Mack had always been a fraud. His title was the head football coach but I am not sure he ever actually coached anything. His bread and butter was his snakeoil salesmanship that lured young athletes into his program. Remember he was begged into taking VY by Tim Brewster, and VY didn't become VY because of Mack, but in spite of him. McCoy was pure lightening in bottle that Mack lucked himself into. McCoy was a 3-star from a tiny town and was destined to be the backup for that loser Perriloux. Mack really had no eye for talent. He was relying on the recruiting agencies to tell him whom to recruit. If a certain recruit has 4 or 5 stars next to his name, that's who Mack will go after. Barrett practically begged to become a Horn even after Swoopes had committed, but because Mack didn't wanted another QB controversy, he just never bothered. Same thing with Manziel, although I'm glad he was never our QB at Texas due to his personal issues. Luck was another who had really wanted to come to Texas but Mack set his sight on GG so far in advance that he did not take a QB in that cycle. Mack lucked himself into a great situation at UT, but in reality he's a worthless POS who's gotten paid millions by just being buttertooth. His mismanagement of the entire roster, not just QB, is really quite epic. He left Strong with no OL, no QB, no receivers, no RB, and very little defense. Mack couldn't hold Strong's jockstrap when it comes to coaching. The only silver lining in Mack not taking any of those good QBs is that it paved the way for his firing. I am just so sick and tired of my beloved Horns being called soft and entitled for so many years. May the Strong Era being. Hook'em!
This is a really stupid post. So Mack lucked his way into a good situation but started his nine year span of 10+ wins after Mackovic recruits were gone. It was 12 straight years of 9+ wins. He took two entirely different teams to the championship game.You can say a lot about the mistakes Mack made in the last 4 years but to say he had always been an awful coach whose teams were good despite him is just very stupid. Swoops was really good and everyone was excited about him. He had offers from Notre Dame, OU, Alabama, Auburn, Oregon, Stanford, A&M and a slew of others that didn't offer to Barrett. He had a good arm, was fast and strong. It just didn't work and Barrett turned out to be the better player. You can knock Mark for a good amount of things but being an awful coach isn't one of them.
Why am I not surprised to find Mack apologist outside of Longhorn boards? Ask yourself, was Mack ever considered an elite coach? or even just a good coach? He was being called a CEO who delegates responsibility for a reason. The landscape of college football when Mack first took over the program was much different then. No other team in the conference was able to accumulate talents the way Mack could, that I give him. Not OU, not Nebraska, not ags. His first couple of years were arguably his most successful ones (outside of 05 and 09), because he had John Blake coaching OU and Frank Solich at NU. Those guys simply could not compete with the talent Texas had amassed. And even though we had same or equal talent to OU under Stoops, we were consistently getting blown out by them. We had an overall talent advantage over KSU, but were also consistently getting beat by them. Outside of those two, we gave a beatdown on teams who were not even close on the talent level as us, the likes of Colorado, Missouri, Baylor, and Tech of the world. We all know Mack can't coach defense; he relies on his DC to carry out defensive duties. But when did you ever see him coaching the offensive positions? Did he ever call any plays or map out a strategy of any kind? He tied his hips to GD until we got sick of his bubble screen and finally ran him out of town. Once GD was gone, we had even less of an offensive identity, which is why we couldn't recruit players to our system, because we had none. Really, throughout his tenure, pretty much the only thing I saw Mack did during the game was to clap his hands on the sideline. If that makes you consider him a good coach, then I don't know what to tell you.
Oh, and also, anyone who says Swoopes was really good after his team finished 1-9 his senior year in tiny 1A football just lost instant credibility to me. I love Swoopes for his heart and dedication to the program, but he was never going to make it as a QB. This is yet another proof that Mack was a piss poor talent evaluator. Just because you have the measurables doesn't guarantee you to become a good QB. Buchele's measurables doesn't come close to Swoopes, but he's already a better QB as a freshman than Swoopes will ever be.
Yeah, you dont have to like Mack, but you have no clue what you are talking about. Mack did get lazy and complacent his last 4 years. Thats true and I have no issue with what you are saying if you apply it those years. He didnt evaluate talent well and left us with a gaping hole at QB and then tried to find quick fixes when such a thing wasnt possible. But prior to that he was one of the best coaches in the country. He was known as an elite recruiter who couldnt win the big game...till he did. Dont forget we beat Ohio State twice and an all time USC team. You seem to take issue with the fact people called him a CEO. Well, at places like Texas, Alabama, Ohio State, Notre Dame the head football coach has a lot of additional responsibility to go along with privilege that makes them just like a CEO. It has more to do with the position than the man. I get your QB issues, though I wouldnt want Manziel full knowing he would win a Heisman. Gilbert and Swoopes weren't bad takes, but it was bad being 100% dedicated to them without taking another QB. Luck, was absolutely not begging to come to Texas. Academics were of HUGE importance to him and when he was accepted at Stanford, it was over. Yes, we shouldve gone after RG3 and Barrett but every staff makes mistakes, and Macks ultimately cost him his job. You dont luck into 134-34 record at Texas after taking over a less than stellar squad. You dont luck into going to 2 separate NC games with a completely new team. You dont have that many consecutive 10+ seasons in division 1 football regardless of who you are playing. Is he Saban? Hell no. But he was damn good for a long time and brought a middling Texas program back to national prominence. You know there was a time during his tenure where we had the most NFL players in the league. Thats not all luck, and for you to say so is well...stupid.
I don't think Mack was elite. I actually think he underachieved considering all the talent to come through the program. But he wasn't a bad coach. Just not great.
How many guys from Mack's last 4 recruiting classes were drafted? 2014 - n/a - maybe D'onta Foreman or Jarrod Heard as a WR have a shot 2013 - none so far, a lot of these guys are no longer even on the team. 2012 - Malcom Brown, Hassan Ridgway (this was the #2 ranked class in the country, lol) 2011 - none That's not talent, that's bad evaluations and bad fits.
Are you saying he was bad at talent evaluation? Or bad at using the talent? Before VY the MO on him was he couldn't win the big games against OU or Conference championship etc. The VY class was one of the greatest recruiting classes ever. That really just changed everything.
Yes, in the early 2000's he was at the forefront, then high school football and college football changed and Mack did not change with it. Yes, after the national title season he was bad at talent evaluation, and bad at using it. Look at the last "all-Mack" recruiting class - 2013. It's a complete disaster. Rami Hammad OL - Left the team, Transferred to Baylor, arrested for rape Desmond Harrison OL - Suspended, off the team Chevoski Collins ATH - kicked off the team, last seen at Scottsdale CC Geoff Swaim TE - hey a guy drafted! juco transfer so - good eval I guess Erik Huhn DB - injuries, off the team Antwuan Davis DB - backup/special teams player Darius James OL - off the team, backup at Auburn Naashon Hughes LB - valuable starter,g Kent Perkins OL - solid starter 2+ years Jacorey Warrick WR -looks like a starter this year Deoundrei Davis LB kicked off the team Tyrone Swoopes QB - valuable contributor Jake Oliver WR - finally looks like a role player this year Jake Raulerson DE - mediocre starter, graduate transfer, now at arkansas. That is horrifying.
With the exception of the last 4 years, which were unequivocally terrible, I'm sort of torn on Mack's tenure at Texas. We hadn't won a title in nearly 30 years when he arrived, so the expectation that he definitely win and win often may be misplaced. I think he did a masterful job of getting us near the top tier of college football but wasn't great at executing once we got there. It also seemed to require an absurd amount of talent and serendipity for us to win the one title. He had to recruit what some consider the greatest recruiting class of all time, he had to be convinced to take VY as a QB, he had to catch lightning in a bottle with Colt, etc... For most of 2000-2010, his only serious competition for recruits was oklahoma. tcu and baylor weren't big players. a&m didn't have the SEC cachet. bama didn't really have a big presence in Texas. Guys like Saban and Urban Meyer would have feasted and won multiple titles. I'd say that Mack is clearly a step or two down from Meyer and several steps down from Saban.
Another Mack apologist who made a stupid post. The man wins one big one and people are willing to overlook his faults. As stated in my original post, Mack has a knack for compiling talents using his snakeoil salesmanship. That's just what he did in those early years. He also inherited a pretty decent roster from Machovic, at least much better than the ones he left Strong with. The man parlayed Ricky's Heisman year with the best recruiting class he ever had at the time, where he got both offense and defense POY in Simms and Redding. People were conditioned by Mack into believing all those 10+ win seasons are some great success, but when you look into it, that was back in the days when we had a cream puff OOC schedule, and in a conferece against foes who had huge talent gaps. Think about this, Mack won as many conference championships as Machovic did with a much longer tenure, and I'd argue that Machovic went up against better overall competition in his time vs. Mack. Mack won those years primarily with Simms, VY, and Colt at QB. Those three gave him 8/9 years combined. Simms was underwhelming, but both VY and Colt were above and beyond. VY had a much better team around him than Colt, which is why most of the big wins under Mack happened during VY's years. VY also had to tell the staff to pretty much leave him the **** alone before he became VY. Colt was just an amazing college QB, and don't tell me that the staff were high on him when they took him. He was the second QB in that class to 5-star Perriloux, and destined for back up role. Colt's team was considerably less talented, but Colt alone had masked alot of the problems we had with our roster management. This is why the dropoff is steep as soon as he graduated. I don't think anybody has called Saban a CEO, the man is a real coach whose specialty is the DBs. Neither is Meyer, or his predecessor Tressel. Brian Kelley for sure isn't a CEO. All these guys are real coaches who know their **** and what they want on the football field. Mack had no core belief in his system, he simply goes with what's popular at the time. This is why no system is ever identified with him and he grew no coaching tree. For someone who's been in the business for like 30 plus years, that's kind of a rare thing to do. He hires mercenaries like Muschamp, Diaz, and Harsin to run his team for him. Mack never had an eye for talent, it was his salesmanship that won him recruits early on. He never knew what to look for and had very little idea on how to evaluate. The guys he goes after are usually pretty random, mostly because they had alot of stars next to their names. The ability to evaluate is one skill set that you either have it or you don't. Once you have it it's not going to go away no matter how lazy you become. Mack may have gotten lazier towards the end, but he was still pushing his staff to recruit hard, as evidenced by the lofty class rankings. He still managed top 5 recruiting class in 3 of his last 4 years, but then we know how they all turned out.
It's been a few years. I think that it will be difficult to change somebody's opinion on Mack, especially his last few years here. We've got our first nationally ranked glimmer of hope in years. I'm a fan of what Charlie Strong is building.
At risk of sounding like a fanboy, I love his philosophy on dealing with these kids. Respect and accountability, he just strikes me as a really solid guy. I'm rooting for him to succeed because of that more than anything else.
Mack never strikes me as a good coach, not when he had his early 10+ win seasons (but getting shellacked by Stoops at CB), nor now that he's a commentator at ESPN. The man yaps on and on with no real substance, it's as if he's not talking football. You watch interviews with Brian Kelly, Meyer, Saban, Fisher, Harbough, those guys talk football. I think back those 15 years while he was in Austin, what exactly did he coach? I really can't think of anything he ever coached. Not on the field, and probably not much off the field. He mostly just clapped when something good happens, something that any innocent bystander would be able to do. I think people just have a short term memory. People forget how much of a struggle we had on offense post Ricky and before VY. Mack didn't know who to go with between Simms and Applewhite, and our offensive production suffered on the field. People also forget how bad we were from 10-14. The team was either uninspired or unprepared. We would quit easily once we are behind. There was no pride, no heart, and we were soft as a pillow. Those were the years that really made me despise Mack, because he had let a once proud program to become a laughingstock in college football. And on top of all that, he couldn't see his own shortcomings and refused to step down. When he finally did, he was telling recruits that he would help them to look elsewhere, all the while he was still collecting paychecks. That to me portrays a man with no honor. I call him a fraud because he was never the man that he paints himself to be. Strong is real. He's taken his lumps the last two years, having to deal with a bad hand left by his predecessor. Now that he's found a functional QB and an offensive system, I think he's building a dynasty that could rival Bama for years to come. Hook'em!
Hey, when I root for a team, it is an investment of sorts. Did you see that list of games where I rooted for OU, a team I should always hate, dating back to 2003? That's a lot of emotional energy. Besides, the safe bet clearly has been to bet against Big Game Bob in big games. I agree there's logic to what you were advising, as I followed it for years until just recently. I am proud to say I have never and will never root for A&M, even if they are playing the Devil in Hades.
So outside of his two championship years, his best years were early on in his Texas tenure? Got it. Other than that, how was the play Mrs. Lincoln?
You're not a real UT fan if you don't love Mack Brown. He delivered from out of the blue. His latter players might not have panned out, but his recruiting classes were ranked better than the best Strong class up until his last year, I believe. My UT education has prepared me to conclude that Mr. Rocketeer is a bit wacko.
Mack took a downward trending North Carolina program, blew it up and rebuilt it (2 horrible years then 8 straight winning seasons, the final 6 were bowls) and turned them into a 10 game winner, he couldn't beat Bowden and FSU though, not many teams could. He took UT from a dormant joke/afterthought to a National Champion (almost twice, or thrice if you want to remind me of that Colorado game). The guy did just a little more than stand on the sidelines and clap his hands (that's one of the dumbest things I've ever read on this board). Of course he's not perfect, I've criticized many facets of his tenure at Texas, especially the way he let it end. No, he is not an edgy interview like other coaches. If you knew anything about the guy you'd know that he is positive to a fault, he will never really publicly criticize anyone. His loyalty to his coaches is one of the main reasons he got fired, and it almost got him fired a couple of years earlier. When he's talking on tv though, get through the rah-rah stuff and listen to what he says about the actual game, he has some really astute thoughts.
