University Of Toronto Gender-Neutral Bathrooms Reduced After Voyeurism Reports

He probably sees it as a "gift." With that, I'm out of this thread. I don't need the aggravation. Unlike most of you, I actually know some trans people. They simply want to be treated with respect, no more and no less than everyone else. I suspect that "Bobby" has a problem with his sexual identity. Shakespeare put it well, "The lady doth protest too much, methinks."

 

I am seeing people say this more and more. They act like they have a better insight because they know a TG. This logic ranks up there with "I know x number of blacks, im not racist!" I dont know any TG's on a personal basis, but I have ran across from very functional TG's to the full on loony TG's. Of course they all want to be treated with respect, who doesn't? But perhaps respect should be given to the women who do not want dongs in their communal facilities.

 

Which genders use which facilities is a cultural issue and not a scientific issue. You're arguing biology that men and women are different. I agree they are but that doesn't really matter scientifically to which bathrooms they use. All of us have used unisex bathrooms and it doesn't matter to a toilet which gender is using it.

The problem with that is that these issues were kicked off by conservatives seeking to pass laws on the issues. You're reversing the order of how this issue started with some sort of tortured argument about fundraising. Have you instead considered that since conservatives where the ones who passed these laws that they are the one's who were concerned about fundraising?

 

OK, this actually is my last post in this thread. Keep working hard, Space Ghost. If you work real hard, you just might match the ignorance of "Bobby," if not the level of bigotry. Do they have stand up urinals in women's restrooms? No? They just have stalls with doors, no? So when is this mythical trans person going to wave her "dong" around in order to offend the sensibilities of the other women there? They aren't. They are already going into these facilities and using them and the overwhelming majority of women in those restrooms don't even know they are there. But hey - if it makes you feel more manly to "defend" women who don't need your assistance by making up a problem that only exists in the small recesses of your mind, go ahead. I don't doubt that you could care less if my level of respect for you goes into the toilet.

 

Ironically enough, the whole TG things is a cultural issue too. When it comes down to it, its the physiology that determines our sex. XX, youre female, XY, you're male. End of debate, sans genetic mutations. XX/XY does not determine if you prefer to play with barbie dolls over GI Joe, or prefer skirts to to pants, or prefer a pink VW Beetle over a monster truck or if you prefer a thong over boxers. Humans are not carbon copies of each other, so its a bit silly to narrow everyone down into a few perfect categories to determine someones identity.

Whats even more ridiculous is that many of these same people proclaim to back their entire belief structure behind science but yet piss all over it and redefine a persons sex based on "science has proven that everyone doesn't fall into a unique and perfect physical and psychological definition of male or female ... so we will just let people pick whatever they want, regardless of physiology, which is how we determine the vast majority of biology".

Sure, you can claim that someones sex is based on physiology while gender is based on other aspects, but we shouldn't confuse the terms. Sex is science, gender is a construct in which humans built. You can't scientifically prove a "gender" of a person.

If someone can't understand why females in the American culture would have a problem with a penis wagging around in their shower room, they should dismiss themselves from this debate.

We shouldn't be legislating bathrooms either way. The bathrooms are not the issue here. Let the respective establishment determine the rules. With legislation comes discrimination. And FFS, lets quit treating the bathroom as its some exclusive social club.

 

<s>Wow! So now you are advocating we should install urinals in female restrooms? In the event one of the .03% who actually find this weird bathroom obsession an issue? You actually want to spend hundreds of millions of dollars to redesign every female bathroom in America, if not the world.
And you want everyone else to take you serious. Here is the proverbial "LOL" for you.</s>

I misread your post. Anyways, for starters, I dont think i've ever seen anyone wave the dongs around, urinal or not. Secondly, the whole bathroom thing is a red herring. When the term "facilities" are being used, this encompasses all rooms. Since you have trouble reading between the lines, I am referring to shower rooms, not bathroom.

 

Is it the 68% of sexual assaults that go unreported, and which have not increased as a result of non-discriminatory bathroom rules being implemented?

You don't seem to understand that when the "respective establishments" are public institutions, the federal and state governments are well within their rights to legislate and sue each other over the rules they want to set.

 

Yes... let's let the establishments determine the rules.





Since "with legislation comes discrimination."

 

As for Bobby's facepalming admission that homosexuality is alright now because of the DSM--do you know nothing about why homosexuality was removed from the DSM in the first place?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/04/gender-dysphoria-dsm-5_n_3385287.html

 

He's not really worth talking to, he pretty clearly has some kind of emotional problems judging by his comments. Probably best to just let it go. You can't have a rational conversation with an emotional train wreck like Deckard.

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/22/u...ulings-seen-in-his-sacramento-roots.html?_r=0

http://www.slate.com/blogs/outward/..._supreme_court_s_endorsement_of_identity.html

 

Because it's not a mental disorder.....it can be a symptom of a mental disorder, but in and of itself it isn't. Being male and believing that you are female is in and of itself a mental disorder. It might not hurt anyone, but that's not really relevant. The dissociative thought process is what matters. If a guy hanging out at Starbucks in San Francisco falsely believed himself to be the king of England, we'd have no problem admitting that he has a mental disorder, but when a man falsely believes himself to be a woman some want to make the argument that's different. It's not. That false thinking shows a detachment from reality that can be unhealthy just like any other dissociative condition.

A person who is homosexual doesn't necessarily have any dissociative thinking, they just prefer having sex with members of their own sex versus having sex with members of the opposite sex. There's nothing necessarily wrong with that.

Anyway, I know some of you are lost causes and this will fall on deaf ears, but I tried to help you. If you still don't get it, you won't ever get it.

 

im not sure why you are bringing up the sexual assault statistics to me. They are relevant, just not to this topic, IMO.

Legislation gets you retribution lawsuits like in NC. Legislation gets unintended consequences.

What exactly is wrong with decriminalizing the use of any facility, if such laws are in place?

And yes, I understand "respective establishments". If the feds want to regulate their facilities one way, let them. Lets the states, local and private sector handle their own.

Why get in this pissing contest. Why do some people feel they need to make everyone, including the private sector, force their beliefs upon them?

 

No, DSM dropped transexualism as a disorder. If you are transgender and feel no distress about it, you are considered normal and healthy by DSM-5

You really are in over your head here. I suggest speaking to experts before making these terrible misinterpretations that you are using to justify your anti-transgender feelings. Your cognitive bias is in the DSM-5 by the way. So ironically, you are the one who is closer to being mentally ill, not a transgender person.

 

Idiotic rhetoric. Why not bring up hitler while you are at it?

Nobody is discriminating TG's. Is anyone trying to force them to use a unique facility set aside specifically for them? Further, the PC Bro crowd are not for unisex bathrooms. They generally still want segregation.

 

And the ICD didn't because it's pretty obviously a dissociative disorder even if the DSM bent to political pressure and removed it. When a person's thoughts are disconnected from reality, they have a disorder. Again, if a man on the side of the road believed himself to be the king of England or if he believed himself to be God then we'd have no problem calling that what it is though due to political correctness BS when a man believes himself to be a woman or a woman believes they are a man everyone freaks out when you state the obvious.

Also, I know you personally aren't intelligent enough to understand this but I'm not pro or anti tranny, I'm just stating things as they are. I'm not pro or anti anyone in any dissociative state when I point out that they are in a dissociative state. It's just fact. There's no support or opposition one way or the other.

 

I keep on bringing up the sexual assault statistics because you keep on bringing up policy that won't do anything to decrease it while you don't seem worried about things that would.

Federal law supersedes state law. And in case you haven't noticed, it's been the private sector pushing the public side more than anything else.

They're going to fight out inconsistent laws until it probably goes to the Supreme.

 

Nobody, eh?

 

Is that defined by the DSM?

Because here's what happens when you appeal to an authority you don't understand:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/04/gender-dysphoria-dsm-5_n_3385287.html

 

LOL, I actually do understand it, and I understand that they've walked it back a bit due to political pressure but the facts are still the same. Basically that's saying that "sure they are in a dissociative state, but as long as it doesn't cause them distress, it's not a disorder", they wouldn't say the same about any other dissociate state though so it's kind of hard to take seriously. Any other delusions and they feel free to call it what it is, but since they've taken so much heat for it, they bent to the PC crowd. The ICD didn't.

The problem is that you are part of that PC crowd who doesn't actually understand the reason it is a mental disorder, you just assume that people are being mean to trannies because that's what the propaganda says.