[ESPN INSIDER] Astros could trade for Soriano

[Luckyazn]

[ESPN INSIDER] Astros could trade for Soriano



Even though he strikes out alot. Soriano hits for a better avg. than Beltran, about the same HRS and Stolen Base.

Soriano:
2002 Avg. .300 39hrs 102rbi 41sb
2003 Avg. .290 38hrs 91rbi 35sb

If you could get Soriano for 10-12mil. He would replace Kent from last yr and remember we were consider Contenders before Beltran.

Biggio
Soriano
Bagwell
Berkman
Lane
Everett
Ensberg
Ausmus

[leroy420]

Only if he agrees to play the outfield. He is a horrible defensive 2B. Actually worse than Jeff Kent. Besides, it's time to give Chris Burke a shot. If Soriano agrees to play CF, then I say do it.

[ROCKSS]

They were discussing this yesterday and I dont know if hes worth that much money. He swings a great bat and has speed but his defense is terrible. The Rangers are trying to dump him to concentrate on Delgado. I would pass

[Luckyazn]

Soriano key to landing Delgado

By T.R. Sullivan

Star-Telegram Staff Writer

Center fielder Carlos Beltran is on his way to the New York Mets.

First baseman Carlos Delgado could join him unless the Rangers can free up some money by trading Alfonso Soriano to the Houston Astros.

That's one scenario that could evolve after Beltran spurned the Astros late Saturday night and closed in on an agreement with the Mets on a seven-year contract reportedly worth $119 million.

"I'm obviously very disappointed," Astros general manager Tim Purpura said. "I really thought we were going to get it done right up until the end, but we just ran out of time."

Losing Beltran and second baseman Jeff Kent, who signed with the Los Angeles Dodgers, leaves the Astros looking for offense, and the Rangers could help them by offering Soriano. The Rangers and Astros had preliminary discussions about Soriano at the winter meetings, but the Astros told the Rangers they wanted to wait until the Beltran situation was resolved. Now that it has been, sources said those talks probably will be revived this week.

The Rangers have even had preliminary talks with free-agent second baseman Roberto Alomar should they trade Soriano and not receive a second baseman in return.

The Rangers would likely want right-hander Brandon Backe in return from the Astros. But the Astros aren't likely to deal him, especially if Roger Clemens retires.

The Rangers might have to settle for minor league pitching. The Astros' two most intriguing pitching prospects are Mike Burns, who was 11-3 with a 1.67 ERA and nine saves for Double A Round Rock last year, and Ezequiel Astacio, who was 13-10 with a 3.89 ERA for Round Rock. Burns had 94 strikeouts in 80 2/3 innings, and Astacio struck out 185 in 176 innings.

The Rangers probably would also ask for second baseman Chris Burke, one of the Astros' top prospects. A first-round draft pick (10th overall) in 2001, Burke hit .314 with 14 home runs and 37 stolen bases for Triple A New Orleans last year.

[ROCKSS]

Originally posted by leroy420
Only if he agrees to play the outfield. He is a horrible defensive 2B. Actually worse than Jeff Kent. Besides, it's time to give Chris Burke a shot. If Soriano agrees to play CF, then I say do it.

His defense is terrible at second and hes played there forever, what makes you think he can play CF?

[SamCassell]

If they're going to ask for Burke and Backe, no dice. In fact, why don't we just go after Delgado and keep out young talent? He's probably no worse in LF than what we had last year, and a heck of a bat.

[NJRocket]

Originally posted by SamCassell
If they're going to ask for Burke and Backe, no dice. In fact, why don't we just go after Delgado and keep out young talent? He's probably no worse in LF than what we had last year, and a heck of a bat.

Delgado cant play LF....dont be ridiculous.

We should dish Bags to an AL contender to be a DH for some piching....go after Delgado...and trade Backe for Soriano

[Groogrux]

I'd do Burke for Soriano. I think that helps Clemens decide to return as well.

But wait, all this means that the front office had a plan B, which we all know isn't true.

[JPM0016]

Originally posted by NJRocket
We should dish Bags to an AL contender to be a DH for some piching....go after Delgado...and trade Backe for Soriano

No one would pay 39 million dollars to a DH with an arthritic shoulder who clearly is on the decline. Let's be realistic. Jeff Bagwell isn't going anywhere anytime soon.

[NJRocket]

Originally posted by Rocketman95
I'd do Burke for Soriano. I think that helps Clemens decide to return as well.

But wait, all this means that the front office had a plan B, which we all know isn't true.


RM - a plan B is something that is worked on WHILE plan A is being worked on...incase you F- up plan A...not a desperate afterthought

[Groogrux]

Originally posted by NJRocket
RM - a plan B is something that is worked on WHILE plan A is being worked on...incase you F- up plan A...not a desperate afterthought

They talked about this during the winter meetings and said they'd revisit after Beltran made his decision. That's exactly what it sounds like they're doing and that's the definition of having a plan B.

[MadMax]

Originally posted by NJRocket
RM - a plan B is something that is worked on WHILE plan A is being worked on...incase you F- up plan A...not a desperate afterthought

you're making huge assumptions here, NJ. you're assuming far more than you know.

[NJRocket]

Originally posted by Rocketman95
They talked about this during the winter meetings and said they'd revisit after Beltran made his decision. That's exactly what it sounds like they're doing and that's the definition of having a plan B.

I never saw anything where they said they were going to revisit a Soriano deal after Beltran decided....i could be wrong but i rally dont recall seeing anything like that....all I rememebr were some speculative articles in the chronicle or espn insider that a backe for soriano deal was rumored to be discussed

[steddinotayto]

As much as I would like to have Soriano on our team, I don't want to trade Burke or Backe to get him. That sounds stupid (b/c of course you have to give something to get something) and I havent' seen Burke play comfortably on the team, but I think he'll be a good player for some reason. Call it a hunch. Maybe it's because I am reminded of a lardass of a player that looked godawful stepping up to the batter's box back in the playoffs in 2001. I asked myself what the hell is he doing going up to bat. Little did I know, he turned out to be Lance Berkman.

[NJRocket]

Originally posted by MadMax
you're making huge assumptions here, NJ. you're assuming far more than you know.

true...you could be right....in fact I hope you are...I hope there was a plan B all along

[Groogrux]

Originally posted by NJ Rocket
I never saw anything where they said they were going to revisit a Soriano deal after Beltran decided

From an article posted in this thread:

Originally posted by Luckyazn
The Rangers and Astros had preliminary discussions about Soriano at the winter meetings, but the Astros told the Rangers they wanted to wait until the Beltran situation was resolved.

Sounds like a plan B to me. :)

[MadMax]

Originally posted by NJRocket
true...you could be right....in fact I hope you are...I hope there was a plan B all along

purpura's immediate comments at the press conference indicated they had been looking at other options along the way. a self-serving statement...but i doubt seriously these guys were twiddling their thumbs all day waiting for boras to call without looking into alternatives if it didn't work out. just because plan b hasn't come to fruition less than 48 hours after plan a fell apart doesn't mean there was no plan b.

now that's not to say you'll like plan b. that's a whole other story.

[Luckyazn]

Burke to me might just be another ADAM EVERETT .... .270 15hrs 60rbi guy


Soriano is a proven ALLSTAR who can hit .300 38hrs 100rbi 40sb

I think Burke and Lane are OK players but with Bagwell, Biggio going out next yr. You cant build a team around Lane/Burke/Everett those are like ROLE players.

[NJRocket]

Originally posted by Rocketman95
From an article posted in this thread:



Sounds like a plan B to me. :)

i hate you...;)

i hope something works out....im just so bummed out right now

[Groogrux]

Originally posted by NJRocket
i hate you...;)

i hope something works out....im just so bummed out right now

Hey, I'm just trying to be positive. Hard to do after one of my worst personal sports weekends ever and my fiancee losing her job today. :)

[Mr. Clutch]

Originally posted by Luckyazn
Burke to me might just be another ADAM EVERETT .... .270 15hrs 60rbi guy


Soriano is a proven ALLSTAR who can hit .300 38hrs 100rbi 40sb

I think Burke and Lane are OK players but with Bagwell, Biggio going out next yr. You cant build a team around Lane/Burke/Everett those are like ROLE players.

But Bukre COULD be a guy who hits 20 homers and steals 20 bases every year, with good defense and not all the strikeouts.

Soriano would be a great guy to have, but trading 2 of our best young guys is a steep price. If the Rangers are desperate, maybe we can give them just one and some other throw-ins.

[MadMax]

Originally posted by Rocketman95
Hey, I'm just trying to be positive. Hard to do after one of my worst personal sports weekends ever and my fiancee losing her job today. :)

are we still on for watching some football this weekend??

[MadMax]

Originally posted by Mr. Clutch
But Bukre COULD be a guy who hits 20 homers and steals 20 bases every year, with good defense and not all the strikeouts.

Soriano would be a great guy to have, but trading 2 of our best young guys is a steep price. If the Rangers are desperate, maybe we can give them just one and some other throw-ins.

to be fair...you trade for the sure thing, when you can.

i'd consider trading burke and someone else...i'm hesitant on trading backe, though. of course, i was hesitant on trading elarton, and we all know what that cost us! :mad:

[Groogrux]

Originally posted by MadMax
are we still on for watching some football this weekend??

Absolutely.

[MadMax]

Originally posted by Rocketman95
Absolutely.

where??? live??

[NJRocket]

Originally posted by MadMax
to be fair...you trade for the sure thing, when you can.

i'd consider trading burke and someone else...i'm hesitant on trading backe, though. of course, i was hesitant on trading elarton, and we all know what that cost us! :mad:

I agree....Soriano is still young enough to trade for and even if Burke turns out to be decent, we still get a good young player for him. Tough call on Backe...I think if this guy Astacio or Buchholz are ready, maybe you pull the trigger

[steddinotayto]

Originally posted by Luckyazn



Soriano is a proven ALLSTAR who can hit .300 38hrs 100rbi 40sb



Soriano's stats (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/stats?statsId=6154)

his stats across the board has been decreasing.

I don't know what caused this slide but it should be a red flag. As much as I like soriano (and I do), we should proceed with caution and not just get him as a rebound after Beltran dumped us.

[Groogrux]

Originally posted by MadMax
where??? live??

The cheapest place we can find. :)

Just kidding, Live sounds great. Haven't been there since election night. Which, btw, Saturday was a freakin' exact replica of that day. All day long, hearing that it was gonna end up roses for me and my guy, then to have it all fall apart in the end. :)

[bigtexxx]

If the deal is Burke for Soriano, there is no question that the Astros should do it. That is an unbelievable trade for Houston.

[lpbman]

assuming someone would want Baggs, I think he'd retire if we tried to trade him

[mogrod]

I don't think Soriano makes us contenders as we would still ahve a huge hole in the outfield, plus the team has yet to address the bullpen issues. If this is the big offseason move they are considering, I say don't. Like I said, it doesn't make us serious contenders so just bring in the young talent and build for a run in a couple of years. Who knows, may Burke and Tavares come in and exceed all expectations.

[shawn786]

I reallly like Tavares I say give the guy a chance... Maybe he can help my broken heart :(

[NJRocket]

But if we add Soriano....and make a minor deal for Winn, defensively, out OF isnt AS bad and our offense, all of a sudden, gains a tremendous amount of speed

[Drewdog]

I dont know enough about Chris Burke, but from what I read he seems to be the real deal. It seems like we could come up with someone else to get Soriano.

[NJRocket]

Originally posted by Drewdog
I dont know enough about Chris Burke, but from what I read he seems to be the real deal. It seems like we could come up with someone else to get Soriano.

The point is that Soriano is going to play 2B....unless Burke is switching positions, he would be on the bench anyway.

[EddieWasSnubbed]

Originally posted by NJRocket
I agree....Soriano is still young enough to trade for and even if Burke turns out to be decent, we still get a good young player for him. Tough call on Backe...I think if this guy Astacio or Buchholz are ready, maybe you pull the trigger

That's what I'm saying. Buchholz should be ready. I'm thinking that if we can get Clemens and Pettite back, and by some way Carlos Hernandez is ready to try his luck again, then I'm saying you gotta pull the trigger. I just wish we would have kept Miller.

Also, I think we should take a gamble on Omar Daal. He's pitched nearly 1200 career innings, and only given up 140 home runs.


This is all wishful thinking, but if we could make a push for Magglio Ordonez, take a gamble on Daal as a fourth starter or so, trade for Soriano, and pick up a decent bullpen guy, then I think we'd be alright. That's probably asking too much though.

[rezdawg]

Eddie, I would like Maggs as well, but I doubt Drayton wants to work with Boras again. Im sure that jackass agent would be seeking a 15 year, 120 million dollar contract.

If we can add Soriano and Winn, I think we would have a very competitive squad next year. That would be nice.

[leroy420]

Originally posted by ROCKSS
His defense is terrible at second and hes played there forever, what makes you think he can play CF?

I do believe that he did play some OF in the minors. I could be wrong about that. I think he's worth picking up for his offense, but not worth it for his defense if it's at 2nd.

I also don't want it to be done for Chris Burke. I just get this sense that he might be the next Michael Young.

[EddieWasSnubbed]

Originally posted by rezdawg
Eddie, I would like Maggs as well, but I doubt Drayton wants to work with Boras again. Im sure that jackass agent would be seeking a 15 year, 120 million dollar contract.

If we can add Soriano and Winn, I think we would have a very competitive squad next year. That would be nice.

My fault. I wasn't aware that Mags was with Boras. So, that pretty much rules out the best free agent outfielder left on the market.:mad:

[kaleidosky]

Burke is fine to deal for Soriano, because he is a sure thing and will pound the ball into the boxes. But Burke and Backe...I would say hell no at this point. Not with Rocket still a question mark. If you can get Roger to commit to coming back if we get Soriano, then maybe consider it...but otherwise, you can't even have the potential of going into the season with Oswalt, Pettite, and scrubs. Backe isnt' proven yet, but at worst he shoudl be good for 10 wins. Absolute worst. (assuming good health)

I think I'd prefer to keep Burke for his speed and defense. This team, as it stands, needs to go back to small ball. Trading for Soriano would put us in the 'tweener spot even more than we are now. But with Burke, I think we're better-built for small ball if we can get a good 4th starter.

[BSW]

Duckworth and Redding would work for me.

I don't think the Rangers are that stupid. Unless they are just looking to unload money.

I had heard in the past the Yankees were looking at wanting to put Soriano in CF. Why couldn't we?

[MadMax]

..

[Nero]

Originally posted by MadMax
to be fair...you trade for the sure thing, when you can.

i'd consider trading burke and someone else...i'm hesitant on trading backe, though. of course, i was hesitant on trading elarton, and we all know what that cost us! :mad:

Yeah, we could have had Soriano for Elarton.. LOL would anyone do that deal NOW? ;)

I think all it really means is, you don't hang onto potential when you are being offered known superior quality for that 'potential'.

Funny thing is, I would rather part with Burke than Backe.. we did fine last year with Kent's sub-par defense at 2b.. but Backe has already shown that he can do the job of a 3 or 4 spot rotation pitcher.. maybe even better..


Also, Jason Lane is already 28??? Good grief! How long are we going to 'covet' this guy's 'potential' ?? Until he's 35? Sheesh, if the guy hasn't managed to break into the bigs with the outfields we have had over the last few years.. the guy is pushing 30 already, if someone wants to give us something good in return, DO it.

I just look back at these so-called 'great potential talents' we hung onto with a deathgrip.. people like Ward and Elarton.. and we missed out on some seriously good value in return, and wound up with very little in the long run.

[rocketlaunch]

we could have had soriano for alou but he did not waive the no trade clause

[MadMax]

Originally posted by Nero



Also, Jason Lane is already 28??? Good grief! How long are we going to 'covet' this guy's 'potential' ?? Until he's 35? Sheesh, if the guy hasn't managed to break into the bigs with the outfields we have had over the last few years.. the guy is pushing 30 already, if someone wants to give us something good in return, DO it.


i hear ya on this. i really hope i'm wrong...but i think if jason lane were a real solution, he would have been that by now.

the good news is that purpura is much more from the player development camp than hunsicker was.

[NJRocket]

Originally posted by Nero

Also, Jason Lane is already 28??? Good grief! How long are we going to 'covet' this guy's 'potential' ?? Until he's 35? Sheesh, if the guy hasn't managed to break into the bigs with the outfields we have had over the last few years.. the guy is pushing 30 already, if someone wants to give us something good in return, DO it.




EXCELLENT post

[ArtV]

A few of questions...

If I read the article correctly aren't they asking for Burke and a couple of other minor league pitchers (not Backe)?

Would Soriano be any worse then Craig in LF?

Wouldn't it still be professional to deal with Boras to try to get Magglio?

[MykTek]

Elarton was a complete bust, but didn't he have a serious elbow injury or shouder or something.....and as for Ward....if I remember right he started one full season and batted like 275 and had like 15 hrs....and the astros thought that was all they would get out of him and traded him....

I think Ward would have been a serviceable outfielder/1st baseman .....and he provided power off the bench....but yeah....

just think what if we did traded for Soriano back then, he was a top prospect himself at the time, not an allstar 2b .....so he could have turned out the same way.....it's just a gamble when you trade for players....

example...gambles that astros have taken in the past...drabek, swindell that were bad and johnson and clemons that turned out good....just a gamble sometimes u have to take....

Jason Lane hasn't really had a chance in the 2-3 yrs he's been in the big leagues.... i just looked up his stats, 122 AB's is the most he had...and that was last yr.....I know he's alittle on the older side, but still give him a chance....

and Burke....he seems to have the potential to be the next craig biggio....maybe if we trade for soriano, we move burke to catcher... =P

[SamCassell]

Jason Lane is a solid OF. He's not spectacular, but he's not bad. His minor and major league numbers suggest he could hit for decent average with 25 - 30 homers. And the best part is, he's cheap.

Soriano has value as a hitter at 2B, because he's better than almost everyone else there. He's basically the same as Jeff Kent that we had last season though, so I don't see the thinking. I thought the idea was to let Kent go so we could let Burke, a leadoff hitter-type guy, play and add speed and defense to the lineup. If you're looking for a LF, suck it up and deal with Boras for Ordonez. He's much better than Soriano as a hitter, and probably as a LF, and he's not going to cost much more if any per season.

[rrj_gamz]

I would only if he agreed to play CF...but even then, $10MM/year for this guy...Not sure if he's worth it...

[DVauthrin]

Originally posted by rrj_gamz
I would only if he agreed to play CF...but even then, $10MM/year for this guy...Not sure if he's worth it...

It would be a one year deal, guys. Meaning, the Astros could be competitive this year while still retaining flexibility to go into FA next year and get the other young bat they need with Lance, or just resign Soriano reasonably if they choose. Magglio Ordonez is a better hitter, but he had major surgery this year and has Scott Boras as his agent. Either one is fine on a one year deal, but Magglio on a longer deal has to be incentive laden or club optioned, if not no dice.

[MadMax]

Originally posted by DVauthrin
It would be a one year deal, guys. Meaning, the Astros could be competitive this year while still retaining flexibility to go into FA next year and get the other young bat they need with Lance, or just resign Soriano reasonably if they choose. Magglio Ordonez is a better hitter, but he had major surgery this year and has Scott Boras as his agent. Either one is fine on a one year deal, but Magglio on a longer deal has to be incentive laden or club optioned, if not no dice.

and didn't i hear that boras wasn't going to let ordonez take a physical or work out for a club??

[RocketFan007]

originally posted by DVauthrin
It would be a one year deal, guys. Meaning, the Astros could be competitive this year while still retaining flexibility to go into FA next year and get the other young bat they need with Lance, or just resign Soriano reasonably if they choose.

So let's trade two of our best prospects for a horrible defending, free swinging 2B who's contract is up at the end of the season? No thanks.

Anyone have a list of free agents for 2006?

[MadMax]

Originally posted by RocketFan007
So let's trade two of our best prospects for a horrible defending, free swinging 2B who's contract is up at the end of the season? No thanks.

you'd have to do the deal contingent on him signing a long-term deal..similar to the Randy Johnson trade.

[DVauthrin]

Originally posted by RocketFan007
So let's trade two of our best prospects for a horrible defending, free swinging 2B who's contract is up at the end of the season? No thanks.

Anyone have a list of free agents for 2006?

I wouldn't do both prospects and I never said I would, I just was saying that he would be a rental if they so choosed to do so, retaining flexibility for next offseason. I probably would do one of them and a marginal prospect, but I definitely wouldn't do two of them.

All I was pointing out is that Soriano would be a one year contract going in. Now if he demands an extension as a condition of the trade immediately, again look elsewhere.

[Oski2005]

The Astros have had their eye on Soriano to play CF for years. Remember the when we nearly traded Alou for him but Alou blocked the trade with his no trade clause?


Edit* My bad rocketlaunch, just saw that you already mentioned this.

[HillBoy]

Originally posted by ROCKSS
They were discussing this yesterday and I dont know if hes worth that much money. He swings a great bat and has speed but his defense is terrible. The Rangers are trying to dump him to concentrate on Delgado. I would pass
He'd make more sense in CF but he really believes that he can play 2B. If they can get him to move back out to the outfield then this would be a good move.

[leroy420]

Originally posted by RocketFan007
So let's trade two of our best prospects for a horrible defending, free swinging 2B who's contract is up at the end of the season? No thanks.

Anyone have a list of free agents for 2006?

2006 Potential Free Agents (http://fantasy.sportingnews.com/baseball/voices/brendan_roberts/)

[Luckyazn]

Man there's nobody on that 2006 Free agents list


So after 05'

Biggio/Bagwell will be gone. Move Berkman to 1st base, basically we need a WHOLE NEW OUTFIELD.

[RocketFan007]

originally posted by Luckyazn
So after 05'

Biggio/Bagwell will be gone

Biggio will be, but I think Bagwell has at least one more year after this season left on his contract.

[jtotheb]

Even if we were to get Soriano (and assuming we had to give up Burke) we're still going to have black holes in the 6, 7 and 8 spots. I love having Ausmus around for the pitchers, but having him AFTER Ensberg AND Everett....jeez....that's a pretty big dropoff after Bagwell/Berkman/Soriano.

[PhiSlammaJamma]

If we do bring in Soriano, how about we build Tal's ridge right behind second base to cover up any gaffs.

[Joshfast]

I think we can get Soriano without giving up any top prospects. For the Rangers, it's a salary dump to get into the Delgado sweepstakes. If there was a market for Soriano, somebody would have jumped on it but there isn't a high demand for a free swinging, poor fielding, high salary second baseman. The Cubs are rumored to pay 80% of Sosa's salary just to get rid of him.

A couple of mid range prospects will probably do it, none of our top flight ones or Backe should be touched - unless it involves some other good Rangers players....... (prays for Young, Teixeira, Blalock or Cordero)