BBALLBREAKDOWN: Is James Harden Breaking the NBA Rule Book?

Do you think it's a foul on Harden if he grabs Gibson's wrist and yanks him out of the way?

The hook is the same thing.

Yes, because the offensive player is taking advantage of the defender being out of position. In the example we're talking about, how is Gibson out of position?

 

Looks like a terrible defensive scheme. The ball-handler would simply need to jump through those extended arms in order to draw a defensive foul.

 

You can move their arms, but not to the extent that you're dislodging the person from his position.

 

His arm is out

 

The shoulder drop i think you mean, yeah that was an offensive foul

 

Then Harden needs to run through it instead of grabbing it and yanking Gibson out of position. Force the refs to make a legit call that won't be criticized by former officials and social media.

The reason I'm making a big deal out of it is b/c while we may get that call against OKC, I don't think we'll get it against SA. Against GSW, I wouldn't be surprised if it's called an offensive foul.

 

Too lazy to rewatch the video. From what I recall, the offensive foul thing was about the arm hooking act. The after thought comment was about shooting foul vs non-shooting foul, not offensive foul.

 

this is really obvious...It's just a matter of whether he is going to continue to get calls until next year, or whether it will change during the playoffs..

 

I think the point of contention is that Harden hooked Gibson's arm. He could have just gone up and shoot. Remember Nunn made a big deal about shooting with one hand? His point was that if Harden was really trying to shoot, he should have gathered the ball with two hands. Instead, Harden's left arm was used for hooking Gibson's to draw the foul, rather than gathering the ball to shoot.

To me, the debate should be whether Harden's motion was intentionally grabbing Gibson's arm or was impeded by Gibson's arm while shooting.

 

I'm willing to bet Pat Bev could guard Harden and avoid getting this called against him. Watch Pat. He keeps his hands Back but leans forward and calculates when to make a quick reach...key is though the hands are back by default. He keeps an extra wide base at his feet too to compensate for the lack of lateral coverage that extended arms provide.

Here's a great vid on it by the same ppl

Tells me that Hardens technique can be countered so grow up everyone. You can't change rules because it doesn't favor your team - especially to the point of punishment. Although I do concede, I'm not sure if this is a shooting foul. Foul should really only count after shot begins the thrust up and out.

 

because teams think they can get physical with harden and take him out of the game by doing so in harden says **** that

I remember the Warriors and the clippers did this to harden in the playoffs and it worked but I am glad he found a way to punish the defenders who were playing illegal defense by making the refs called these hand checks. Let's just see how they called them going forward because I have a bad feeling after this video.

 

quoted because deserves it and idiots need to see the rules so they know Harden is not breaking anything in fact he is just punishing poor defense in the maximum capacity

 

almost 10 pages in and we are still arguing about The hand check rule. I swear it's common basketball knowledge if you're an nba fan

I would not expect thunder fans or warriors fans or hell even Lakers bandwagonners, thunder to unserstand but I expect more from the Rockets fan base especially clutch fans

you guys want to play football and clothesline people go ahead but I don't even think that's legal in football


its mainly just a couple of posters but a lot here dont like it and I'm sure you guys loved it when the Warriors and the clippers played illegal defense against him in the playoffs using handchecks and getting "physical" nonstop

 

Perfectly said.

 

In today's NBA, if your arm is extended outside your body's frame (basically anything but straight-up) and you make contact with an offensive player - the foul is on you.

They don't call the foul on Harden because the defender should not have had their arm there in the first place. Kapesh?

 

Harden shouldn't be penalized for being smarter and more disciplined than the defender just as we shouldn't reward the defender for being a shitty defender.

 

Is it really necessary to give him an offensive foul in number 1?

This move should still be justified under the same rationale as #3, baiting a player to reach and then schooling him. When he hooks, it is done coming off a high screen with the defender usually reaching out, which is a violation of impeding the offensive player's vertical progress when defensive position is unestablished. Except here, It's the pick in combo of Harden's play that baits the defender into sticking his arm out.

It only makes sense that this be a defensive foul but maybe not shooting. Definitely not an offensive though.

 

I think the hook should be interpreted as an offensive foul because of what Nunn says at 5:15-5:32.

Whether that's true based on the current rules or not, I'd like to see it legislated that way in the future. Ultimately the NBA is an entertainment business, and things like this encourage ugly basketball that makes my experience less enjoyable. Drawing these hooking fouls may exploit the letter of the law to Harden's advantage, but it goes against the "spirit" of the game of basketball, in my opinion.

And just to be 100% clear, I'm only referring to plays where James hooks the defender's arm and then goes into a secondary motion to attempt a shot (often with his off hand). I have no problem awarding a shooting foul if Harden is going up through a defender's arm with a natural shooting motion when their arm is in his shooting pocket.

 

It's absolutely a judgment call by the official as to any "shooting" foul and the officials are to blame for this garbage by Harden.