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Super Tuesday Predictions

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Major, Feb 26, 2020.

  1. Mr.Scarface

    Mr.Scarface Member

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    I don't know old you are, but society has changed alot, since the 70s when Biden was first in Congress. Gay rights was not an accepted thing, especially in the Black community (hell, you still have people "set in their ways"). Many Whites have evolved their views as their exposure to more minorities and alternative lifestyles has become the norm. If you don't accept the fact people can evolve on issues, then we will never have change.
     
  2. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

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    Sure. Obamacare as a brand was once toxic. Coverage for preexisting conditions, one of the primary features of Obamacare, was fantastically popular at the same moment in time. And Obamacare itself is now extremely popular.

    Anyway that's neither here nor there, because we live in that world where dumb labels matter. The hard numbers on Sanders being able to beat Trump are decidedly mixed, and the "low-information" voters are aligned with a ton of high information voters on it. I don't think an explainer piece on Democratic socialism is going to help them. And finally a lot of high information voters don't like Sanders. A lot of low information voters do like Sanders. Whatever, we have to beat Trump.
     
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  3. Mr.Scarface

    Mr.Scarface Member

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    Dude wouldn't become a Democrat until he wanted to run for President. He is a FRAUD as a Democrat. He is what he is.......that's fine. But don't run as a Democrat just because you want to be President.
     
  4. LabMouse

    LabMouse Member

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    What is high information voters and low information voters?
    Related to income?

     
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  5. HP3

    HP3 Member

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    If they were light on details, you wouldnt have a bunch of organizations and unions coming out to support him. Like I said he cant do all of these things but its a step in the right direction.
     
  6. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

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    1. Yes, I think his influence as a national political figure has certainly peaked at this stage.
    2. You're right, he painted himself into a box of "always being an insurgent". That's not the way it works when you'r dealing with a factionalized party rather than a homogenous one like the Republican party. You have to appeal to different factions.
    3. Yang has a bright future in Democratic politics if he chooses to pursue it. https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2020/02/could-andrew-yang-make-it-in-new-yorks-mayoral-race.html
     
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  7. HP3

    HP3 Member

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    Thats ridiculous dude. This 2 party system in America has always had a stranglehold over politics, why kill your chances running as an independent. God, like what is this crap thats coming out in the last two days. Sorry he doesnt bow down to the rich like other establishment democrats do.
     
  8. justtxyank

    justtxyank Contributing Member

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    These conspiracy theories about Yang or Warren being left off of graphics are silly.

    Andrew Yang was never a factor. How much attention did you want him to get? The constant refrain that the media was holding him down was so delusional.
     
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  9. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

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    You'd have to ask the Sanders people what they mean by the term.
     
  10. ipaman

    ipaman Contributing Member

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    I can accept that people change/grow but that doesn't mean I give them that excuse. If people hated gays because it was the 70s blah blah, then fack them! and they better not clap back. They deserve the punishment and judgement for their actions. They better do everything they can to make it up too, and Biden hasn't done that. He's done the opposite. He's hurt the black and lgbt communities and not done enough to undo the damage he's contributed.
     
  11. foh

    foh Member

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    I think the fact that Trump was an overhanging threat that everyone publicly railed against during debates and the fact that Bernie is a combative loner with similar type of fervent and seemingly hardheaded supporters, forced other nominees to endorse Biden when they did.
    Of course, some of it had to do with Biden's gregarious nature and non-attacking grandpa-like personal style that you mention. These politicians definitely have personal vendettas after all (just look at Warren drastically different approach in the supertuesday aftermath from Bloomberg.)

    But the question remains as to why the record turnout among the democrats for this primary? The first four primaries weren't as record setting from what I saw. Biden doesn't naturally inspire, so we can't attribute record turn out to him. Candidates dropping out days prior also doesn't bode well for big turn out. Multiple articles were actually negative about Biden's rallies and speeches over the weekend. I have hard time believing that the articles about down ballots being at risk due to Sanders made a huge difference for turn out. So the surge, maybe had to do with coronavirus and Trump's bungled response to it (so far)? You could see the markets and the presidential approval polls react negatively right as the super Tuesday was about to happen (in a very significant way too). In times of national crisis, we tend to coalesce together and ignore differences to fight a common threat and Biden was there to coalesce around because Trump's "remain calm" message was seemingly tone deaf.

    I just have hard time attributing Biden with the credit for the big turn around - unless he really did intend to have his best debate performance right before SC primary. Yes, he did build some coalition by sheer nature of his character. But I think it just came down to the field being weak, so he won thanks to Obama and the resulting black base support and some concurrent fortunate events.

    I hope Bernie won't go independent route if he loses. I hate the independents most of all from the last election cycle. Jill Stein is Putin's spy for all we know. Congress ought to investigate her instead of Biden's Ukraine dealings that they are bound to talk about non-stop from now till November.
     
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  12. HP3

    HP3 Member

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  13. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

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    Wait?

    Are you talking about Sanders?
     
  14. dmoneybangbang

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    Tons of organizations and different unions and not all of them endorsed Sanders.

    Why isn’t an incremental approach not in the right direction?
     
  15. foh

    foh Member

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    Let's see how quickly he can get Warren to drop out and endorse him - that should be a telling sign of how good a coalition builder Bernie is with regards to his fellow politicians. Also Yang is still out there to coalesce into an endorsement. UBI seems like a relatively socialist idea. Bernie, could tack it on top of all the other socialist initiatives of his.
     
  16. HP3

    HP3 Member

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    Okay, but more the of the prominent ones in labour,healthcare, and climate control all supported Sanders, Biden barely has any of that. He's a conservative Democrat.

    Lol incremental is not ideal, especially with the times we live in right now. Like I said, I'll vote for him.
     
  17. dmoneybangbang

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    Prominent ones.... such as?

    That’s why Biden came on strong? Too incremental...?
     
  18. HP3

    HP3 Member

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  19. JayZ750

    JayZ750 Contributing Member

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    There weren't any conspiracy theories, lol. He was factually left of inforgraphic after infographic despite the fact that had he been included, he would have had a position on said infographic ahead of at least one if not more other candidates that were included.

    I didn't wany anyone to get any more/less attention that was merited.

    Similarly, I think it would have been wise to not have come out with a piece on him but using a picture of a completely different Asian person, lol.

    Not conspiracy... just how it was...
     
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  20. JayZ750

    JayZ750 Contributing Member

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    Again, the analysis has to look at all sides.

    Meaning, Bernies IS NOT a good coalition builder with the influentials in the party, clearly. But IF HE WAS, he wouldn't be where he is anyway. Cause in order to be so, he'd have to move towards the center. Look what happened to Warren, who couldn't figure out wtf to do with her health care proposal, so moved it a little more centrist and confused folks.

    Warren has to start with his beliefs and positions. While its seemingly en vogue right TODAY to be like "that's great, but you have to give up on your ideals and beliefs to actually get anything done!" I think its probably more commendable that he's built a pretty successful coalition trying not to do that. Certainly there's been some dumb online action out of that coalition he's built, but that's on the fringe, imo.

    And for all the Bernie-bros that maybe won't vote Democrat unless its Bernie (which I honestly don't see... there will be slightly less turnout among young voters if its not Bernie, though), there were likely just as much, if not more, conservative Democrat supporters that wouldn't have voted for Bernie had he won. In other words, the conservative Democrat candidates don't really seem to be reaching out to their fellow candidates with different ideologies either... they just have the benefit of the DNC machine being in their field of play.
     

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