Hopefully Russ in more of a supporting role will have a greater impact than Paul did last year in the playoffs. The bar isn't crazy high.
This post reflects badly on your brain. 1) I didn't make any statement about Westbrook. 2) It's clear you don't understand +/-. If the Rockets win by 100 points, for example, and Paul is +1, that means the rest of the Rockets were +99, and Paul was +1, and that +1 is not good compared to +99. Maybe the other Rockets were +22, +14, +17, +9, etc., and Paul was only +1. Look at Game 1 v. the Jazz: Chris Paul was +13. Oh, you love it! But wait. . . . Capela +24 Rivers +23 House +21 Harden +18 Tucker +16 Gordon +16 Shumpert +15 Paul +13 Faried +8 Green +6 Oh! Paul was the eighth most helpful player that night. But you love that +13, because you didn't look at the score of the game, which actually matters, believe it or not. You don't understand +/-.
The Rockets missed a title because his hamstring didn't hold up. And that was the good year we got from him. I don't have high hopes for Russ but it's still a better dice roll than hoping that CP3....does what exactly? Turns back the clock 3 years? There's a higher chance Russ adapts his game to a winning mentality than there is Chris Paul holding up throughout the course of a season while contributing in a big way.
I completely understand +/-. If Chris Paul is +13 for the game, the Rockets were 13 points better than their opponent when he was on the court. That’s all it means. Yes, other players may have higher totals, but he was still a net positive that game. Also, you don’t add up individual players +/- and get the final margin of victory. For example, in Game 1 against the Jazz, all the Rockets combined were +160, yet the margin of victory was only 32 points. By your logic, James Harden (+18) was -14 relative to the final margin of victory in that game; Clint Capela was -8, etc. Also, you absolutely tried to frame the statistic in such a manner to give the impression that Westbrook (-43 over 5 games) wasn’t really that much worse or was even better than Chris Paul (+15 over 5 games) during the first round of the 2018 Western Conference Playoffs. Otherwise, there was no reason for the post.
Westbrook actually had 3 good games in that series, or 2 A games and one B game. CP had 2 good halfs for the entire playoffs. Our role players were much better than Okc's
He had good teammates particularly PG13 And Adams they fit with his style. But he didn’t have what he needed which was spacing and shooting which we have. That was my real point I just didn’t clarify It properly.
Russ is an athletic freak, but his game dropped off a cliff last year. He literally had HORRIBlE shooting season everywhere on the court except at the rim. His TS, WS/48, WS, PER, OBM & Carmelo rating all suffered enormous drops and were career lows or the lowest since he was 21. Westbrook had a better 18-19 reg season than Paul in spite of his terrible efficiency and the reason was, health. Aside for Carmelo and WS/48 and other rate stats, Westbrook 18-19 is rated higher than CP3 in most other metrics. This was entirely due to the fact that Paul missed 22 games, was often injured and also had a slight decline in his shooting numbers. Efficiency matters more than any other factor except for availability. Westbrook has missed less game (14) in the past 4 years than CP3 did just last season.
Totally agreed. I'd still guess he has more productive seasons remaining than Paul does though. As long as he can still get to the rim, he's dangerous. When his athleticism declines, it could get ugly fast.
Let's continue your analysis: Houston v. Utah, Game 1 Iman Shumpert: +15 Donovan Mitchell: -20 You think Shumpert was more valuable than Mitchell, right? Now if we do this, it shows a more accurate picture, don't you think? Houston +32, Shumpert +15; difference: -17 Utah -32, Mitchell -20; difference +12 True: you have to adjust +/- to 240 minutes (5 players on court * 48 minutes). But just looking at +/- the way you do leads to some dumb conclusions.
Donovan Mitchell played 35 minutes; Iman Shumpert played 7. That’s not a fair comparison, and it skews the data. Also, Mitchell was really bad in game one. He shot 7/18 (39%) with no assists and five turnovers. The only thing he did well was make threes (3/7).
That's worse than Wicky Wubio!!!! The Wubio haters are about to come out in force!!! We can't have a guy that shoots worse than Wubio playing the most or second most minutes on this team! Hwolly Wicky Wubio!!!!
Oh, so you agree that you can't just look at raw +/- like you have been doing. You have to look at minutes too? How about the final score of the game? Are you still ignoring that? Let's equalize minutes, as you request: Houston v. Utah, Game 1 Rudy Gobert, 34 minutes, -23 Clint Capela, 32 minutes, +24 Golly! You think Capela was way way better than Gobert! But Gobert: 22 pts, 12 rb Capela: 16 pts. 12 rb Are you still refusing to consider that the Jazz lost by 32 points when you look at +/-?
