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When was the last time you saw harden...

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by SWTsig, Jun 19, 2019.

  1. BMoney

    BMoney Contributing Member

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    The Rockets are a lottery team the last two years without Harden.
     
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  2. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    He started walking slow in 2016. You can see the pace of the team start to drop to where it is now bottom 10.
     
  3. JayZ750

    JayZ750 Contributing Member

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    On the contrary, he was pretty good with Houston. Clearly not as good as Harden has been, but a definite #1, all-star.
    He started getting hate when he couldn't get out of the first round and then fans thought he was quitting on the team, etc. when he got injured.
    Which he may have been... I don't know.

    I know Harden has had some interesting quit-esque type moments. And he's gotten out of the first round, but not out of the conference... which is the ultimate goal.

    The point is, there are ABSOLUTELY valid reason to criticize Harden. It in no way comes down to haters gonna hate.

    The Rockets weren't crazy to be critical of Hakeem, for example, when they briefly considered trading him. Hakeem changed.
     
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  4. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    Hakeem was different. He didn't quit, he didn't have major holes in his game he refused to fix. He didn't feud with teammates.

    He DID feud with management over an alleged injury. And now, going by what's happened with Durant and Kawhi, how can we say Hakeem was wrong?

    Harden is more comparable to TMac than Hakeem.
     
  5. kjayp

    kjayp Contributing Member

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    Everybody wants to win a championship... its just a question of where they prioritize it...

    For example... I think Tomball Jimmy wants to win a championship... but getting max money is his #1 priority... being a superstar or the alpha dog on his team probably ranks higher than winning... and I'd guess that having ownership/coaches kiss his butt and not question or push him probably ranks up there too...

    Obviously CP3 felt his max contract was #1 priority... or he'd have taken a lesser butt load of money and given more flexibility to the payroll...

    Harden obviously wants to be a superstar (and he undoubtedly is) and wants to do things his way and have nobody question him... while getting paid max money...

    As I've always said... people are as crazy or as lazy as they are allowed to be... and at this point everybody within an organization coddles their superstars and let them do what they want... with the occasional exception (ie Pops n Kawhi - and we know how that turned out...)

    Not faulting anyone for using their leverage to get what they want... its frustrating but this is the reality we live in....
     
  6. Easy

    Easy Boban Only Fan
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    It's these three-headed thing:

    1. The FO does not bring in the right supporting players to enable a more versatile offense.
    2. Harden is not willing or is not able to play a different kind of style.
    3. The HC does not have the imagination to implement something more sophisticated, or does not have the leadership to hold Harden accountable if #2 is true.

    We don't really know what's going on behind the scene. My hunch is that it's probably all of the above. But then, the buck stops at the GM. I am not saying that Morey is a bad GM. But he needs to look hard into evaluating what has transpired in the past decade or so. He has enough time to implement his vision of how the team is built. Are there things he needs to adjust in terms of his philosophy of team building, including coaching choices?
     
  7. kjayp

    kjayp Contributing Member

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    Then have him sit his happy butt down for a couple more minutes... I'd rather have an engaged Austin Rivers on the floor than a disinterested Harden just hanging out at midcourt...

    I dont know what the deal is... maybe its just MDA being a wuss and refusing to pull Harden out when he decides to 'rest' on the court...

    This isn't rocket science and I dont understand why so many want to bury their heads in the sand on it...

    Harden is one of the best in the game (if not the best)... why hamstring his greatness with unnecessary periods of mediocrity?

    If it doesnt happen because Harden insists on being in the game - then he deserves the criticism...
    If he's on the floor bc MDA is too stupid to realize the guy needs a breather - then screw MDA...
    Anyway you wanna cut it... if an NBA player is on the floor and giving less than 100% in a non-blowout situation then it is a situation which should be addressed.

    and yes, there are other bigger issues to address - but that doesnt mean you ignore other shortcomings bc something else is more messed up..
     
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  8. JayZ750

    JayZ750 Contributing Member

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    True. The feud was injury based first, from a management perspective. And management thought that there was always "something" with him, be it injury, contract, etc.

    I recall there was though also a feeling that they wouldn't get back to the Finals with Hakeem because he had gradually developed an "it's all on me" type attitude/approach to the game.

    Either way, the point was, there was absolutely reasons to criticize Hakeem. One could have been a Hakeem criticizer without being a hater.

    Like with Kawhi last year. Even if the Spurs f'd up their approach to the whole thing, and Kawhi has been vindicated even more now post KD, without question fans and management had a right to criticize Kawhi. He was being non-communicative and not handling the situation well from his end either.
     
  9. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    Yeah, I agree. Anyone can be criticized. LeBron gets it. So do Curry, KD, Anthony Davis, etc. No player is perfect. And it's not "hating" to criticize a player.
     
  10. J.R.

    J.R. Member

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    Jalen: The basketball portion is what's driving all this. It's not necessarily personal. It's two guys considered the best at what they do. Chris Paul, future Hall of Famer, never been to NBA Finals. James Harden, MVP, doesn't play up to expectations in the playoffs. The Rockets have lost to the Warriors 4 of the 5 last years in the playoffs. A couple of those chances were better than others. Playing at home, can't miss 27 straight threes. This year, gotta find a way to win without Durant on the floor. When you don't do that, that's a level of frustration of not achieving your goals.

    The 2nd thing and this is me analyzing their game. Harden has the highest usage of any player in the league. He has the ball in his hands. He's isolating. He's pick-&-rolling. When he does not initiate the offense, he's walking, he's distorting the spacing, he's pouting, he's disrespecting his teammates. That's really frustrating I'm pretty sure for a guy like Chris Paul.

    When he first went there, we wondered if there was enough basketballs because Chris Paul can mix it up while shooting the three and Harden is more of an isolation player. They were at their best last season when they mixed it up. Chris Paul was doing mid-range, getting others involved. Harden was playing the long range bombs or getting to the line. This year when CP3 or Eric Gordon has the ball, James was just walking. That's probably why D'Antoni doesn't have his deal. I know if I see it, management & ownership sees it. Their challenge has to be 'We need you to coach James. We need you to figure out a way to maximize Chris Paul, who has 3 years, $124M left on his contract. We need you to make this work. We need you to adjust some. If he's not willing to adjust, we're not willing to sign this contract.' That's truly why I believe it hasn't happened yet.

    You can't ignore when they beat the Warriors Iguodala wasn't playing & Chris Paul wasn't playing. It's open next year. You can't panic. That's one thing you shouldn't do.

    (Capela) He hasn't been productive come playoff time. When you develop into a player out there as a will guy (run, jump, dunk, block shots, grab boards & catch lobs), they feel you become expendable. Look at DeAndre Jordan. A few years ago he was catching lobs. Now people aren't even talking about his free agency. For Clint Capela, going against Karl-Anthony Towns, he did a good job shutting him down defensively a couple years ago but the offense wasn't really there. This year without Durant, you want your front line to play better. Portland's front line played well. Meyers Leonard was out there ballin'. Collins was out there ballin'. That makes you re-evaluate. Wait, we just gave him $90M?
     
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  11. ApacheWarrior

    ApacheWarrior Member

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    Saw him last week in the Florida Keys.....he was wearing a neon green string bikini. Man-Boobs were popping
    out at the seams. He was going by the aliase name Brenda though, that was strange.









    [Fake news for Skippy]
     

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