Patrick Beverley has a torn meniscus (UPDATE: Will not require surgery, expected to return)

Personally I don't think he is a finished product, but NOTHING is guaranteed.

To me it's just as silly to bank on improvement at this point, especially substantial improvement.

 

This is an assumption with NO basis in measurable reality. You have NO idea what Lin is doing when he's in the air any more than I do, especially since many of his passes are No Look passes. In other words, you're projecting an image of your assumptions about Lin onto his play.

I have no idea if he's looking around desperately, or attempting to execute a plan he's already formulated.

That is your OPINION. And coincidentally, factually Wrong. Opinion that has ZERO correlation to actual reality. Multiple analyses have already been conducted on this very topic... like THIS analysis...

http://arturogalletti.wordpress.com...-the-nba-and-the-miracles-of-modern-medicine/

And there are other studies as well pointing towards 27 to 28 as the beginning of "prime" for NBA players and continued improvement up until the age of 27. They also point out that PG's are one of the SLOWEST developing position, possibly due to the necessity to develop shooting and the experience that needs to be acquired in terms of decision making.

 

You didn't really read torocan's post did you? No, scratch that, I think you did. You didn't really understand torocan's post, did you?

 

I don't think torocan said Lin and Bev are similarly effective on D against good PG's. I think he said they were similarly effective (or close enough) on D against Lillard and Curry this season.

Or even more specifically, he said Lin and Bev are similarly effective at guarding Curry, but that Curry tends to go off anyways. And that Lillard does not abuse Lin in the games.

 

The argument was not that Lin and Bev are similarly effective across ALL PG's, just that against *specific* PG's, the history of actual in game performance does NOT line up to the assumptions.

There are PG's where Bev is undoubtedly more effective. There are also PG's (like Tony Parker) that Lin has shown to be exceptionally effective vs Bev's performances.

If you want to argue that Bev is a better defender that's one argument. If you want to argue that Bev is a better on-ball defender, that's another argument. If you're going to argue that against a SPECIFIC PG that Bev has *already* been better than Lin, then the facts better be right on it... and in the case of Lillard and Curry, it's not.

Tossing around factually incorrect statements in order to discredit (or boost) a player does a disservice to everyone and shows either ignorance, laziness, or intentional deception. None of which should be accepted on CF.

 

I'm not saying its impossible for him to get significantly better as dragic did. But most players in the NBA are what they are by their mid-late 20's.

I'm simply saying on average 25 isn't necessarily considered young in the NBA. So that's not necessarily a valid argument as torocan was putting forth.

 

yeah of course, but by the same token I think it's silly to say at 25 and relatively limited experience against NBA-calibre players that he's not going to get any better

the fact that his weaknesses are so glaringly obvious to me means that if he can even get them to a serviceable level he could be a very good 3rd guard off the bench or capable starter. hes in the top 15-20pgs imo in terms of talent, but that's his ceiling unless he stops jumping without a plan/playing like a deer in the headlights every odd game

 

Not a fan of this line of argument though torocan because it reduces too many opinions into "well we don't really know." As fans sitting around on an online forum, we're always short on information, much less what goes inside of someone's mind (though here I'd settle for what coaches tell him at practice).

While technically correct in that we don't know, some assumptions still have to be made or else heck, that "behind the iron curtain" disclaimer would need to be made for virtually everything in the GARM. I just assume it's already an invisible asterisk, though reminding most that we don't have the full information is probably spot on. Or at least, it's worth considering when critiquing Lin's "jump pass" actions.

 

Well put....and because of his circumstances (i.e. being overlooked at college and NBA) early in his career, then exploding as Linsanity, then getting injured, then moving to a new team, new system, then being relegated to the bench....this has had some effect on him mentally which i really hope he can conquer eventually.

But there is enough evidence on the table that he can be a very good player (on the right system) and a solid player on systems where he is required to be the 3rd or 4th option. He just needs more consistency, and that starts with him getting mentally tougher and to continue working on his skills (i.e. ball handling).

I think his he has a ceiling to be in the all-star, but will he get there? Don't know, that is up to him.

 

So Canaan starting, and Bev playing 10-15 minutes what minutes does that leave for Lin?

 

Lin's jump pass turnovers are obviously a continuing problem. Coach Mchale has even said as much. To say well we dont really know whats in his mind it could be a formulated plan is just nonsense to me. When he jumps in the air and throws it to the other team should we say well we dont know if he formulated that plan beforehand? A turnover is a turnover, and when it happens multiple times a game for the entire season it is a problem. To say it really isnt a problem bc nash and lebron etc jump pass too is just another thing that points to bias.

 

All my posts about any player are carefully thought out and articulate. No one questions that. The major difference between Lin fans and the majority of insane people on CF is that Lin fans are at least civil and non-offensive. There are a few quality posters here, tinman, DD, deckard, torocan etc. As someone with a top university education and a ibanking job, I know common sense when I read it. Most people here need to like, go back and finish high school or something.

 

I remember when Blake griffin tore his meniscus in college he was out like 6 days. And his knee seems fine so I guess the extent/location of the tear can vary a lot.

 

Patrick Beverley Against The World.
You just can't keep a good wolverine down.

 

Smh... That wasn't what he was doing it at all if you actually read. I can see it now. The drama queens are going to call torocan delusional without actually reading/comprehending what he wrote. They're going to take this stuff out of context and start applying the LOFHater logic. Starting to get ridiculous that you can't have a constructive online discussion without someone ruining it.

 

First, McHale has never specifically referred to Lin's jump passes as far as I'm aware unless you have a specific link. He referred to Lin's TO's as an issue in ONE game, and that was the Spurs game where he put up 38 points.

Second, a TO is NOT just a TO. Not all TO's are created equally and Morey has specifically stated as much. Too many TO's is a problem, however this is far than just a Lin problem. Lin does still have more TO's than is ideal, however higher TO's is a common issue with younger PG's.

Finally, locking in on Nash/Lebron were names specifically mentioned in the article as part of the writing. Jump passes are used by a HUGE number of players. This is not a comparison, just that it is Common across the ENTIRE NBA including the most visible players.

That you would see this as a comparison of Nash/Lebron to Lin while ignoring the part that this is Common among players is more demonstrative of bias than mentioning that multiple high profile players IN ADDITION to a large number of other players use this as a common play.

 

Good to hear that Bev will return this season. I'd sit him for the first round though since I think Lin can hold his own against Lillard or Curry. Don't want Bev to end up injuring himself again.

 

I used to enjoy your posts for the most part, even though we frequently (but pleasantly) disagreed. Lately, it seems like you've let some of the more extreme posters drag you to their level.