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CP3 vs. Bev (defense only)

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Clown Baby, Nov 19, 2017.

  1. Sidarma

    Sidarma Member

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    Cp3 is offended
     
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  2. Houstunna

    Houstunna The Most Unbiased Fan
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    Agreed. Williams is also useless on one end.

    Last year, Rockets were 12th in the West in Points Allowed. This year we're 6th, with Paul only playing 20% of games.
     
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  3. SirIvyLeague

    SirIvyLeague Member

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    So clearly it's not Paul making that difference but losing Bev and Lou, and adding PJ and Luc.

    SiL
     
  4. SirIvyLeague

    SirIvyLeague Member

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    Bev I think is the better rebounder.

    SIL
     
  5. Houstunna

    Houstunna The Most Unbiased Fan
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    No doubt. And Paul will allow our jump from 6th to higher.
     
    #45 Houstunna, Nov 19, 2017
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2017
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  6. SirIvyLeague

    SirIvyLeague Member

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    I imagine our schedule gets tougher, so no saying.

    SIL
     
  7. Houstunna

    Houstunna The Most Unbiased Fan
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    Looking their career stats, if either is better, it's Paul.
     
  8. Houstunna

    Houstunna The Most Unbiased Fan
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    What point are you making? No one said Paul was the ONLY factor in our defensive improvement.
     
  9. SirIvyLeague

    SirIvyLeague Member

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    That improving isn't a given. Oh add Paul, now we're better defensively. We'll be better than 6th. It's not linear.

    We'll be better from an absolute standpoint. Relative to the league, too many factors.

    That's my point. Thats why rankings are ****. And saying otherwise means you follow Doo Doo.

    SIL
     
  10. SirIvyLeague

    SirIvyLeague Member

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    Oh then I'm wrong. I always thought only RWB and Rondo were better than Bev rebounding wise. Didn't know Paul was on par.

    SIL
     
  11. Houstunna

    Houstunna The Most Unbiased Fan
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    LOL. Tomorrow isn't a given.

    Considering everyone's history, there's an excellent chance the defense will be even better with Paul.

    Same way, coming into the season, there was an excellent chance defense would be better with the additions/subtractions.
     
    #51 Houstunna, Nov 19, 2017
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2017
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  12. Air Langhi

    Air Langhi Contributing Member

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    I think rockets fans over value their scrubs too much. People thought giving up Bev, Lou, Harrel, and Dek was too much for paul?
     
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  13. YaoMing#1

    YaoMing#1 Member

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    As of right now NBA.com has the rockets at 2 in ORTG and 8 in DRTG. With a net of 8.8

    The warriors are 1 in ORTG and 4 in DRTG with a net of 13.1.

    The warriors are the cream of the class forsure but the rockets really are the only threat and the advanced stats back that up.

    Ironically the 3rd best team might actually be the Toronto raptors there 4 in ORTG and 11 in DRTG.

    They are the team to look out for, they have some nice pieces and Lowry isn't even playing well.
     
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  14. cerophilik

    cerophilik Member

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    I never saw giving Dekker Harrel Witjer or Lou was giving too much. I knew I would miss Pat coz he always gave his all but Paul is much better. So it was a win for us. And getting Luc and Lucker was great for our defense.
     
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  15. Mathloom

    Mathloom Shameless Optimist
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    Wow, I'm pretty shocked. I have not been impressed by Paul's defense the last two games since we have played a couple of teams with garbage at PG. That's to say: he's been excellent, but he has not performed better defensively than I project Bev would if he were surrounded by this supporting cast that is defensively far superior to last season's defensive guys.

    Paul is CLEARLY a better leader on defense, helping others around him. Bev was always of the mindset that he needs to do his job and everyone else's defense is kinda their business - and that can largely be attributed to not wanting to tell Harden he's failing all the time. Paul can do that because he's a superstar - which works out well for us. As far as actually playing team and individual defense, Bev was as good as Paul has been in this tiny, rusty sample size imo.

    Just going by the eye test though. Do any of the advanced defensive statistics take into account how good/bad the team's defense is? I ask because year in year out I see the rankings by advanced defensive stats, and there are always these players having total outlier seasons and you can quickly deduce that it is highly correlated to their team's defensive improvement or regression. It matters a lot. Rudy Gobert or Kawhi Leonard or Draymond Green would look mediocre if they were on the Suns. Just about the only thing Doc Rivers is good at is getting his team to play defense - which would help Paul - and MDA is a terrible defensive coach - which would hurt Bev.

    If it's true then we should see a dip in Paul's "defense" this season while Bev's should at least hold up. This will, of course, send the BBS into a meltdown because they will think it has to do with Paul's age.
     
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  16. Mathloom

    Mathloom Shameless Optimist
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    Consider the fact that we have played all but 2-3 games without Chris Paul - that makes our numbers even more impressive.
     
  17. HewbieTrippin

    HewbieTrippin Member

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    Beverly is better at defending only at very specific scenarios (like the one on Russ in the regular season to close out the win). His innate aggression on the ball, lateral movement, tenacity really do bother good/great players at certain times. However, he gambles WAY TOO much in my opinion to be a consistently high level defender. But it's part of his game overall. He goes for the home run defensive play, but he also gives away easy penetration/driving lanes/plays for opponents' big men for being so overly aggressive.

    I first began to see a case for Bev's defense being "overrated" when run of the mill pgs were getting by him due to his gambling for steals. I'm not saying he's a bad defender, just that he's kind of inconsistent. Sometimes he makes plays that no other player can seem to make, but others you're scratching your head at his antics for constantly screaming at the crowd, beating his chest, and proceeding to get scored on. I just wish he had the resolve in his mind to see the next play like Chris Paul does.
     
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  18. Liberon

    Liberon Rookie

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    A few seasons ago I mentioned that CP3 when healthy and mentally tuned was a better overall player than Harden. I know Harden is breaking all sorts of pressure but the ball should be in CP3's hands during critical post season play when Harden will want to ISO and set himself up. CP3 should be the floor general in those situations setting up Harden and others.
     
  19. riko

    riko Member

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    Few seasons ago he may well have been, but currently Harden is on lebron level. As good as CP3 is, Harden is another level.That said i think CP3 should have the ball and create for Harden and get him in his sweet spots so Harden can finish the game.
     
  20. Exiled

    Exiled Member

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    if there's one area PB is better, it would be at making crazy facial expressions
     
    #60 Exiled, Nov 20, 2017
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2017
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