The Verve got their royalties back. Let's stream to a billion!!

What is the point of this nonsense. Shouldn’t this be unsorted @KingCheetah

 

Ok. Bearing in mind this song original came out a long time ago and I assume on a CD... and in fact is still available


How is that $$ typically split?

 

Some comments, don't know enough to whether tru or no

• This song is on an album called "The Rolling Stones Songbook" by the Andrew Loog Oldham Orchestra. Oldham was the Stones' manager and mentor for a time. This is not a symphonic cover of the Stones' song; it was merely INSPIRED by it. The melody bears pretty much zero resemblance to "The Last Time", yet Jagger and Richards received a full songwriting credit for it. This is just the beginning of my problems with this fiasco. Richard Ashcroft used a 5-second sample from Oldham's arrangement for "Bittersweet Symphony". That sample is repeated throughout most of the song. Ashcroft wrote the intro to the song, as well as all the lyrics, and the Stones agreed to a 50/50 split of the royalties--until they saw how well the song was doing. At that point, they decided that they wanted 100% of the royalties, because, oh, The Verve used the sample more extensively than they said they would. Boo hoo. First off, Keith Richards admitted that "The Last Time" was the Stones' adaptation of "This May Be the Last Time" by the Staples Singers, and the lyrical similarities are obvious. Strangely enough, the Stones were neither asked for, nor did they offer, any royalties to the original performers. Interesting, especially since they showed no such generosity when someone "borrowed" from them--which, again, didn't actually happen anyway. Secondly, if Jagger and Richards had a shred of honesty in their fossil-aged bodies, they would admit that they are not the songwriters of Oldham's version of "Last Time". They did not compose the arrangement, in whole or in part. Yes, I know Oldham named them as the songwriters. But that didn't suddenly become true just because Oldham said so. This should've been between Oldham and Ashcroft only. And to top it off, Richards has the balls to make a smug comment like, "If Ashcroft can write a better song, he can keep the money," when he had nothing--zero--to do with Ashcroft's song! Even IF Jagger and Richards composed this song, which they did not, what do they achieve by raking Ashcroft over the coals the way they did? This is about avarice, plain and simple. They're just a couple of miserable, greedy old bastards. Enjoy the money, a-holes.
• It was Allen Klein who sued the Verve. The Stones did a bad deal in the 60s and do not own the rights to their pre 1970 recordings.
• The Rolling Stones didn't make any money out if this, Alan Klein owns the rights to the Stones music from the 1960's, Richard Ashcroft and Klein agreed a 50/50 split on the royalties, then when Klein heard Bittersweet Symphony he realised it was a mind blowing piece of music and told The Verve it wouldn't be released unless he received 100% of the royalties. Ashcroft realised it was too good not to release so released it anyway. I believe Ashcroft made a minimal amount of money from the lyrics. Ironic really, 'a bittersweet symphony, you're a slave to money then you die', then some multi millionaire comes along and takes all the money it made....

​

 

^ Great post, invisible fan, as that is what I always had read about this situation. It was always very appalling to me how smug Jagger and Richards acted towards Ashcroft about this.

 

I’m going to throw some Urban Hymns on tonight. Haven’t played that in a while.

 

What took the Stones so long to do the right thing? Everyone knew Klein was a b*stard.

 

Allen Klein is not a nice guy.

If you've ever seen the Beatles mockumentary, "The Rutles", John Belushi's character, Ron Decline, is Allen Klein:



The John Lennon song, "Steel and Glass" is supposedly about Allen Klein.



I assume the Stones have kept him around for so long because they like it that he's their ******* and keeps them from having to make difficult decisions. They can leave it to him and feign ignorance.

 

I don't understand. Allen Klein got all the royalties for this song over the last two decades plus. But, Keith and Mick got the writing credit with Klein getting the royalties due to a bad deal the Stones made with him. Yet, Keith/Mick had the authority to give the writing credit back to the Verve guy so he now gets royalties going forward only. Is that because this bad deal between the Stones and Klein ended? Maybe I missed something? Otherwise, Keith/Mick could have given back the writing credit a long time ago?

 

A classic from beginning to end. Even the deeper cuts like “Velvet Morning” are memorable. That Richard Ashcroft guy has soulfulness to spare. I saw them in Houston back in the late 90s...great show.

 

So gehy, a ****ing CARDIGAN?? That's not rock n roll, it's a power ballad and a bad Bon Jovi rip off. It's music for milkmen and soccer mom's. I hate everything they did with an acoustic guitar barring 1 song. It's not what the rest of the band were really wanting to play, it was a compromise in their early sound and it's a limp wristed sound by comparison. But hey it moved units and made them famous.




Holy s*itballs, this footage takes anything the guy wrote with an acoustic and anally power F's it with no relief. Not even close. Saw them the next day in Houston and it was no lie, life changing.

 

Makes me wonder what your life was like before that show.

I was at that Austin one, my freshman year at UT.

 

The lead singer ditched them for a solo career.

 

SMH;

 

Which song is this? Which Tom Petty song does it take from?

I have always been in the mind that Sampling was ok . .. . like here the 5 seconds . .looped/twisted/reverse/ etc
Where the Sample is nearly untraceable/Unrecognizable
I just hate whole sale samples (basically singing/rapping over the instrumental version of a song)

Rocket River

 

That's the Puff Daddy business model

 

I hope they received all royalties from this anthem of 1st year college students -- a powerful song that defined a generation.

 

and hammer and far too many others

Rocket River

 

The 1st attempt at sampling another band by the early Verve. Unreleased until 2016.

 

Christ, I still remember that scene when he showed up on Letterman or Carson, I forget and he tried to describe why it was a different song. "See? We go 'dink DINK dink' and they went 'dink dink DINK'". I was thinking "ooh, ok... man, you got a legit case with that". You know their lawyers were facepalming straight through their skulls after that.