1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

Trump's coronavirus response

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Two Sandwiches, Mar 13, 2020.

  1. dachuda86

    dachuda86 Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2008
    Messages:
    16,308
    Likes Received:
    3,580
  2. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2010
    Messages:
    24,017
    Likes Received:
    19,922
    Really??... CNN and MSNBC have promoted Trump even from a "hate watching" perspective for years. Thank God they stopped covering his rallies. Even hate watching Trump's garbage leads to disinformation in several ways. Hence how CNN & MSNBC have been talking about for two days how Trump is saying he wants to "Re-open American by Easter"... which is nonsense and they are only talking about it for shock factor, but it confuses people that he actually has the power to waive a wand and overrule governors & business leaders.

    I don't think Stelter actually wants you to tune into Fox & Hannity, but I do think he wants you to watch CNN shortly after to see what kind of nonsense he said in the interview.

    Does that make sense? Promotion is not the correct word.
     
    RayRay10 likes this.
  3. Rashmon

    Rashmon Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2000
    Messages:
    19,266
    Likes Received:
    14,487
    https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/03/presidents-character-unequal-task/608743/

    The President Is Trapped

    Trump is utterly unsuited to deal with this crisis, either intellectually or temperamentally.

    MARCH 25, 2020
    Peter Wehner

    For his entire adult life, and for his entire presidency, Donald Trump has created his own alternate reality, complete with his own alternate set of facts. He has shown himself to be erratic, impulsive, narcissistic, vindictive, cruel, mendacious, and devoid of empathy. None of that is new.

    But we’re now entering the most dangerous phase of the Trump presidency. The pain and hardship that the United States is only beginning to experience stem from a crisis that the president is utterly unsuited to deal with, either intellectually or temperamentally. When things were going relatively well, the nation could more easily absorb the costs of Trump’s psychological and moral distortions and disfigurements. But those days are behind us. The coronavirus pandemic has created the conditions that can catalyze a destructive set of responses from an individual with Trump’s characterological defects and disordered personality.

    We are now in the early phase of a medical and economic tempest unmatched in most of our lifetimes. There’s too much information we don’t have. We don’t know the full severity of the pandemic, or whether a state like New York is a harbinger or an outlier. But we have enough information to know this virus is rapidly transmissible and lethal.

    The qualities we most need in a president during this crisis are calmness, wisdom, and reassurance; a command of the facts and the ability to communicate them well; and the capacity to think about the medium and long term while carefully weighing competing options and conflicting needs. We need a leader who can persuade the public to act in ways that are difficult but necessary, who can focus like a laser beam on a problem for a sustained period of time, and who will listen to—and, when necessary, defer to—experts who know far more than he does. We need a president who can draw the nation together rather than drive it apart, who excels at the intricate work of governing, and who works well with elected officials at every level. We need a chief executive whose judgment is not just sound, but exceptional.

    There are some 325 million people in America, and it’s hard to think of more than a handful who are more lacking in these qualities than Donald Trump.

    But we need to consider something else, which is that the coronavirus pandemic may lead to a rapid and even more worrisome psychological and emotional deterioration in the commander in chief. This is not a certainty, but it’s a possibility we need to be prepared for.

    Here’s how this might play out; to some extent, it already has.

    Let’s start with what we know. Someone with Trump’s psychological makeup, when faced with facts and events that are unpleasant, that he perceives as a threat to his self-image and public standing, simply denies them. We saw that repeatedly during the early part of the pandemic, when the president was giving false reassurance and spreading false information one day after another.

    After a few days in which he was willing to acknowledge the scope and scale of this crisis—he declared himself a “wartime president”—he has now regressed to type, once again becoming a fountain of misinformation. At a press conference yesterday, he declared that he “would love to have the country opened up, and just raring to go, by Easter,” which is less than three weeks away, a goal that top epidemiologists and health professionals believe would be catastrophic.

    “I think it’s possible. Why not?” he said with a shrug during a town hall hosted by Fox News later in the day. (Why Easter? He explained, “I just thought it was a beautiful time, a beautiful timeline.”) He said this as New York City’s case count is doubling every three days and the U.S. case count is now setting the pace for the world.

    As one person who consults with the Trump White House on the coronavirus response put it to me, “He has chosen to imagine the worst is behind us when the worst is clearly ahead of us.”

    After listening to the president’s nearly-two-hour briefing on Monday—in which, among other things, Trump declared, “If it were up to the doctors, they may say … ‘Let’s shut down the entire world.’ … This could create a much bigger problem than the problem that you start off with”—a former White House adviser who has worked on past pandemics told me, “This fool will bring the death of thousands needlessly. We have mobilized as a country to shut things down for a time, despite the difficulty. We can work our way back to a semblance of normality if we hold out and let the health system make it through the worst of it.” He added, “But now our own president is undoing all that work and preaching recklessness. Rather than lead us in taking on a difficult challenge, he is dragging us toward failure and suffering. Beyond belief.”

    Read the rest at the link...
     
    RayRay10 likes this.
  4. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2002
    Messages:
    54,454
    Likes Received:
    54,367
    trump... snake oil salesman.

    Coronavirus treatment: Dr. Donald Trump peddles snake oil and false hope
    There are no approved therapies or drugs to treat COVID-19 yet, but the president hypes preliminary chloroquine trials at White House briefing and unproven remedies on Twitter: Our view
    The Editorial Board
    USA TODAY

    One of the first acts of the federal precursor to the Food and Drug Administration in 1916 was to crack down on the sale of a cowboy's cure-all called Stanley's Snake Oil, which government chemists discovered promised much more than it delivered. The product helped give rise to the expression snake-oil salesman.

    If Donald Trump wasn't quite the quintessential snake-oil salesman at a news briefing this week and on Twitter Saturday — touting preliminary and even unproven medical remedies to the new coronavirus pandemic — he came disturbingly close.

    Perhaps eager to demonstrate haste and hope after squandering weeks with a glacial rollout of COVID-19 testing kits, the president pitched Thursday that his FDA is now "slashing all the red tape" to review new therapies that:

    ►"Have shown very encouraging — very, very encouraging early results."

    ►"Could be a game changer. Very powerful."

    ►"Could be a tremendous breakthrough."

    FDA contradicts Donald Trump
    Shortly after Trump made these remarks, the FDA rushed out a statement making it clear that there are no approved therapies or drugs to treat COVID-19.

    Maybe clinical trials of these therapies will show promising results. We surely hope so. But for now, Trump risks giving Americans false hope about some pills they might use to ward off the effects of a virus 10 times more lethal, and three times as contagious, as the common flu.

    His specific pitch focused on antiviral drugs used to treat other diseases. But none of them has yet shown safe and effective against COVID-19, said Dr. Anthony Fauci, the nation's leading immunologist and a member of the White House's anti-coronavirus task force.

    Moreover, there was no "immediate" FDA move to make them available as a coronavirus treatment. To the contrary, agency chief Stephen Hahn said clinical trials are underway, and scientists are hoping for the best. However, he added Thursday during a White House briefing, "what's also important is not to provide false hope."

    COVID-19, chloroquine, remdesivir
    Trump specifically focused on an anti-malarial drug called chloroquine or hydroxychloroquine, and an antiviral drug used to treat Ebola, known as remdesivir. (A third antiviral drug, lopinavir–ritonavir, used as an HIV treatment, was recently found ineffective against COVID-19.)

    Dr. Anthony Fauci , director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, with President Donald Trump on March 20, 2020.
    Fauci said any supporting evidence for the antiviral drugs is largely anecdotal. "We've got to able to determine if they work and if they're safe," Fauci told a Journal of the American Medical Association podcast the day before Trump began pitching both of them as potential success stories. "That's going to be really a challenge as the weeks unfold and (coronavirus) cases increase."

    Get the Opinion newsletter in your inbox.
    What do you think? Shape your opinion with a digest of takes on current events.

    The contrast between Trump's hype and Fauci's scientific method played out like reality TV on Friday as both appeared to contradict each other during a remarkable White House news briefing. "I disagree," Trump said, with Fauci nearby. "I feel good about (the treatments). That's all it is. Just a feeling. You know, I'm a smart guy."

    For a public eager for some semblance of leadership in a national crisis, the display was far from reassuring.

    The same presidential obstinacy surfaced Saturday, when Dr. Trump informed his 75 million Twitter followers about a tiny French study of 48 people showing that chloroquine, when combined with the antibiotic used in Z-Pak medication, might be effective against the coronavirus. "A real chance to be one of the biggest game changers in the history of medicine," Trump tweeted.

    It will take more than a year to produce a vaccine to finally quell COVID-19. In the meantime, it's vital to study existing or new antivirals that might dampen the effect or duration of the new coronavirus. But it's also important, as the FDA chief said, not to offer false hope while that research is underway.

    In this crisis, all Americans must stay vigilant with social distancing and personal hygiene to avoid infection. If Trump's promises about quick cures cause people to relax their preparedness because they believe that some pill to protect them is right around the corner, it places everyone more at risk.

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/opin...il-chloroquine-editorials-debates/2883640001/
     
    RayRay10 likes this.
  5. dachuda86

    dachuda86 Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2008
    Messages:
    16,308
    Likes Received:
    3,580
    That med is not snake oil.... what the hell are you on? That drug actually has studies with initial promise and it could definitely help. Now do you need to go out and buy it? No. BUT the FDA did approve this drug a long time ago, just not for treating COVID because it's a new virus you genius. Doctors who think it is needed will prescribe it as needed and it is one of many existing drugs being looked at to treat the virus. Your spin is not needed. Your hate of trump clouds your judgement.
     
  6. Amiga

    Amiga 10 years ago...
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2008
    Messages:
    21,884
    Likes Received:
    18,651
    I don’t watch them anymore because I want to be informed with facts.
     
    Buck Turgidson likes this.
  7. El_Conquistador

    El_Conquistador King of the D&D, The Legend, #1 Ranking
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2002
    Messages:
    14,267
    Likes Received:
    5,230
    [Premium Post]
    Trump's approval ratings for his handling of Coronavirus continue to rise. The pulse of this room is just totally out of step with reality.

    Stock market is showing signs of life in recent days... American optimism will soar once we reopen the economy.

    GOOD DAY
     
  8. Amiga

    Amiga 10 years ago...
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2008
    Messages:
    21,884
    Likes Received:
    18,651
    This is pretty good proof that words matter. It’s a good reason why we can’t simply ignore mistakes or worse, intentional misleading statements, lies and propaganda because they do matter. Good ethical and responsible journalists do need to correct and point them out as often as possible.

    There have been report that people that depend on this drug can’t get them - backordered.

     
  9. Rashmon

    Rashmon Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2000
    Messages:
    19,266
    Likes Received:
    14,487
    White House deviated from pandemic plan: report

    The White House has reportedly deviated from guidelines set out in a 2016 National Security Council (NSC) memo detailing the U.S. response to a global disease outbreak.

    The 69-page document, obtained by Politico, lays out step-by-step responses to a pandemic, such as implementing directives on workplace safety and procurement of safety equipment.

    The Trump administration has failed to follow multiple recommendations, Politico noted, and is only just now taking some steps directed for the early days of the coronavirus's spread

    Under the NSC timeline, the Trump administration in late January should have begun issuing directives aimed at "coordination of workforce protection activities including ... [personal protective equipment] determination, procurement and deployment," according to the report. Such actions have only been recently implemented.

    A request for congressional funding to combat the pandemic, the timeline further dictates, should have taken place a month before it happened. President Trump signed into law two bills responding to the coronavirus epidemic in March and is expected to sign a third aimed at providing an economic stimulus in the days ahead.

    “We recommend early budget and financial analysis of various response scenarios and an early decision to request supplemental funding from Congress, if needed,” the timelines states. However, Congress and the administration failed to act for most of February, more than a month after the first case was confirmed in the U.S., Politico noted.

    “While each emerging infectious disease threat will present itself in a unique way, a consistent, capabilities-based approach to addressing these threats will allow for faster decisions with more targeted expert subject matter input from federal departments and agencies," the memo reads.

    An official with the NSC told Politico in a statement that the report had been replaced by newer policies taking into account lessons from the spread of Ebola in Africa.

    “We are aware of the document, although it’s quite dated and has been superseded by strategic and operational biodefense policies published since,” the official said. “The plan we are executing now is a better fit, more detailed, and applies the relevant lessons learned from the playbook and the most recent Ebola epidemic in the [Democratic Republic of the Congo] to COVID-19.”

    Our president is a clear and present danger...
     
  10. Andre0087

    Andre0087 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2012
    Messages:
    8,328
    Likes Received:
    11,301
    Maybe because he sounds like a spoiled child most of the time and that's not helping the people or economy right now.
     
  11. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2002
    Messages:
    54,454
    Likes Received:
    54,367



    Coronavirus: Mike Pompeo insists G7 use 'Wuhan Virus' - but world officials refuse
    The G7 refused to call the coronavirus the ‘Wuhan Virus’ despite US insistence
    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/coronavirus-g7-wuhan-virus-mike-pompeo-trump-a9426261.html
     
    Nook, No Worries and RayRay10 like this.
  12. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Contributing Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2007
    Messages:
    37,717
    Likes Received:
    18,918
  13. dachuda86

    dachuda86 Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2008
    Messages:
    16,308
    Likes Received:
    3,580
    This is a failure of the doctors for over prescribing

    OR

    this medicine is being used to treat Wuhan Virus because doctors see value in it.

    OR

    both.

    This is not a good thing by any means BTW because there are people who need that damn medicine. It sure would be nice to have local production and be able to ramp it up at will. Oh and before the President announces it to EVERYONE and creating a shortage. That is the one thing I can fault him on with this... he did announce it and screw over the people needing it. He let the cat out of the bag before having a good supply of it. This is not just happening in the US now. There will be a global shortage of this medicine as people who have no business getting it will be getting a hold of it somehow. This may expose a huge flaw in our prescription system if anything.
     
    Astrodome likes this.
  14. hooroo

    hooroo Member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2003
    Messages:
    18,912
    Likes Received:
    1,504
    I thought Trump decided to stop using the term China Virus because of the increase in hate crimes towards Asian-Americans?
     
  15. dachuda86

    dachuda86 Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2008
    Messages:
    16,308
    Likes Received:
    3,580
  16. Amiga

    Amiga 10 years ago...
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2008
    Messages:
    21,884
    Likes Received:
    18,651
    Dr prescribing when they shouldn't is definitely an issue. But we all know how this all started. That's the point I'm making. Words matter. People said, just ignore words because you know, that's just how he is. You can't do that. It matters.
     
  17. Rashmon

    Rashmon Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2000
    Messages:
    19,266
    Likes Received:
    14,487
    More from the Atlantic article above...

    Our president is a clear and present danger. Invoke the 25th...
     
    RayRay10 likes this.
  18. calurker

    calurker Contributing Member

    Joined:
    May 19, 2002
    Messages:
    1,383
    Likes Received:
    446
    ...to old and poor people, which makes him a GOP Hero. COVID-19 kills the elderly. COVID-19 kills the infirm. COVID-19 kills people without access to medical care (read: the poor). COVID-19 kills people packed into public transit and high density housing (read: ****ing liberal urban hippies). What's not to like about SARS-CoV-2 from the GOP's perspective? You solve entitlement insolvency. You solve medical expense for the chronically ill. You solve poverty. You solve the liberal hippy commie treehuggers. If you're the GOP, why would you do anything to stop it? (Until the old geezers realized that they're in the high risk group as well, that is.)
     
    Rashmon likes this.
  19. vlaurelio

    vlaurelio Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2005
    Messages:
    21,310
    Likes Received:
    11,755
    a big percentage of trumps diehards are uneducated and poor themselves.. also take public transpo and multiple persons in the same home
     
  20. dachuda86

    dachuda86 Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2008
    Messages:
    16,308
    Likes Received:
    3,580
    Oh definitely they matter. I don't think he should have made such a big deal about it or even mention it by name and let Fauci handle anything like that. Trump is actually just campaigning right now. And what's funny is the media is handling it poorly and it's pushing more people to Trump. The dude's approval is shifting because people really distrust the media these days.
     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now