I agree, but there's a difference between those overshadowing his good performances and just saying he has no good performances altogether.
That's what I'm saying. There was a lot of overreaction on Harden when we lost to the Warriors. Yeah, Harden gave a stupid turnover in the 4th.... but the blame isn't solely on him. He still had a good game in my opinion. 35pts, 8 rebounds, 6 assists, 4 steals and a decent FG%. Harden did turn up against the Warriors for the most part, he just didn't have the help for other players like Paul and Capela from those first 5 games. Heck, even Gordon didn't turn up in games 5 and 6.
Well, that was never going to happen in this era where contending teams are having at the minimal 2 all-star players. I feel like people are just ignoring everything else.CP going ghost for 5 games. Capela sitting out the series. MDA sitting on his hands...and are putting the blame on the one guy that did the most for the team.
oh yeah for sure. I get that. Just saying, I think that's generally what's happened or what is happening. either way its just those particularly big games that remains this huge dark cloud
i mean the series was tied 2-2 with a well known rare opportunity. personally, as i've already mentioned would like to see more from harden in closing moments. @topfive referenced this. If that oracle harden would just be him in those games, I think the rockets would still be alive. but yeah were playing this if game again but still that's the harden im hoping that can carry over into the playoffs.
Here is the thing. We are talking about Dame being clutch and carrying his team to victory...when CJ did that. CJ did that. Not Dame...CJ did. Look at what people are saying about Dame in this thread for what CJ did. Dame was terrible in this series, if CJ doesn't step up Denver is playing the Warriors on Tuesday and dame...once again...is falling short on reaching the WCF. It takes a team man and sometimes it's on other guys to step up and there is nothing wrong with that. Lebron's one Cleveland championship came because Kyrie hit big shots too, because Kyrie stepped up.
Dirk was the same way, and had the same reputation. He got over that hump after the 2007 Finals against Miami, and became almost unstoppable in closing situations...which then led to them winning a championship. But he went from fading away in late game situations to where he not only took the big shots, but you were truly surprised if they missed. The so called 'clutch' shots.
i mean cp3 stepped up game 6. he did his part to have the game well within being winnable. I do admit him being subbed out when he was hot was puzzling. I surely would of liked harden to just be that guy we've seen so often in the regular season. he's obviously good enough to do so. Just go out there and do it. sometimes the right play isn't what its going to take. sometimes the right play is: ok my team needs me to be the mvp that I am. give me the ball. those are the playoff performances necessary to keep yourself alive and moving on. I honestly don't think that's too much to ask. if he fails, so be it. Not everyone is gonna succeed or built to but going down knowing you absolutely laid it all out there is nothing to be ashamed of
Everyone criticizing is different. I think what @YOLO is saying - since he said so earlier in this thread -and what I have said, is we aren't hating, or blaming. We're just pointing out the facts. Multiple times now, in games or series where you've said or thought, and most of the media has concurred, "now's the time", Harden has been unable to "will" himself to a win. Be it the Spurs. Be it his series against the Clippers. Be it this where when KD gets injured. I know why this is, and can point to clear flaws in Harden's game that just are what they are that, combined with the system, contribute to this. But I also know as a 1b he can absolutely dominate a series and win a ring... somewhere. Is that somewhere here?? VERY VERY hard to envision that, given their asset and cap situation. If their best option is somehow getting Jimmy Butler, even without giving up a single other piece, I'm still not sold that gets it down though. CP3 will decline a bit more, EG and Tucker I think are starting to show signs of wear and tear at least as it relates to this system, Capela will still be schemed out by GSW and Harden wills till be 1a. Butler had a better roster around him and they also couldn't get out of the second round. All that aside, you of course aren't adding a Butler while keeping all the other assets. DM "went for it". Good for him. Didn't work.
I’ll read it later. Harden is great. Cp3 took a major backwards step after December injury vs Heat. What we need is a better number 2. Chris Paul will gradually get worse. Last year was his peak this is his 2nd best rocket year it’ll get worse until he’s done
I actually think, again some of this is narrative. Dirk's playoff woes were mainly a function of losing as a #1 seed, the year of his MVP, to the 8th seeded Warriors. Sure, an embarrassing loss. He should have already had a ring the prior year. The Wade treatment that Finals is the 2nd most blatant ref bias I've seen in the NBA in the last 2 decades - the Lakers/Kings 4th quarter game 6 that ended with the Horry three pointer being the most obvious. Don't get me wrong, his actual performance wasn't all time playoff great... but Dirk, if I recall, actually generally was as good in the playoffs as he was in the regular season. It's a tough way to measure, because even though Harden once again was CLEARLY a lesser player in the playoffs, was that lesser player still better than Dirk typically was in the playoffs?? Maybe... I don't know. There's all kinds of analysis and eye test comparisons that can be made, I guess. There's certainly not a 0% chance Harden wins a ring as 1a in Houston over the next 5 years. But every year that % goes down and down and down
But why just game 6? What about the 5 other games? It feels unfair to me that Harden shows up for 6 games but CP gets a pass for showing up for one game. Game 5 CP3 had all the opportunity to put the Warriors away instead in the 4th quarter he was terrible. Remember the Denver-Portland 4 OT game? Dame was terrible. It was CJ that carried that team. It was also the coach that decided fresh legs would help them out and subbed in Rodney Hood. I get what you are saying, I agree with it, but my thing is there really is nothing wrong with it and at least your question is on his mentality and not his skill. The mentality can certainly change, it's on the coach to help change it. The hard truth is that CP3 has been a major bust for the Rockets and unless DM pulls magic out of a hat Harden won't be winning a championship. That's the hard truth of it CP3 is being paid to be that other all-star and he was that for one game. We paid Capela to be a key player and that series he was constantly the worst player on the floor. The hard truth is that DM has put himself in a hole and if only we had this series last year then maybe we let both CP and Capela walk.
Too many times I've watched Harden defer in big moments. We've defended him to death on these boards, on Twitter, Reddit, whatever mountaintop we could find. Game 5 and 6 vs Warriors were just inexcusable. Walking the ball up the court, getting into motion with 6 seconds on the shotclock, turning it over, settling for 3 after 3 after 3.... Right now, he's a more efficient Westbrook. His ceiling is higher, but it's not championship level. Not as currently constructed. I was convinced Harden could do it but he can't. Leonard is better. He's just a more effective piece for winning titles. Harden is better at highlights and scoring titles. Is what it is.
why game 6 because that's what just happened? I mean it was 2-2. that's as good as you can ask for playing this great team everyone is referencing right. cp3 may have been bad in game 5 which goes back to what i posted. ok harden, you see cp3 isn't executing. go be you then and will your team to a win for a stretch of a quarter. Im not going downplay how good harden can be. he's already proved that in the regular season time and time again. that's probably the root of my frustration. I guess you're maybe right, it's more of the mentality
DM had to go for it because it's hard getting stars but in the end he takes a lot of blame here and the owner as well. DM has a very particular style of ball and it did cost us. Having the lack of bigs we have is entirely on Morey. The lack of length on this team end up hurting us a ton in this series because this team, this franchise, puts all of its emphasis on shooting and hitting 3s. I love Morey but he does need to reconsider his math and he needs to have a basketball guy in his ear telling him that toughness and size is always valued in the playoffs. You are right that this upcoming offseason is tough. Not much we can do this year. But Morey has a tendency to go after guys no one thinks are even available so...let's see what happens.
There mindset is fine but I find it hard to believe that harden and the Rockets would even need 7 games to beat Denver it Philadelphia. Especially Denver, would have won in 5 tops and prob in all blowout fashion. We screwed up should have won the okc game and we would be playing GS right now. With that said we just didn’t get it done and we should have last year and this year. It is what it is. Morey rarely stays idle I’d imagine he’ll make something happens that improves the team or at Least shakes it up. Clint EG and picks is what is on the table imo for a major upgrade. And everyone outside of harden is on the table for AD.
All of those games cost the same though? It was 2-2, could have been a sweep if CP3 and Capela showed up.
